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Bird girl (1 Viewer)

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Andy Adcock

Well-known member
England
Agree with Andy. A news story is a news story is a news story.

However ...

It's a pretty positive story in a world where young birders coming through has been bemoaned as a dying situation, and as this and other stories bring to the attention, it is the younger generation who are taking the initiative in the conservation arena.


Any negativity towards individuals gets picked up on here fairly well, and anyone being particularly (or even a bit) unpleasant to Mya or her peers will only draw attention to themselves?

So what's your stance on genuine critique without recourse to nastiness, is the conversation dead in that regard?

However good a birder this young lady is, I don't know her personally and I have nothing but praise for what's she's about, however, there seems a political element to this award?

Has Mya really done enough at such a tender age to be receiving such accolades? If the target of her awareness campaign were simply the young, rather than young of colour, would she have been given this gong?

Please do not respond with claims that I'm a misogynist or racist, let's be sensible. I have two daughters of my own, I have nothing but respect for the fairer sex and would have had the same query were the recipient a boy of similar age.
 
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dantheman

Bah humbug
So what's your stance on genuine critique without recourse to nastiness, is the conversation dead in that regard?

However good a birder this young lady is, I don't know her personally and I have nothing but praise for what's she's about, however, there seems a political element to this award?

Has Mya really done enough at such a tender age to be receiving such accolades? If the target of her awareness campaign were simply the young, rather than young of colour, would she have been given this gong?

Please do not respond with claims that I'm a misogynist or racist, let's be sensible. I have two daughters of my own, I have nothing but respect for the fairer sex and would have had the same query were the recipient a boy of similar age.

I think you're now straying into the 'danger zone' which John Cantelo was concerned about above, ie discussing the worthiness of whether she is deserving or not.

Not going to get drawn in I'm afraid. And yes, it would be the same if were any particular birder or conservationist.

I guess you could bring it up with the Uni. itself?
 

Andy Adcock

Well-known member
England
I think you're now straying into the 'danger zone' which John Cantelo was concerned about above, ie discussing the worthiness of whether she is deserving or not.

Not going to get drawn in I'm afraid. And yes, it would be the same if were any particular birder or conservationist.

I guess you could bring it up with the Uni. itself?

So debate and free speech, even without offence or insult, is officially dead.
 

dantheman

Bah humbug
So debate and free speech, even without offence or insult, is officially dead.

I presumed that was the answer you wanted? ;)

Of course it isn't, but in what part of this parallel world do you think it ends well or makes you look good?



There's always social media ...
 
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Andy Adcock

Well-known member
England
I presumed that was the answer you wanted? ;)

Of course it isn't, but in what part of this parallel world do you think it ends well or makes you look good?



There's always social media ...

You mean having the balls to voice what a great many others are probably thinking and I don't really care how I look to a few WOKES whose sole aim, is to try and shame and bully people in to not having an opinion if it's not the same as theirs.

Here are Mya's words from her blog which I have just looked at for the first time.

'My big passion is World Birding & I became the youngest person to see 5369th birds in Brazil in August 2019 which was 1/2 the world’s birds. I want to combine my passion for nature & wildlife with my love of adventure to be a nature TV presenter going on expeditions to remote places, looking for rare or undiscovered species, like Steve Backshall'

This is part of her 'bio' from a bit further down.

'Mya-Rose is also involved in Youth Strikes, Youth for our Planet highlighting issues with biodiversity and species extinction and has set up a local Extinction Rebellion group.'

Anyone else see a touch of, hmmm, what's the word, .......anyway, can World birding at the rate she enjoys it, be in harmony with her environmental aims?

Good luck to her, she's bright, mature for her age and a very good self publicist, that's a compliment by the way.
 
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tittletattler

Well-known member
This young Lady has caused much debate among the twitching fraternity in the UK and already has a World list well in excess of mine, why weren't my parents rich damn it!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-51561747

OK boomer ;)

I have to agree with some of the other posters on here.

Have you ever targeted anyone else on Birdforum before? If not, why have you chosen to target a teenage girl rather than anyone else?

OK, I accept that your posts are slightly tongue in cheek, but even so, it appears that your original post is a guide for others as to the path you'd like that debate to go down and you have further pushed it down that path.

So, in the spirit of free debate:

"Andyadcock - a schoolgirl trolling gammon bully who criticises a young girl for doing the very things that he does himself, ie, World birding (per his 'bio'), but doesn't pick on anyone his own size."

Discuss.
 

Andy Adcock

Well-known member
England
OK boomer ;)

I have to agree with some of the other posters on here.

Have you ever targeted anyone else on Birdforum before? If not, why have you chosen to target a teenage girl rather than anyone else?

OK, I accept that your posts are slightly tongue in cheek, but even so, it appears that your original post is a guide for others as to the path you'd like that debate to go down and you have further pushed it down that path.

So, in the spirit of free debate:

"Andyadcock - a schoolgirl trolling gammon bully who criticises a young girl for doing the very things that he does himself, ie, World birding (per his 'bio'), but doesn't pick on anyone his own size."

Discuss.

I just love this kind of post from totally anonymous users, the ultimate, no balls troll.

I haven't trolled her, never once made contact, simply posted a BBC link and I don't criticise anyone for travelling the World doing something they enjoy unless they show the symptoms of hypocrisy, and how do you know how big I am?

People like you are the bullies, the anonymous, keyboard warriors who type furiously to condemn those who dare think differently to them.

The 'schoolgirl' is a very media savvy adult and I'm sure she's seen much more trolling on her blog or whatever, than anything I have written here. The usual little clique will be along with their frantic over reactions soon no doubt, how dare I have an opinion................!

Edit: What does the acronym 'VEM' mean?

Think I'll bug out of this forum for a bit, real conversation is impossible.
 
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tittletattler

Well-known member
I just love this kind of post from totally anonymous users, the ultimate, no balls troll.

I haven't trolled her, never once made contact, simply posted a BBC link and I don't criticise anyone for travelling the World doing something they enjoy unless they show the symptoms of hypocrisy, and how do you know how big I am?

People like you are the bullies, the anonymous, keyboard warriors who type furiously to condemn those who dare think differently to them.

The 'schoolgirl' is a very media savvy adult and I'm sure she's seen much more trolling on her blog or whatever, than anything I have written here. The usual little clique will be along with their frantic over reactions soon no doubt, how dare I have an opinion................!

Edit: What does the acronym 'VEM' mean?

Think I'll bug out of this forum for a bit, real conversation is impossible.

Except that you didn't simply post a link. You made a comment too.

I'd be happy for the MODS to change my user name from 'Tittletattler' to 'Andy Lawson'.
 

Larry Sweetland

Formerly 'Larry Wheatland'
Wow, I see from this thread that she hit the half way mark in August. I was wondering when she'd overtake me, and if that was at the beginning of that Brazil trip, or if she's been somewhere else since, then she will have done. Nice one.
 

Had.enough

Registered User
Supporter
Think I'll bug out of this forum for a bit, real conversation is impossible.

Maybe that's the problem, you are expecting too much. It's Birdforum.
Come on here, read about wildlife and binoculars, talk about wildlife and binoculars, I guarantee you will never be disappointed.

I learned the hard way, I was a complete d*ck on here for many years. I think this is my 4th account. I used my real name this time, so if this one gets banned, I'm gone for good. Last chance Saloon.

That doesn't seem to be working for you in the same way, which is a shame because I suspect many of your posts are informative. (I've had to "ignore" you, and many others in order to forewarn me, because I suspect I'll read a post off guard, open my mouth, and get my final ban! Looking at my profile, It's a tactic that has worked for 10 years, apart from the odd minor slip.)
 

Steve Babbs

Well-known member
I have no particular thoughts on Birdgirl. If my parents had taken me around the world birding, I would have been delighted. Although the whole 'world list thing' has never bothered me.

I have also had my disagreements with Andy but I do think he has been given a very hard time over this. In a properly equal world - which I agree we don't have yet - someone's sex should be irrelevant. As to being a child that is a different matter but she has chosen to go for publicity and I feel this thread is unlikely to have made any difference to trolling. Maybe I'm naive but I like to think birders are not generally the kind of ***kers who'd troll anyone let alone young girls.
 
This is a birdwatching forum, not Wikileaks. I signed up under a pseudonym to keep down the number of places on the net I could be traced by nosy employers, colleagues, acquaintances etc which seems reasonably acceptable to me. It’s not like disagreeing with the odd birder is grounds for anticipating they’ll be waiting for a scrap outside my house.
Congratulations to Mya, the more diversity in British birding (and indeed Britain) the better. I distantly remember her & her parents from my long ago brief twitching days.
 

John Cantelo

Well-known member
You mean having the balls to voice what a great many others are probably thinking and I don't really care how I look to a few WOKES whose sole aim, is to try and shame and bully people in to not having an opinion if it's not the same as theirs.

I beg your pardon? It's not being 'woke' (evidently used here as a derogatory term) to voice concern over a thread about an individual (who may not be aware of this discussion about themselves), who has been subjected to trolling and who is, despite her remarkable maturity, a vulnerable age. I'm certainly not trying to "shame and bully people" but rather avoid such a situation eventuating as a result of this thread. Although I'd not put it as aggressively nor in the same terms as 'Tittletattler', I think that he has a point.
 

Sangahyando

Well-known member
It's remarkable what sort of sentiments people are reading into the OP - the only thing I detected was envy, which is understandable. Anything else seems to me the result of previous interactions with Andy not related to this particular topic, or perhaps just projection.

On topic, IMO the girl in question could have picked a much worse hobby to spend a lot of money on. At least it (hopefully) goes into ecotourism and the like, instead of, say, the breeding of pets, or the pursuit of ecologically harmful sports. So while I'm (also) a bit envious of rich people like her, I appreciate the sound choice of occupation.


So, in the spirit of free debate:

"Andyadcock - a schoolgirl trolling gammon bully who criticises a young girl for doing the very things that he does himself, ie, World birding (per his 'bio'), but doesn't pick on anyone his own size."

Discuss.
Isn't "gammon" a racist term?
 
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Mark Batten

Well-known member
Given the huge number of individuals who do important and valuable work without recognition throughout their lives, I find this award difficult to put into context given the recipient is not yet an adult. I understand that the “birdgirl” project we’re unhappy about not receiving an invite to speak at the 2019 birdfair despite not actually applying to the organisers - this could be interpreted as having a sense of entitlement. For those adults who have taken the decision to promote “birdgirl” with a prominent media profile at such a young age there will always be negatives both in terms of child development and scrutiny.
 

Mark Batten

Well-known member
So what's your stance on genuine critique without recourse to nastiness, is the conversation dead in that regard?

However good a birder this young lady is, I don't know her personally and I have nothing but praise for what's she's about, however, there seems a political element to this award?

Has Mya really done enough at such a tender age to be receiving such accolades? If the target of her awareness campaign were simply the young, rather than young of colour, would she have been given this gong?

Please do not respond with claims that I'm a misogynist or racist, let's be sensible. I have two daughters of my own, I have nothing but respect for the fairer sex and would have had the same query were the recipient a boy of similar age.

My main observation would be that many people remain unconvinced that the actions warrant recognition on this level. Universities can give awards to whoever they like - although they are normally reserved for individuals who have undertaken important work over many years. For any child to have be even considered for such an award would have would have thought the bar would have been set high - finding a cure for cancer for example.
 

Andy Adcock

Well-known member
England


Isn't "gammon" a racist term?


I've always considered it so, like referring to some people of colour using e.g 'chocolate' which would illicit outrage. It's a term which is used against 'the enemy', white, middle aged, men who are villified by so many groups these days but the WOKE generation insist it's not a racist term so it can't be.

Given the huge number of individuals who do important and valuable work without recognition throughout their lives, I find this award difficult to put into context given the recipient is not yet an adult. I understand that the “birdgirl” project we’re unhappy about not receiving an invite to speak at the 2019 birdfair despite not actually applying to the organisers - this could be interpreted as having a sense of entitlement. For those adults who have taken the decision to promote “birdgirl” with a prominent media profile at such a young age there will always be negatives both in terms of child development and scrutiny.

My main observation would be that many people remain unconvinced that the actions warrant recognition on this level. Universities can give awards to whoever they like - although they are normally reserved for individuals who have undertaken important work over many years. For any child to have be even considered for such an award would have would have thought the bar would have been set high - finding a cure for cancer for example.

Two very well constructed responses from Mark and because they're not penned by Andy Adcock, no response is triggered, no outrage, perhaps Sangahyando has a point in his first paragraph?

I've been accused of bullying (the irony in the face of the usual ‘pile on’) and trolling whilst at the same time, it's pointed out by another irate member, that the person at the centre of the topic, is probably, totally unaware of this thread. Odd that you can bully and troll with your 'target' being unaware that you're doing it, how does that work then?

There is a small, loud group on this forum, who have a history of belittling, patronising and insulting, anyone with a different set of opinions to their own. I was hounded out of Ruffled Feathers due to their constant insults. They probably identify as 'progessive liberals' whilst at the same time, denying anyone else a voice and adding all sorts of labels to them with the aim of silencing them.

One member wanted this thread removed 'in case' it got nasty then agreed in an aside, with the insulting suggestions of another that I’m a bully, targetting schoolgirls. It did get nasty but I was the target of the nastiness as is usual from this little mob. Liberals who don't believe in the fundamental right that is free speech, figure that one out, enjoy your weekend.

Edit: I've moisturised my Nazi tatoos, the one in the middle of my forehead is looking particularly lustrous, I've put away my copy of Mein Kampf and am now sitting, watching Peppa Pig with my baby as I await the outpouring of moral outrage and various, tedious accusations
 
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dantheman

Bah humbug
Nice to see you're back Andy.

I imagine no-one has replied to Mark's comments for a variety of reasons - eg time elapsed, better things to do, lack of knowledge, not wanting to get involved etc etc apart from anything else.

I think you paint a broad brush of liberals hating you etc etc which does seem a bit weird to me. You expect people to jump on you.

A couple of other observations - there are lots of people on Birdforum, from all walks of life, interests and backgrounds. Moral standpoints, viewpoints, even criminal backgrounds. Most of the time that is all irrelevant, and people don't indicate their knitting preferences, paedophilic tendencies or admit that they support Man U. No-one is the wiser and it's mostly irrelevant in terms of discussing birding.

Andy's post above (TT) - I'm guessing you missed the irony. I guess it was a bit ott stereotyping, but hey. Humour/baiting ... don't know, taking a step back.

Personally I posted earlier in this thread, probably partly out of boredom, but also because, as I already stated, it seemed poor form to look for the negatives on a 'good news story'. (By all means ignore my comments - maybe they came across as patronising, but then so does referring to 'young Lady's' etc etc - it's only opinion after all)

It's easy to get sucked into an argument on here, sometimes.
 

dantheman

Bah humbug
Has Mya really done enough at such a tender age to be receiving such accolades? If the target of her awareness campaign were simply the young, rather than young of colour, would she have been given this gong?

Are these the main points you wish to debate, would you say? post #21
 

Andy Adcock

Well-known member
England
Are these the main points you wish to debate, would you say? post #21

Mark stated everything that will have been in many other peoples minds, I just happed to say it first and added the racial element, I have nothing more to say. Her project is laudible but why not aim at youth generally.

What is the vogue term for a 17 year old girl these days if 'young Lady' is patronising, especially when others have called her a child which she most definitely is not? Lots of double standards, not least from a climate protestor whose chief activity is World travel, perhaps she can hitch a ride on GT's carbon neutral yacht?
 
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