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<blockquote data-quote="HH75" data-source="post: 3516969" data-attributes="member: 61">Hi all,&nbsp;&nbsp; First off, are the two images certainly of the same individual? I ask because, even allowing for many 2nd-winter Caspian Gulls showing pale mirrors of varying prominence on P10, I'd not expect even a very well-marked bird to have such an obvious pale mirror visible on P10 from below, and, also, pale 'tongues' on some of the other primaries wouldn't be a feature of a bird of that age, being something one might expect on older birds.&nbsp;&nbsp; I admit I am struggling to see any signs of Caspian Gull influence in this bird: structure, scapular pattern, covert pattern, the pattern on the tertials and the general 'dirtiness' below all suggest Herring Gull to me. I could be wrong, of course, and admit that my experience of Caspian Gull and likely hybrids is limited compared to anyone living within the regular range of the species, but I feel confident enough in saying that it surely can't be a pure Caspian Gull anyway.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Regards,&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Harry</blockquote>

[QUOTE="HH75, post: 3516969, member: 61"] Hi all, First off, are the two images certainly of the same individual? I ask because, even allowing for many 2nd-winter Caspian Gulls showing pale mirrors of varying prominence on P10, I'd not expect even a very well-marked bird to have such an obvious pale mirror visible on P10 from below, and, also, pale 'tongues' on some of the other primaries wouldn't be a feature of a bird of that age, being something one might expect on older birds. I admit I am struggling to see any signs of Caspian Gull influence in this bird: structure, scapular pattern, covert pattern, the pattern on the tertials and the general 'dirtiness' below all suggest Herring Gull to me. I could be wrong, of course, and admit that my experience of Caspian Gull and likely hybrids is limited compared to anyone living within the regular range of the species, but I feel confident enough in saying that it surely can't be a pure Caspian Gull anyway. Regards, Harry [/QUOTE]

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