Do you care where certain binos are made? (1 Viewer)

[fazalmajid]

I should have mentioned the 2 articles I linked to apply to Western companies that outsource production to China, without setting up a stringent testing regime like Apple. They do not apply to companies that set up their own production facilities in China, like Nikon (Nikon employees that happen to live in China have no incentive to skimp on quality, unlike a subcontractor for whom corners cut means more profit). It also doesn’t apply to Chinese companies that are trying to establish a brand for themselves, and thus quickly learn they have to deliver a quality product to be competitive, once again as long as they have their own workforce.

 

[Sebzwo]

Hello everybody,
I do care where binoculars are made. I would like to know please what parts are sourced from suppliers and where from (like special glass) and everything about how and where a product is made that can be shared. Especially big brands should be open about where their stuff is made and what makes it different (IF it is made different...) from my point of view.

I have no problem with stuff made by suppliers or in other parts of the world at all. This is a reality in almost all industries and can result in high quality products. But I don't want to be told "PR fairy tales" about brand images that don't correlate to the way things are built anymore.

To me it is clear and I accept it that some -say- german built product has to be more expensive with all the social system's cost associated than one made in some low cost country. I don't want to buy some expensive brand product for some high price that only appears to be made in some high cost country but in reality has been made cheap elsewhere. Unfortunately this combination seems to be typical in many modern industries from computers and cars to brand wristwatches. Some brands even don't meet their images or promises concerning quality and longevity.(I had just some expensive german brand cooking pot lose it's handle - some production welding quality problem and unrepairable)

The consumer is misled sometimes about where stuff is made and that his product in fact was made cheap and is only sold at high prices. I would clearly prefer more openness and less PR-spin. Brands should be aware that if they use mass factories like everybody else, they might save money on the production side but they might end up with essentially the same product and quality as everybody else. I would not be willing to pay more for such a brand "fantasy". This is why they MUST be different and should be willing and open to tell the world about it. It is a bit -to say surprising- to see how quiet most companies keep about topics like this these days. But the same guys flood the market with their PR-bots-lovestories about their oh so wonderful products.

So please: Bring back true crafmanship and innovation and solid made long living, maintainable products and great times will come to us optics lovers.

 

[Pinewood]

About the “chabuduo” culture:

https://aeon.co/essays/what-chinese-corner-cutting-reveals-about-modernity

About quality fade:

https://knowledge.wharton.upenn.edu/article/quality-fade-chinas-great-business-challenge/

Hello Fazamajid,

I thank you. From the articles I gather that there might be a difficult remedy when dealing with an unreliable contractor: it is not easy to break the relationship absent a more reliable firm. Setting up a business in China is fraught with two preconditions: Chinese majority ownership and the potential of lost investment. The former means chabuduo is certainly possible and the latter means the western firm cannot reclaim its investment in machinery or finance.

Apple arranges for assembly of iPhones in China by Foxconn, a Taiwanese firm. Apple get a quality product but Foxconn has the headaches. On the other hand, Foxconn has almost certainly taken Wisconsin for millions.

Stay safe,
Arthur

 

[fazalmajid]

China is very worried about companies fleeing to South East Asia, specially Japanese ones, so the ownership rules may change. It’s worth mentioning Japan had the same attitude, despite a long tradition of pride in craftsmanship:

https://honoringhomer.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/cringely.pdf

 

[Pinewood]

China is very worried about companies fleeing to South East Asia, specially Japanese ones, so the ownership rules may change. It’s worth mentioning Japan had the same attitude, despite a long tradition of pride in craftsmanship:

https://honoringhomer.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/cringely.pdf

Hello Fazalmajid,

I think that industrialisation has always been the enemy of craftsmanship. Marxism describes the alienation of workers in industrialization. Labour unions have often strived against industrialisation both to stop exploitation and to keep that pride in craftsmanship. In the USA, union workers often provide a higher quality of work, especially in building construction. In China, there are no labour unions as the west knows them.

Stay safe,
Arthur :hi:

 

[Arthur Red Rod]

That explains it. To each their own, my experience with HVAC parts are opposite.
I will never promote Vortex, sorry, never will own one, I will pay more for a glass that does not have to be serviced frequently.

Andy W.

Hi Andy, I noticed you make disparaging remarks about Vortex quality quite often. I am actually surprised because I felt like I was only one of few voices warning people about them in various online forums.

I actually had a Razor Gen 2 riflescope fail catastrophically (sheared turret) and it had horribly inconsistent lens grinding, to the point where image quality was unusable at outside of ~50% of the adjustment. They replaced the entire scope promptly and I sold it soon after, but it was disturbing to see such a high dollar riflescope not even be repairable.

I am deeply concerned that the quality of the Razor optics in all forms are "not what they used to be", or never were. What kinds of problems have you experienced with your Vortex optics?

 

[dries1]

Put it this way, different issues/things at different times, it made me realize that I had to pay more to get something that provided consistent performance day in day out. I think there are good quality mid-range products out there, but I tend to try them myself and make my own opinions/decisions over a period of time.

Andy W.