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Binocular ramblings (1 Viewer)

Alexis Powell

Natural history enthusiast
United States
When I have the binoculars in hand, I prefer 25 oz. When the same binocular is around my neck, I prefer it to be 20oz. Can you engineers do that for me? ;)

That's what a soft-edged neoprene neckstrap does for me (Op/Tech Fashion bino version).
--AP
 

Kevin Purcell

Well-known member
I came across this url: http://www.wwnorton.com/college/astronomy/astro21/sandt/powerbinocs.html. It's pretty clear that Bishop is talking about exactly the same thing. Note in the graph he uses exit pupil as a primary parameter. Taking the square root of a product is simply a way to scale large numbers. He just uses the product and calls it the "visibility factor," which is what it is.
QED

It all ties together.

Thanks,
Ed

Very interesting link.

But I don't see it having much relevance to terrestrial bin use. Terrestrial bins are not being used to observe extended, low contrast targets in the dark using a large entrace pupil with a diffuse external light source reducing effective contrast (sky glow). Perhaps it comes closest to being applicable at twilight.

In fact in general it only applies when the eye's entrance pupil is larger than the exit pupil of the bin (under the given circumstances). And when you are dealing with diffuse skyglow that reduces the contrast of the image. In fact the article states that ;)

For characterizing bin performance in the night sky it's right on the money - I saw similar effects when describing starfields and Jovian moon observations with the budget bins.

The problem with the argument that it might apply to birding bins is birding bins have other (conflicting) needs.

Larger magnifications have:
  • narrower FOV so that worse for following closer birds;
  • larger objectives, for a given exit pupil, you need which increases the weight;
  • worse aberrations (especially for less expensive bins);
  • a smaller exit pupil makes the bin more of a pain to use;
  • more shake and so maybe more tiring for extended use;

But a higher magnification increases the amount of detil seen (up to about x10 or perhaps x12 with handheld bins and even higher with mounted bins).

Again the article points out most of these these.

Picking ideal bin parameters is not possible without reference to use and habitat. And worse still it depends on the observer (edge sharpness preference anyone?).

And yes, I've noticed the weight dilemma that Tero has pointed out too. Lighter to carry but a little heavier for good handling. The neoprene straps help a lot e.g. the 30oz Celestron Ultima DX comes with a non-stretchy around-the-neck only strap which has limited my use of it despite it being a good bin. I can't imagine anyone carrying 30oz around the neck for hours.
 
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Tero

Retired
United States
I had on a nylon one layer jacket today. Slinging the binoculars in the miss america sash style across the chest worked well. Then I changed to a thicker windbreaker with a good collar. The strap no longer would slide. A wide strap is good, but in this situation a smooth nylon strap would slide better.
 

Kevin Purcell

Well-known member
I had on a nylon one layer jacket today. Slinging the binoculars in the miss america sash style across the chest worked well. Then I changed to a thicker windbreaker with a good collar. The strap no longer would slide. A wide strap is good, but in this situation a smooth nylon strap would slide better.

I see you used "Kevin Style" in another post and now "miss america sash style". I don't think the latter will promote this style to anyone ;)

The things I find the "bandoleer style" or "over the shoulder style" carry wins are:
  • the load is on your shoulder not your neck (you can get serious injuries this way in addition to just making your back/neck tired).
  • The bin stays put where you put it and doesn't move unexpectedly (more strap has more friction in contact with your jacket/top)
  • the bin pulls just above navel height (and slightly rotated) in a ready position and stays put. It moves far less than a neck carry. It's just as easy to grab here as hanging from the neck.
  • Even walking with the bin pulled to the front it doesn't bounce around.
  • When under the arm at the waist it's protected from rain by your arm (the old non-waterproof porro trick)
  • When under the arm at the waist it's protected from getting knocked by trees/branches/rocks by your arm.
  • When under the arm at the waist you are much less likely to get hit in the teeth by the bin if you trip.
  • can can wear and use two bins this way (collectors rejoice ;) ). I've used a x6 around my neck and a x10 on a bandoleer at the same and they work quite well (for different views ... a walk with both woodland and distant marsh views).
  • it's cheaper than a harness
  • it has a retro look
  • Peter Dunne wears his Leica's that way ;)
 

Tero

Retired
United States
It was convenient enough in summer and early fall. When it gets to be winter and I am all bundled up, I will probably go to the regular style. There is much more padding around your neck then anyway. When I sit in the car, the full weight of the bins is not on the neck as they half way rest on the front part, near the belt. The bandolier style does not work in the car.

Nearly all of us have buckled seat belts over the binoculars, later to find they are inconvenient that way.
 

FrankD

Well-known member
car, the full weight of the bins is not on the neck as they half way rest on the front part, near the belt. The bandolier style does not work in the car.

Yeah, but then the objectives get fogged up because of their semi-enclosed proximity to your body.

I hate that. I really do.

[;)]
 

Kevin Purcell

Well-known member
I usually get my bins and my hat loop tangled (I have a tendency towards wearing Aussie hats). It can be quite spectacular when you need a quick look at something and come close to garroting myself!

I tend not to wear bins when I drive (and I usually bird on foot or from a bike which brings up a different set of problems that bandoleering solves too).

The misting up objectives has never been a problem for me (this isn't inside a jacket) but that might be just because I've lived in pretty temperate climates (UK and the wet side of the PNW).

The other solutions (which I tried today with the Diamondbacks which I usually bandoleer carry .... thank you Vortex for providing a long non-slip stretchy padded strap) is just over the shoulder like carrying a purse. This form of carry (which usually seems a bit insecure to be ... what if the bins slide off your shoulders) I saw mentioned in by one of folks mentioned in the book the "The Big Year" who had neck problems with a regular carry. It worked for him.
 

Tero

Retired
United States
I have occasionally carried two pairs. Then one pair is a small pair loose in the shoulder bag or on the shoulder "handbag style." For very short periods..minutes.., I have tried two around the neck, as I went back and forth between two pair.
 

Kevin Purcell

Well-known member
I find two around the neck usual leads to an interesting tangling of straps as I swap back and forth. At least for me ;)

I really should make a "Birdwatching by a Dummy" video ;)
 

KorHaan

Well-known member
I find two around the neck usual leads to an interesting tangling of straps as I swap back and forth. At least for me ;)

I really should make a "Birdwatching by a Dummy" video ;)

Op/Tech has the Reporter strap, two straps on a single broad neoprene neck piece, so in theory you can attach and use two ( smallish ) bins. Haven't seen them in practice, but tangling of straps may very well be avoided with this strap.

Regards,

Ronald
 

Kevin Purcell

Well-known member
Op/Tech has the Reporter strap, two straps on a single broad neoprene neck piece, so in theory you can attach and use two ( smallish ) bins. Haven't seen them in practice, but tangling of straps may very well be avoided with this strap.

Thanks, Ronald.

I'd seen photos of that in use and I wondered if it might work for bins. I'm still not sure but it might.

It seems to be designed for the photojounalist who wants to carry a pair of cameras perhaps one a wide angle lens and telephoto so they can grab the camera they need for the shot that appears. Pretty much what I'm trying to do too.

But it doesn't help with my hat straps ;)
 

Tero

Retired
United States
Have had very few birding days, but did see some warblers and a blue headed vireo yesterday.

I had my 8x32 Eagle Optics and I tried it with glasses and without. It is tolerable without, but with glasses even the sweet spot seems smaller. I use lineless bifocals and normally do not have a problem to get some kind of view that is not distorted. The 8x42 porros seem fine even with glasses.

I am wondering if this is a general problem with 8x32s?

Maybe I am still in search of that roof prism under 1000 8.5x42 or 8x42 with the fov of 400ft.

Naah, I have enough toys. When my eyes get worse, will test new models with glasses. Also need a better fit of glasses for the binoculars.
 

Kevin Purcell

Well-known member
By "sweet spot" you mean aligning the bin and the eye?

If so then wearing eyeglasses does make the alignment a bit more of a pain than without. It all depends on your astigmatism. I find I can now tell the difference quite clearly. That's what better bins (and spending time reviewing them) is all about.

A pair of eyeglasses for birding is a good idea.

I feel a new thread coming on!
 

Tero

Retired
United States
No, the area that is in reasonable focus seems to me smaller with glasses on. I see a lot of distortion in the 50% around the edges with glasses, where I do not see it so obviously without the glasses.
 

Kevin Purcell

Well-known member
That's probably astigmatism in your progressive lenses. Most are of the "soft transition" design today and they have significant astigmatism at the edges of the field.

You should probably only evaluate bins with single vision (or bifocal with the line out of sight). ;)
 

Tero

Retired
United States
So here I am with a collection of 8x binoculars. Two 10x42s but one is for sale.

What next? I hae not quite caught on to the excitement of ED binoculars. I do have an ED scope and I appreciate the benefit there, at over 20x.

But still, the dilemma remains. Where do I go from here? I have some room to improve with the 10x, I have the Pentax 10x43 DCF SP. I got comfortable with it sooner than the Zeiss 10x40. But I always look for more. I have a feeling it can be obtained only by the Nikon 10x SE porros or by going over $1000.
 

ceasar

Well-known member
So here I am with a collection of 8x binoculars. Two 10x42s but one is for sale.

What next? I hae not quite caught on to the excitement of ED binoculars. I do have an ED scope and I appreciate the benefit there, at over 20x.

But still, the dilemma remains. Where do I go from here? ........................... .............................................................


Take Nat "King" Cole's advice: "Ramble on, ramble on; till your ramblin' "bins" are gone!":king:

Bob
 

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