Fulvetta Photo ID - Huet's or David's? Guangxi, China (1 Viewer)

[Barbets48]

Hi,
Recently birded in the Nonggang/Longzhou area of Guangxi. Had many sightings of fulvettas there, with David's the presumed most likely. The features of most birds fit the general description of David's: lacking any prominent black line in the eyebrow.

However, there were a few birds that showed a much more distinct black eyeline. In eBird there are reports of both David's and Huet's in the Nonggang area, but I just am not confident enough in differentiating them to make any firm conclusions. Anyone have any input on these photos?
Photo 1 (05876): Clearly David's Fulvetta (no eyeline) -- majority of birds looked like this
Photos 2-4 : Separate individual (or two) with clear dark line....could these be Huets??

Mike

 

[THE_FERN]

I'm completely unfamiliar with these so what I suggest is possibly wrong.

Photos suggest Huet's is brighter with a slightly more yellow wing panel and paler (prettier) grey head. I couldn't see a massive difference in the dark stripes: were present in David's. On this basis of call these David's

 

[Barbets48]

I'm completely unfamiliar with these so what I suggest is possibly wrong.

Photos suggest Huet's is brighter with a slightly more yellow wing panel and paler (prettier) grey head. I couldn't see a massive difference in the dark stripes: were present in David's. On this basis of call these David's

I hadn’t heard that the wing panel or paleness of the head are differentiating features, but thanks for the feedback!

 

[andyb39]

One feature of the first bird is the thicker, more distinct white eye-ring compared to the second bird. I don't know if that's significant. The lateral crown stripe is very indistinct, which would seem to suggest David's.

The second bird is duller, esp on the wings, but that may just be lighting. I'm not sure if there's a consistent difference in terms of the coloration of the wing and tail between the two species - some David's look quite bright - assuming they're correctly identified. The lateral crown stripe on the second bird does look a bit too distinct for David's, so I would lean towards that species.

It must be really hard trying to separate these two when both occur in the area. Did you hear any calls?

 

[Barbets48]

One feature of the first bird is the thicker, more distinct white eye-ring compared to the second bird. I don't know if that's significant. The lateral crown stripe is very indistinct, which would seem to suggest David's.

The second bird is duller, esp on the wings, but that may just be lighting. I'm not sure if there's a consistent difference in terms of the coloration of the wing and tail between the two species - some David's look quite bright - assuming they're correctly identified. The lateral crown stripe on the second bird does look a bit too distinct for David's, so I would lean towards that species.

It must be really hard trying to separate these two when both occur in the area. Did you hear any calls?

Andy, thanks for the input. Your notes about eye-ring brightness and crown stripe are helpful indeed. Sounds like the 2nd bird may very well be Huet's.
I did hear calls at the time, but didn't record any for comparison. Is there is a significant difference in the vocalizations of these two species? It would helpful to note going forward even if it doesn't help with those particular birds. And do you know of any significant studies or websites where a summary of the plumage and vocalization differences, along with range overlap is recorded? There doesn't seem to be a lot of concrete information out there.
-Mike

 

[johnallcock]

I wasn't aware of any plumage differences between these that could be of potential use in the field, so this is an interesting discussion. I'd be a bit cautious about online photos and the risk of mis-identification (I think ID is often assumed based on range only).

The main difference I was aware of is the song, which is apparently different between the two. I know of a paper that was being written a few years ago discussing ID of songs and the overlap in range in southern China, but I'm not sure if it was ever completed and published.

 

[Barbets48]

I wasn't aware of any plumage differences between these that could be of potential use in the field, so this is an interesting discussion. I'd be a bit cautious about online photos and the risk of mis-identification (I think ID is often assumed based on range only).

The main difference I was aware of is the song, which is apparently different between the two. I know of a paper that was being written a few years ago discussing ID of songs and the overlap in range in southern China, but I'm not sure if it was ever completed and published.

John,
Thanks for that clarification. Makes sense that the song would be the key differentiating factor. I wasn't finding a lot of ID pointers online, besides eBird's descriptions (e.g. for David's Fulvetta: "Very similar in appearance to Huet’s and Yunnan fulvettas, both of which have a prominent black brow stripe; this feature is either extremely faint or absent in David’s.") But that writeup as well may be questionable and hard to know what objective scientific basis it has or doesn't have.

-Mike

 

[andyb39]

@johnallcock Yes, you're right about the risk of misidentified online images, so I tend to rely mostly on the ones on the main page on eBird, or look at multiple images and try to find consistent characteristics.

Mike, the calls do differ slightly, if you go to XenoCanto and listen to some recordings. Huet's gives prolonged grating, chattering calls (the note in eBird says it calls continuously when feeding), whereas David's seems to call more briefly and has a deeper, slightly thrush-like tone.