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Canon 7D Mk II is announced and available for pre-order (1 Viewer)

HokkaidoStu

occasional moderator
Staff member
Supporter
Soft pictures, poor battery life, high ISO not wonderful... Is anyone actually over-the-moon happy with their 7dii?
Sean

I don't think my pics are soft and am generally happy with the IQ, I wasn't expecting much at high ISO anyway (though it is better than the MK1 at least) but yes the battery life is rather disappointing.

Mind you I'm at that age where I don't get over-the-moon happy with anything much these days..................
 

HokkaidoStu

occasional moderator
Staff member
Supporter
Yesterday whilst playing I took some shots from liveview and noticed they were cleaner and sharper.

Today I did a more structured test. The results are below.

Any thoughts?

EDIT 100% crops

I guess you need another go at the microadjustment?

The liveview one does look sharper but is still pretty soft.

Mind you it is at ISO 1600, wide open with a T/C attached. I wouldn't expect that much in those conditions from my 7D2 and I just think maybe you've been spoiled by the 5D3 and 1DX (?)....................
 

Marcus Conway - ebirder

Well-known member
I guess you need another go at the microadjustment?

The liveview one does look sharper but is still pretty soft.

Mind you it is at ISO 1600, wide open with a T/C attached. I wouldn't expect that much in those conditions from my 7D2 and I just think maybe you've been spoiled by the 5D3 and 1DX (?)....................

Why would microadjustment explain sharper images from liveview?
 

HokkaidoStu

occasional moderator
Staff member
Supporter
Why would microadjustment explain sharper images from liveview?

I'm no expert on this (and I apologise if this sounds like gibberish) but I recall reading somewhere that a simple test of whether you need AFMA is to focus on something normally, switch to liveview and then refocus. You can then see how much focus changes, if it doesn't alter then it means you don't need AFMA. Something to do with the way the camera uses phase detect vs contrast detection AF................the basic point being liveview AF is more accurate and this may be what we see in your 2 pics.

Try this link, I'm sure they explain it a million times better than me.
 

GYRob

Well-known member
Soft pictures, poor battery life, high ISO not wonderful... Is anyone actually over-the-moon happy with their 7dii?
Sean

well im quite happy with it but the weather has stopped me from having a good go with it.

ff and 100% crop with pp work done 7dmkII 600f4isL mkII +1.4tc mkIII tripod and RH-2 1/320 f5,6 iso 400 one shot spot focus ,standard picture style 65 + yards away
Micro adjust was plus 10 on this but iv now gone to plus 5 after backyard testing
 

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Barred Wobbler

Well-known member
One from mid-day today at Seaton Carew. It was so dark I almost need a cap lamp.

When will the sun come out? It went in on the day the camera was released and 4 weeks later it's hardly been seen since.

A rather hasty edit. 1/1000 sec, Auto ISO, Auto WB

The first image is a crop more or less straight from the camera. No sharpening, no noise reduction at all.

The second image is the same shot with a bit of sharpening and 30% noise reduction in Neat Image. Minor levels adjustment.

Before anyone goes off on one and says it's noisy, the ISO was 10,000. Yes, Ten thousand. That's fine by me.

The battery packed in after 44 shots today, giving 440 for the charge (against 450 estimated last night), but remember that this included those long Bulb exposures a few nights ago. Making allowance for those, this would have meant about 600 - 605 on a full charge with normal shooting.

The battery is back on charge. The testing continues.

EDIT. As a matter of interest I've added a third image. This is the same one cropped from the camera in DPP but with the DPP noise reducion not disabled, ie at the default settings of 20 in both luminance and chrominance. No sharpening applied. No levels adjustment.

I've not taken much notice of DPP settings before I got the MkII because I just opened my RAWs directly in Photoshop Elements.
 

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Marcus Conway - ebirder

Well-known member
I'm no expert on this (and I apologise if this sounds like gibberish) but I recall reading somewhere that a simple test of whether you need AFMA is to focus on something normally, switch to liveview and then refocus. You can then see how much focus changes, if it doesn't alter then it means you don't need AFMA. Something to do with the way the camera uses phase detect vs contrast detection AF................the basic point being liveview AF is more accurate and this may be what we see in your 2 pics.

Try this link, I'm sure they explain it a million times better than me.

Thanks Stu - you learn something new everyday :t:
 

James Eaton

Trent Valley Crew
Soft pictures, poor battery life, high ISO not wonderful... Is anyone actually over-the-moon happy with their 7dii?
Sean

I'm happy so far with mine. I'll try it further next week though in some harsh rainforest conditions. The AF is excellent, a big improvement on the mk1, ISO appears better, though not fantastic and the focus point switch is fantastic.
The main drawback for me is the battery - the 7D lasted forever compared to the 5D mk3, and this seems worse than that even.

However, something to bare in mind when comparing the the 5Dmk3 etc - the 7Dmk2 is a budget DSLR in comparison, it's almost half the price of that so there is only so much improvement that you can expect over the 7D mk1. You can't expect the sharpness and quality of the 5D for the price the 7Dmk2 is (outside of the UK at least!).

I'll post my results after I've returned from a week in Indonesia.

James
 

Roy C

Occasional bird snapper
Why would microadjustment explain sharper images from liveview?
Have you not come across the DotTune method of MA'ing Marcus? a brilliant way of micro adjusting using live view as a starting point, I have done all my lenses using it. Here is a link the the thread on Fred Miranda where it first appeared http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1187247/0. 27 pages on the thread but the method is outlined early. This gives an accurate MA in 5 minutes or so.
 
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Marcus Conway - ebirder

Well-known member
Have you not come across the DotTune method of MA'ing Marcus? a brilliant way of micro adjusting using live view as a starting point, I have done all my lenses using it. Here is a link the the thread on Fred Miranda where it first appeared http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1187247/0. 27 pages on the thread but the method is outlined early. This gives an accurate MA in 5 minutes or so.

Yep I dot tuned on the rook attached previously (before the shot). Same crappy results

The results were +1 for a 500 and 1.4x and -1 without the converter.
 
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Marcus Conway - ebirder

Well-known member
Have you not come across the DotTune method of MA'ing Marcus? a brilliant way of micro adjusting using live view as a starting point, I have done all my lenses using it. Here is a link the the thread on Fred Miranda where it first appeared http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1187247/0. 27 pages on the thread but the method is outlined early. This gives an accurate MA in 5 minutes or so.

Plenty on Fred Miranda with similar problems to me http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1331722/5#12710580
 

lewis20126

Well-known member
I think I'll pass at the moment - next trip over Christmas has ten days camping in Darien with no electricity. The 7DII doesn't seem the obvious choice..

cheers, alan
 

tdodd

Just call me Tim
Yep I dot tuned on the rook attached previously (before the shot). Same crappy results

The results were +1 for a 500 and 1.4x and -1 without the converter.
Based on experience of other bodies (I don't have a 7D2) I think +1 and -1 are such minor adjustments that they fall within normal shot to shot variance.

With the 7D2 and live view AF, I assume the camera uses the on sensor phase detect system, which would be mm perfect and not require any AFMA.

Conventional PD AF, without live view, is going to suffer from variations in light path to the AF sensor vs the image sensor, for which AFMA is the normal compensator, but that still leaves you with an open loop on feedback and the minor inaccuracies in electronic focus instruction from the camera vs mechanical focus execution by the lens, which give rise to the shot to shot variance.
 

Marcus Conway - ebirder

Well-known member
Based on experience of other bodies (I don't have a 7D2) I think +1 and -1 are such minor adjustments that they fall within normal shot to shot variance.

With the 7D2 and live view AF, I assume the camera uses the on sensor phase detect system, which would be mm perfect and not require any AFMA.

Conventional PD AF, without live view, is going to suffer from variations in light path to the AF sensor vs the image sensor, for which AFMA is the normal compensator, but that still leaves you with an open loop on feedback and the minor inaccuracies in electronic focus instruction from the camera vs mechanical focus execution by the lens, which give rise to the shot to shot variance.

Maybe but it doesn't explain why 95% of images are soft.
 

tdodd

Just call me Tim
I was responding based on the single pair of images a couple of posts earlier. Dot Tune is not perfect IMHO and will lead you astray if your focus is not perfect when you set up your test target. It also has an extremely generous tolerance in my experience and will confirm focus over such a wide range of AFMA values that, even if you do pick the middle of the range, who is to say that the camera won't confirm focus when it is a few clicks away from that centre value? For this reason I do actually prefer the Focal software over the Dot Tune method, but I don't think there is a magic bullet as the real world always strives to trip you up. It does me at least.

You also have to consider the lighting conditions and subject distance at which you calibrate vs the actual lighting and distance at which you are shooting. The more similar they are the more robust your results ought to be. Then you also need to consider the simplicity of flat test target vs a complex and contrast free subject. What you achieve in "lab conditions" may not translate perfectly to the real world. As I said earlier, -1 and +1 are nothing - IMHO - and I would be looking to double check any calibration performed.




By the way, I haven't read the thread, but there may be a few opinions and ideas here - http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=1406704
 
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lewis20126

Well-known member
Thank you so much for the link. Seems there are hundreds of us suffering. Thought I was going mad! Anyway I contacted Canon earlier today so lets see what happens.

I liked the recent post on the linked thread: "boy oh boy, the 7D2 seems really hard to use." Another reason why this low-tech user will be passing! Good luck everyone.

cheers, alan
 

John Oates

Active member
I'm happy so far with mine. I'll try it further next week though in some harsh rainforest conditions. The AF is excellent, a big improvement on the mk1, ISO appears better, though not fantastic and the focus point switch is fantastic.
The main drawback for me is the battery - the 7D lasted forever compared to the 5D mk3, and this seems worse than that even.

However, something to bare in mind when comparing the the 5Dmk3 etc - the 7Dmk2 is a budget DSLR in comparison, it's almost half the price of that so there is only so much improvement that you can expect over the 7D mk1. You can't expect the sharpness and quality of the 5D for the price the 7Dmk2 is (outside of the UK at least!).

I'll post my results after I've returned from a week in Indonesia.

James

I'm very happy with mine. I don't have any issues with battery life - currently using an old non-Canon battery and I've taken 1355 photos with it on this charge.

I'm still amazed how good the noise control is at high ISO and I love the fast autofocus. For me it is a big improvement on the original and I'm really looking forward to using it on my next trip. I find I'm looking at lots of my old 7D photos and thinking if only I had the 7D ii on those trips.
 

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