Feather identification - carrion crow or common raven? (1 Viewer)

[PiqueDistrikt]

I picked up this primary in the Peak District, England today. It's 277mm long. I'm trying to work out if it's a carrion crow or common raven feather. A raven was heard in the area on the day and a crow was seen.


∆ Carrion crow primary and secondary feather measurements.


∆ Common raven primary and secondary feather measurements.


Numbered feathers for reference.

Any chance of a second opinion? Is it a;

P9 - too big to be a carrion crow?
P8 - too small to be a raven?

I thought this would be easier to work out than this and I kind of regret opening this can of worms, but I'm a swine for biting and not letting go. Now it's a grudge match!

 

[Butty]

Welcome to BF.
As you have there a single feather, I'd go first to one of the feather atlas types of site, eg

https://www.featherbase.info/nb/species/Corvus/corax

full of single feathers, rather than pictures of wings. Obviously emargination will be a key feature in identifying it, and that'll be easier to quantify (eg proportion of whole feather-length that's emarginated) in a single detached feather.
Good luck.

 

[Southern Viking]

Excellent post Butty.

Welcome to Birdforum @PiqueDistrikt

 

[PiqueDistrikt]

Welcome to BF.
As you have there a single feather, I'd go first to one of the feather atlas types of site, eg

https://www.featherbase.info/nb/species/Corvus/corax

full of single feathers, rather than pictures of wings. Obviously emargination will be a key feature in identifying it, and that'll be easier to quantify (eg proportion of whole feather-length that's emarginated) in a single detached feather.
Good luck.

That is literally the website where I took the measurements graphs from so although you mean well... I've already looked at that. But well done for trying.

 

[Joern Lehmhus]

That is literally the website where I took the measurements graphs from so although you mean well... I've already looked at that. But well done for trying.

As Butty said:

"Emargination will be a key feature in identifying the species (proportion of whole feather-length that's emarginated)"
Emargination= a distinct narrowing in the anterior vane of a primary flight feather
Did you try that? Whole feather length alone, as seen in the graphs, will not help you here!

 

[Butty]

I've already looked at that

In which case you missed my point (see Joern's explanation above) - but you meant well, so well done for trying 👍🏼

Emargination= a distinct narrowing in the anterior vane of a primary flight feather

Either vane (both are emarginated in the OP's original photo), but of course it's most often the outer vane that's of interest.