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DCF ED vs. Alpha's? (1 Viewer)

Swedpat

Well-known member
I am quite happy with Pentax optics. Like I said earlier, I own the DCF ED 10x50. I also own several of the Pentax XW eyepieces for my scope.

Hi!

I have had a Pentax 8x43 DCF SP. Great bin, though I sold it when I bought a Swarovski SLCNew 7x42B. It was no doubt that the Swarovski outperforms the Pentax in every respect. But then I am looking for a 10x50 as a complement. Yes, there is the SLCNew10x50B. But this glass is quite expensive and heavy...

Do you have any experience about the optical difference between Pentax SP and ED serie?

Regards, Patric
 

FrankD

Well-known member
Don't get me wrong on my opinion of Pentax products. I have the little 65 ED scope with the XW 20 eyepiece and I am truly in love with it.

;-)

I have owned the 8x32 and 43 mm SP, the 8x33 XP, the 8x36 HS, the 8x43 HRC, the 8x40 PCF and the 8x42 HR II...at one time or another. In general I was very satisfied with their performance vs. price ratio. I still would be if I owned either of the SP bins.

Give one of those ZR a try when you get a chance STD. You might be a bit surprised in their performance vs. price comparison.
 

stereotruckdriver

Well-known member
Patric, I have the SP 10x50 & 8x32. In the ED's I have the 10x43's. The first thing the ED's display is a bright natural color very hard to distinguish it from the Nikon 8x32 SE I have. They are a touch sharper than the SP's with excellent contrast. I thought they did a better job at resolving distant object's better than the Swaro slc 10x42, hence that is why I purchased them! I think the 10x50 ED's would be an excellent companion to your 7x42 slc's, they don't have a large fov mind you, nothing like you're 7x42! If I had to keep just one of my collection it would be my 10x50 SP. Though I wish it were the ED version! I think Bobinky can weigh in a little more about the specific's of the DCF ED 10x50. One word of caution in regards to the ED's they will not feel near as robust as your Swaro's! This was one place I needed to get use to when using my 10x43's, not that they are not built well just alot lighter! It doesn't bother me in the least now quite comfortable. Bryce...
 

Swedpat

Well-known member
Patric, I have the SP 10x50 & 8x32. In the ED's I have the 10x43's. The first thing the ED's display is a bright natural color very hard to distinguish it from the Nikon 8x32 SE I have. They are a touch sharper than the SP's with excellent contrast. I thought they did a better job at resolving distant object's better than the Swaro slc 10x42, hence that is why I purchased them! I think the 10x50 ED's would be an excellent companion to your 7x42 slc's, they don't have a large fov mind you, nothing like you're 7x42! If I had to keep just one of my collection it would be my 10x50 SP. Though I wish it were the ED version! I think Bobinky can weigh in a little more about the specific's of the DCF ED 10x50. One word of caution in regards to the ED's they will not feel near as robust as your Swaro's! This was one place I needed to get use to when using my 10x43's, not that they are not built well just alot lighter! It doesn't bother me in the least now quite comfortable. Bryce...


Thanks very much for your reply!

Yes I know that the Swarovski is quite heavy, and actually Pentax SP/ED 10x50 are lighter weight. And though the Pentax ED likely not? completely reach to the sharpness of the Swarovski the 10x power still will make the adequate difference when I want to see more details.

Regards, Patric
 

jaymoynihan

Corvus brachyrhynchos watcher
I have recently had the DCP ED 10x50 suggested to me for dual use (astro/birds). I have not found a single review of them.
Would like to read some reviews, and would like to hear how they perform vs the Leica 10x50 HD. and, for that matter, how they perform versus the Vortex Razor 10x50 (i think they make that size).
 

Kammerdiner

Well-known member
I had the original 8x42 WP for about ten years and loved them. In my opinion, alpha sharp in the center, but trailing off fast from there. Not a big deal for birding, though. My guess is the current 8x43 ED is about the same in terms of center sharpness (?), significantly sharper off axis. The fact is, aside from the eyepiece Pentax hasn't really changed the basic design of their top of the line binocs in over ten years (same FOV, same eye relief, same basic housing--very conservative).

I now have the 8x32 ED, which is not quite as sharp as the old 8x42 WP, in the center, but is significantly nicer off center (that's the eyepiece). Other differences? MUCH nicer color, whether due to coatings or ED, or both. The old 8x42 WP's were bluish in comparison. Pentax ED really does this part right, I think, although the color may be a touch warm for some. My 8x20 Ultravids are ultra neutral in terms of color, but I actually like the warmth of the Pentax. My Nikon 8x32 SE is a touch warm too, but not quite as much as the Pentax.

Overall, I like the Pentax 8x32 ED. Very bright, great color, virtually no CA. I wear glasses and the 17mm eye relief is a tad less than I would like. Pentax has the eyepiece recessed more than Leica, Zeiss, etc., so Pentax's 17mm, in actual use, is LESS than my 8x20 Ultravids at 16mm. The Ultravids, in fact, have ~1-2mm more relief than I need. Eyecup design, as much as actual relief, is a significant issue for eyeglass wearers

The Pentax doesn't have the sublime view of the 8x32 SE's (perhaps no other binocular does) but it's a good all-around binocular. Heavy-duty housings and rubber armor for sure. I take them kayaking and don't worry about them.

I've owned five Pentax binocs over the years and have always been impressed with the quality. Always a solid, dependable feel. The Chinese bins are changing everything, though, so the future is up for grabs.

Mark
 

passerine

Well-known member
Mark
Some interesting comments about the eye relief on the 8x32 ed's. I bought a pair earlier this year after testing them extensively at last year's Birdfair. Although the 8x43's have 22mm I found the smaller model easier to use and have had no issues with them in that respect. People warned me off getting the Swaro 8x30 slc which also has a lovely image but I found those easy enough to get a good view. I chose the Pentax because the image was just that little bit sharper when aimed at the target 40 metres away. Anyone else having problems with eye relief on their 8x32's?
Regards
Jim
 

Kammerdiner

Well-known member
Jim,

I wouldn't say I have a real problem with eye relief on the 8x32 ED. I see the full field. It's just that I've used Pentax binocs with 18, 20 and 22mm of eye relief as well and they just felt a little less cramped, a bit more relaxed. The 22mm of the 8x42 was, in fact, way too much eye relief. I had to back out the eyecups to prevent the dreaded blackouts.

The thing is, in the mid-range of ER, say ~14-18mm, eyecup design is an important consideration if you wear glasses. 16mm on a Zeiss or Leica yields more usable ER than 17mm on a Pentax. Deeper cups help protect the lens but they eat up ER as well.

Mark
 

Kevin Purcell

Well-known member
It also depends how the companies measure ER. I suspect Zeiss and Leica use "effective ER" numbers (from the back of the eyecup) rather than the technically correct ER from the back surface of the lens.

I also loved your 8x32 ED write up in post #xx above, Kammerdiner.

That comment about the old WP being sharper in the center of field than the ED (or the SP in my case) has been made a few times here on BF by me and at least one other.

It seems the EP design using the aspherical lens in the ED/SP seems to trade off center sharpness for less field curvature. As I'm not the sort of guy who is too bothered by the edges (except to pay attention to a moving bird so I can center the bin) it's not a good trade off for me.

I find the ER is sufficient for me in the 8x32 WP and 8x32 SP i have though I'm a moderate myope who wears fairly close glasses.
Initially I though it was a sample variation and I though I had a poor SP but now I'm pretty sure this is by design.
 

passerine

Well-known member
Spent an enjoyable day walking around Birdfair looking through every scope and pair of bins I could get my hands on. I realise from the posts above that eye relief is a more complicated affair than I first thought. I had a good look through the Bushnell Elite 8x43 and with ER of 19.5 I thought they would be comfortable to use. It took 2/3 minutes before I could find an image stable enough to evaluate the glass and when I did I was not impressed. It was nowhere near as sharp as the view through my Pentax, I have heard lots of good things about this model and was disappointed. Onto the Vortex Razor and once again I struggled to find a workable image in a model with a stated 18mm of eye relief.
I think Mark's comments are very informative, particularly if you are going to buy without trying.
Regards
Jim
 

stereotruckdriver

Well-known member
I have the 10x43's! Spent alot of A-B,ing against others. To tell you the truth I have never regretted the purchase one bit! Some will say they lack the fov??? I have yet to come across a situation that the fov has enabled me to miss an ID or have a problem following a moving object!!! There are times when cal is present, but what glass doesn't exhibit some cal? What you get is excellent saturation of color, sharp highly resolved details!!! I have posted here as well as other forums on the brands that I compared to! If you want to spend the money $999.00 or whatever you can get them for you won't be at a disadvantage because you didn't pay $1,800.00. I never feel handicapped, I just smile knowing I didn't have to pay $2,000.00 to get alpha quality views!!! Bryce...

I guess I had to revisit and old flame.

I posted in the bargains thread that I picked up a newer 10x43 ED.

These are not the newest incarnation but they do say Ricoh on the underside so it
Is after the buyout.

While I'm not as smitten with these as I was with my original 10x ED I still think for less than $500 they are a bargain.

The fit and finish are excellent showing typical Japanese quality.

Excellent color saturation, minimal cal showing out of the fov.

Very generous sweet spot with very slight degrading towards the edge.

The image is very sharp and in fact quite pleasing.

It's been so long since I owned my original so I can't say if these are as good?

They definitely aren't alpha slayers but at the current price I think they are a good deal.

Im only referring to the 10x43 as I have no plans in trying out the others.

Bryce...
 

stereotruckdriver

Well-known member
Added a few pictures.
 

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Swedpat

Well-known member
Hi Bryce,

You wake up a thread from almost 6 years sleep! And I see that I have posted in this thread more than 6 years ago. Last year I replaced SLC 7x42 with Zeiss Conquest HD 8x42, so things change through the years.
It would be interesting to know your opinion about the Conquest HD 10x42 compared to the Pentax ED 10x43! Have you tried the Conquest HDs?

Patric
 

stereotruckdriver

Well-known member
Hi Bryce,

You wake up a thread from almost 6 years sleep! And I see that I have posted in this thread more than 6 years ago. Last year I replaced SLC 7x42 with Zeiss Conquest HD 8x42, so things change through the years.
It would be interesting to know your opinion about the Conquest HD 10x42 compared to the Pentax ED 10x43! Have you tried the Conquest HDs?

Patric

Patric,

I have not compared them first hand really never crossed my mind.

The only reason for the purchase of the Pentax ED was I had one previously,
liked it alot and saw a good deal on one.

Probably won't see alot of use by me but, nice to have a backup and let others use
as a decent loaner.

Bryce...
,
 

plc22

Well-known member
I guess I had to revisit and old flame.

I posted in the bargains thread that I picked up a newer 10x43 ED.

These are not the newest incarnation but they do say Ricoh on the underside so it
Is after the buyout.

While I'm not as smitten with these as I was with my original 10x ED I still think for less than $500 they are a bargain.

The fit and finish are excellent showing typical Japanese quality.

Excellent color saturation, minimal cal showing out of the fov.

Very generous sweet spot with very slight degrading towards the edge.

The image is very sharp and in fact quite pleasing.

It's been so long since I owned my original so I can't say if these are as good?

They definitely aren't alpha slayers but at the current price I think they are a good deal.

Im only referring to the 10x43 as I have no plans in trying out the others.

Bryce...

But they have poor eye relief, 17mm translates to 15mm by Pentax standard.
Only good if you don't wear glasses or accept less than full AFOV.
 

jmepler

It's just a flesh wound.
But they have poor eye relief, 17mm translates to 15mm by Pentax standard.
Only good if you don't wear glasses or accept less than full AFOV.

Not quite, the 8x32 DCF ED has 17mm of eye relief. The 8x43 has 22mm of eye relief. This should be more than enough for any eyeglass wearer.
 

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