Espanola, Ontario, Canada - Ring-billed Gull? (1 Viewer)

[Bird Brainer]

Not sure what kind of Gull this is, I think it might be ring-billed, an adult and a juvenile??? November 4. 2021 Manitoulin Island...many thanks!!!

 

[rkj]

I usually avoid commenting on gulls so let us hope someone else will come along soon and set us straight, but I think you have a Lesser black-backed Gull on the left and a Short-billed Gull on the right - Short-billed being the new name for American Mew Gull.

 

[Alexander Stöhr]

Hello,
left bird doesnt look like a 1 cy LBBG that I know from Europe.
It looks more like an 1 cy American Herring Gull. If this is right (I must admit, I am quite sure it is), than its proof of excellent ID-books, the site gull-research and the experts here. Thanks to all!

 

[Microtus]

1st year American Herring Gull on the left, and a young Ring-billed Gull on the right

 

[rkj]

1st year American Herring Gull on the left, and a young Ring-billed Gull on the right

This is why I should never comment on gulls. I thought the bird on left had a wing too strongly checkered for an American Herring Gull and the bird on the right a bill too short for Ring-billed Gull.

 

[Bird Brainer]

This is why I should never comment on gulls. I thought the bird on left had a wing too strongly checkered for an American Herring Gull and the bird on the right a bill too short for Ring-billed Gull.

we are all learning! I checked on ebird, and it is out of range for short billed gull, so that is one way to check on species id. thanks anyways, all comments are important, they all can look very much alike!

 

[Alexander Stöhr]

This is why I should never comment on gulls.

Hello,
me, too. But I am very interested in Identification. And when you look at these interesting pictures and try to ID them and read the comments by others, then its helpful to gain experience.

Like you, I am sure, I eagerly await the new ID-book (it is planned for next Monday in Germany). My copy of the KMO-Gull book has already reserved a place in the book-shelf directly next to it and will sure have a crush on it. I am quite confident, this is the beginn of a new love-story.

 

[SteveClifton]

I think it's always a bit dangerous to eliminate a species on range, because on this basis, Ring-billed Gull would be ruled out where I live in Europe. Yet RBG was very much a possibility here, with an upsurge in records from the 1980s into the 2000s. Now that possibility is dwindling rapidly with a continuing drop in numbers of new birds year on year. But they are still on the radar...

Despite it's fairly modest proportions (small, slim bill) compared to some RBGs, if I encountered the smaller bird here in the UK a 'red flag' would immediately trigger because of the state of moult. I don't think I've ever seen a Common Gull L canus with so many replaced (grey) wing coverts (and at least 1 tertial) so early in the season. In fact I typically wouldn't expect to see any sign of wing covert moult until the following spring. Moult of the upper-parts would typically just involve the head and body feathers, and more obviously, the scapulars (giving rise to the grey 'saddle'). My knowledge of the North American race L c brachyrhynchus (some now consider this as a potential separate species) is rather limited, but from what I have read the same holds true with respect to moult.

Ring-billed Gulls on the other hand commonly have obvious signs of such wing covert and tertial moult very early in the season (Oct/Nov, and some even in September) so this bird appears to be a typical RBG on this basis.

It's a first year bird (hatched this summer) because of the retained, and very worn/faded brown inner wing coverts, tertials and primaries.
I also wouldn't expect to see any Common/Mew gull with such heavy barring on the newly replaced grey scapulars, especially not a European bird. North American Mew Gulls do have more tendency for creamy fringes and darker sub-terminal bars (but I doubt so bold as on this bird) and more of a brown wash over the grey areas.

 

[Bird Brainer]

I think it's always a bit dangerous to eliminate a species on range, because on this basis, Ring-billed Gull would be ruled out where I live in Europe. Yet RBG was very much a possibility here, with an upsurge in records from the 1980s into the 2000s. Now that possibility is dwindling rapidly with a continuing drop in numbers of new birds year on year. But they are still on the radar...

Despite it's fairly modest proportions (small, slim bill) compared to some RBGs, if I encountered the smaller bird here in the UK a 'red flag' would immediately trigger because of the state of moult. I don't think I've ever seen a Common Gull L canus with so many replaced (grey) wing coverts (and at least 1 tertial) so early in the season. In fact I typically wouldn't expect to see any sign of wing covert moult until the following spring. Moult of the upper-parts would typically just involve the head and body feathers, and more obviously, the scapulars (giving rise to the grey 'saddle'). My knowledge of the North American race L c brachyrhynchus (some now consider this as a potential separate species) is rather limited, but from what I have read the same holds true with respect to moult.

Ring-billed Gulls on the other hand commonly have obvious signs of such wing covert and tertial moult very early in the season (Oct/Nov, and some even in September) so this bird appears to be a typical RBG on this basis.

It's a first year bird (hatched this summer) because of the retained, and very worn/faded brown inner wing coverts, tertials and primaries.
I also wouldn't expect to see any Common/Mew gull with such heavy barring on the newly replaced grey scapulars, especially not a European bird. North American Mew Gulls do have more tendency for creamy fringes and darker sub-terminal bars (but I doubt so bold as on this bird) and more of a brown wash over the grey areas.

I checked Ring-billed Gull on ebird, and it does show some European sightings...https://ebird.org/species/ribgul