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Message: <blockquote data-quote="thomasdonegan" data-source="post: 3506931" data-attributes="member: 5190">In South American countries I know, at least, there is no such control over nets as that which you describe (or that I know from the UK).  Here in the UK, you start on what used to be called a "T licence" under supervision typically in a large ringing group, and it can take many years and hundreds of ringing processes booked to obtain a "C licence" (?) which allows you to ring under the umbrella of a responsible A licence holder directing research; and then even more years to get an A licence which (I recall) allows you to possess nets and direct mist-net sites under your own supervision. I may have got the letters/licence names wrong or be out of date on the nomenclature, but it is a long process with many stages over several years each. Collecting without using nets (e.g. guns, baiting) is bizarrely a lot easier in the UK and often just requires landowner consent, but for protected species it is essentially impossible.In Colombia at least, people buy mist-nets typically subject only to a conversation on a bulletin board; and the skills I have seen from some students possessing nets whilst sometimes strong in terms of specimen preparation are generally very weak in terms of careful handling of birds and other welfare procedures.  Typically a minimum the authorities look for in terms of possessing or using nets is having done a 2 day fieldwork course (cf. 5 year+ supervised training process in the UK).  It is difficult to pick up the subtleties of bird handling skills (which result in good processing and welfare), as well as the effective handling of nets in just a couple of days in a course with lots of other people present.  That said, the UK probably overdoes things (and has a policy of "not wanting mist netting to become as easy as fishing").  (I did a year or so of regular training with various groups in the UK before first going to South America on a bird netting expedition and, whilst this was not perfect, I have felt a lot better qualified and prepared than many contemporaries on this and subsequent expeditions and netting experience in South America.)As for collecting permits, this again depends between countries. Getting permits in Brazil is a total nightmare and very difficult and highly time consuming in my single experience of attempting this - and that was just for possible mist-net mortalities.  In Colombia, it is either extremely easy to get the broadest permit you can possible comprehend writing, or very difficult verging on impossible to get a permit at all, depending on (i) the personal relations you can establish with the team handling permits in the local government regional corporation and (ii) whether the authority in question gives a monkeys about biodiversity permits as opposed to issuing road building permits.  In Peru, my limited experience of observing the process is that it is pretty easy to get permits.  Export permits are also highly variable, ranging from very easy in some countries to again, essentially impossible in Colombia.  So it varies a lot.  When those stationed at museums with a "very active" museum enrichment collection brief (Mr Kratter I am looking at you!) point to regulatory hurdles as safeguard of ethical behavior and guardian of bird populations, I don't really buy it as a general proposition.  In some countries, collecting and even mist-net study is effectively restricted to the point that you may as well not bother trying (e.g. Brazil IMH (and informed) O) and in other places you can collect whatever you want whenever you want (some parts of Colombia, at least IMH (and informed) O).Thomas</blockquote>

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