Is the Zeiss SFL 8x40 worth the difference in price over the Nikon MHG 8x42? (1 Viewer)

[GrampaTom]

We seen this one?

The Best Binoculars of 2024, Tested and Reviewed | Field & S

We put a lineup of full-size binos through a thorough test to find the best binoculars for hunters. These are the top performers.

www.fieldandstream.com

 

[MiddleRiver]

We seen this one?

The Best Binoculars of 2024, Tested and Reviewed | Field & S

We put a lineup of full-size binos through a thorough test to find the best binoculars for hunters. These are the top performers.

www.fieldandstream.com

"Weather Resistance: I submersed each binocular in a creek next to my house for a half hour, then took them out and scored them for image quality and resolution. Then I put them in a chest freezer for a half hour and rated them on image, resolution, and functionality immediately after and again a half-hour after coming out of the deep freeze."

😱

 

[Paultricounty]

"Weather Resistance: I submersed each binocular in a creek next to my house for a half hour, then took them out and scored them for image quality and resolution. Then I put them in a chest freezer for a half hour and rated them on image, resolution, and functionality immediately after and again a half-hour after coming out of the deep freeze."

😱

I’m not buying anymore binoculars from you 🤣😆✌🏼.

Paul

 

[GrampaTom]

"Weather Resistance: I submersed each binocular in a creek next to my house for a half hour, then took them out and scored them for image quality and resolution. Then I put them in a chest freezer for a half hour and rated them on image, resolution, and functionality immediately after and again a half-hour after coming out of the deep freeze."

😱

Was gonna make a joke re being sure not to drop my binos in creek and leave in frig before going out birding. Got to thinking of days from past doing that thing we’re not allowed to discuss and thought this test not too wild, maybe.

 

[tenex]

For reasons that are not very clear to me, the optics threads certainly generate a lot of discord, this unfortunately often descending into post after post attacking the poster not the topic.

It should be obvious that conversation purely about binoculars (or whatever) is not normal human activity. As a social species a large chunk of our brain is devoted to developing some idea of who it is we are talking with, remembering their particular opinions, trying to evaluate their knowledge, judgment, and taste, perhaps ultimately seeking or avoiding their company accordingly. Here that last step becomes difficult, leaving a choice between using the forum's Ignore feature, or continually trying to resist the urge to speak our mind about being stuck reading (possibly a large volume of) irritating remarks, which can be very frustrating.

For years I resisted using Ignore myself, partly because I somehow kept underestimating the difficulty of that last bit, and partly because this feature also makes entire threads disappear that happen to be started by the particular member, with no indication that they exist and contain replies one might want to read. Regarding the latter point, I've just developed a workaround (sadly it may work only with Firefox) using CSS code to suppress only individual posts (not threads) by a member, which I've posted here on the Site Notice Board. I did need to give myself a bit of extra help with this, wish I'd done it sooner, and do now recommend it when needed.

Edit: I can't help thinking of what Lee would say about this, urging us to maintain positive assumptions about others and so on. Unfortunately I just don't find that keeps working for me in every case. Now there's an "off-topic argument" I miss...

 

[gweller]

The Best Binoculars: Reviews and Recommendations​

Best for Birdwatching: Zeiss SFL 8×40​

Scott Einsmann
SEE IT
Score Card

• Optical Performance: Very Good
• Mechanical Performance: Excellent
• Design: Excellent
• Price/Value: Very Good

Key Features

• Double-hinge, open-barrel design
• Right-barrel diopter control
• Oversized focus wheel
• 4.9-foot close focus
• Weight: 22.6 ounces
• SmartFocus wheel zooms from close focus to infinity in 1.4 turns
• Also available in 10×40, 8×30, and 10×30 models

Pros

• DoubleLink Bridge enables good barrel grip
• Premium glass and coatings
• Extremely light weight

Cons

• At $1,500, it’s a pricey binocular
• Straps and case are fairly pedestrian

The world of premium binoculars apparently has no upper limit. You’ll pay over $3,000 for Swarovski’s excellent NL Pure and over two grand for Leica’s stunning Noctovid. Zeiss, too, asks nearly $3,000 for its marvelous Victory SF binoculars. So to find a binocular that performs nearly on par with those flagship models for half the price is worth shouting about.

Zeiss saves some money on its SFL model by importing this model from Japan; most of the brand’s super-premium optics are made in either Germany or Portugal. And it has found some additional savings in glass by using thinner lenses than it uses in its SF line. Those thinner lenses also allow the SFL to shave nearly half a pound from the SF in the same configuration.

But the image delivered by those halfling lenses is every bit as sharp and vibrant as those of Zeiss’s other premium binoculars. The SFL easily posted the top resolution score at this year’s optics test, and testers raved about the vibrant image with rich contrast and stunning colors. It lost points on disappointing low-light performance, which was partly due to its diminutive 8×40 configuration.

The SFL was designed to appeal to birdwatchers, who are willing to pay for lightweight, bright, and crisp binoculars. But the reason the SFL is here in the top spot is its wider field-worthiness. Its oversized focus wheel riffs from an extremely tight close focus of 4.9 feet out to infinity in just 1.4 rotations of the wheel. That’s a huge asset for tight-cover deer and hog hunters, but also for Western hunters who might pan from middle-distance cover out to far vistas in the same field of view. The smooth and fluid focus wheel moves as though it rides on ball-bearing tracks.

The Zeiss’s name stands for “Smart Focus Lightweight,” and the 1.5-pound heft makes this the lightest premium bino on the market, and a wonderful companion for long hikes over difficult terrain. The balance and grip provided by the open-bridge design makes the SFL feel even lighter, and testers gave high praise for the binocular’s tapered eyecups that were extremely comfortable to use for extended periods.

That’s the real question to ask of a binocular—how long do you want to spend behind it? The more and longer you use a binocular, the more objects—whether warblers or caribou—you’ll spot. There are few other pieces of hunting gear that have that outsized effect on your outcome. If the 8×40 isn’t for you, look to the SFL in 10×40, 8×30, and 10×30.

Since our binocular test, we have kept reaching for the Zeiss any time we required a binocular, one of the surest signs that it’s an optic worth a long look. And longer possession.

I see from the For Sale section that the love affair is over Dennis!! What made you change your mind and sell them??

 

[Steve]

As I have said before,BF has a wide and varied collection of people like any small town, not everyone has the same views or ideas
and may differ in how they contribute to the forum, we have just about every type of person on the planet, I understand that some
people can be irritating but they are still entitled to have a voice and comment on the forums. In this particular case and several others
I see no problem in someone changing their mind or having a different opinion than the one they had ten minutes ago.

Providing the posts do not break any rules, either language or being abusive, I see nothing wrong it at all ? If some members want to
be holier than thou and form little gangs of bullies then you should think about what you are going to write BEFORE you do it.

One might think that some members are thick skinned and don't get affected by the negative imbalance, but I know differently.

This applies to all of us, so please try and be more tolerant .

thanks

Steve

 

[gweller]

As I have said before,BF has a wide and varied collection of people like any small town, not everyone has the same views or ideas
and may differ in how they contribute to the forum, we have just about every type of person on the planet, I understand that some
people can be irritating but they are still entitled to have a voice and comment on the forums. In this particular case and several others
I see no problem in someone changing their mind or having a different opinion than the one they had ten minutes ago.

Providing the posts do not break any rules, either language or being abusive, I see nothing wrong it at all ? If some members want to
be holier than thou and form little gangs of bullies then you should think about what you are going to write BEFORE you do it.

One might think that some members are thick skinned and don't get affected by the negative imbalance, but I know differently.

This applies to all of us, so please try and be more tolerant .

thanks

Steve

I'm not sure whether you are referring above to me and/or Paultricountry but I think we are entitled to ask a well know user, who was singing the praises of the SFL8x40 and is now selling them, why he has done so? I agree maybe I could have phrased my question slightly better perhaps.....

 

[Jos Stratford]

I'm not sure whether you are referring above to me and/or Paultricountry but I think we are entitled to ask a well know user, who was singing the praises of the SFL8x40 and is now selling them, why he has done so? I agree maybe I could have phrased my question slightly better perhaps.....

We welcome discussion on the optics and indeed to ask a poster why they have changed their mind, what has changed in their opinion, etc, but at the same time you also have to respect their opinion and their freedom to change opinions as often as they so wish.

These last couple of posts have to be seen in the context of the ongoing personal criticism and jabs that this member has been subject to for a long time across many threads. He is entitled to express his view without being harassed for it. Please respect that.

Further, not related to this post exactly, it has been suggested by one member that moderators should not only tolerate personal comments against this particular member, but we should somehow moderate the content/opinions of this member. As Steve has said above, if they don't break any rules and are not abusive towards others, we have no reason to contemplate this and I personally think it goes against the very idea of having a forum where all are able to express views.

 

[gweller]

We welcome discussion on the optics and indeed to ask a poster why they have changed their mind, what has changed in their opinion, etc, but at the same time you also have to respect their opinion and their freedom to change opinions as often as they so wish.

These last couple of posts have to be seen in the context of the ongoing personal criticism and jabs that this member has been subject to for a long time across many threads. He is entitled to express his view without being harassed for it. Please respect that.

Further, not related to this post exactly, it has been suggested by one member that moderators should not only tolerate personal comments against this particular member, but we should somehow moderate the content/opinions of this member. As Steve has said above, if they don't break any rules and are not abusive towards others, we have no reason to contemplate this and I personally think it goes against the very idea of having a forum where all are able to express views.

I totally agree with you that one should respect the opinions and views of every user, and that they have the right to say what they will without censure (providing they do not insult anyone etc, etc).

However I also think that users have a right to react, again within reasonable limits and norms, when someone, as for example in this case, appears to change their mind without reason. I feel we have the right/duty to sometimes question what is said (again with limits) in order to ensure that new users (who come here looking for advice) aren't let astray.

Ok, 'nuff said, I'm off to watch some birds.....

 

[Paultricounty]

I agree with Steve and Joe with the analogy that members are a varied collection of people from a town, where not everyone has the same views and opinions. Maybe more like a large town where there are different cultures in different areas. Some see sarcasm in a post and others see humor, yet others see it as criticism and jabs. I doubt anybody would disagree that every member is entitled to express his or her view without being harassed. The question comes down to the definition of harassed, I guess that might also depend somewhat on what part of town you come from as well.

In this case I believe that you have quite a few members that don’t seem to believe that some member is truly posting an opinion or changing their mind. Some members believe (their opinions,) that he or she is not posting an opinion , and that it’s more manipulating and using misinformation to reach a certain segment of the forum for some personal gain. When it’s not a one off and continues year after year it becomes obvious to some, that the forum is being used as a platform not necessarily for opinions and information. Some members see this pattern, and they react to it , and call it out in different ways that some members seem to agree with , and others feel it’s jabbing. This member is also sending PM’s to other members accusing them of harassment and threatening to report them on a seemingly regular basis, for nothing more than voicing their own opinions. I deleted my post (an attempt at humor) because it may have come across differently for some people than my intent. Thank you .

 

[exup]

Nearly 30 years ago, I recall clearly in a management training program being given the following lesson -

If a young lady walks through the factory and 'one of the lads' decides to wolf whistle, to the delight of his teammates, the young lady is the person who decides if there is offence.....not the 'lads'.
If the young lady takes offence, then (after due investigation), the perpetrator is subject to disciplinary action.

So, the opinion of the 'lads' is irrelevant.

 

[GrampaTom]

Nearly 30 years ago, I recall clearly in a management training program being given the following lesson -

If a young lady walks through the factory and 'one of the lads' decides to wolf whistle, to the delight of his teammates, the young lady is the person who decides if there is offence.....not the 'lads'.
If the young lady takes offence, then (after due investigation), the perpetrator is subject to disciplinary action.

So, the opinion of the 'lads' is irrelevant.

I like the part about due investigation. Hopefully we dont yet again confuse opinions and facts.

 

[Jos Stratford]

I, for one, am sorry that anybody feels the need to leave the forum due to pressure by other members. Perhaps it makes moderating the forum easier as you say, but this part is our issue, it is not a reason alone to leave and it is not really something to celebrate. At a personal level, I say the door remains open for you to return.

 

[MiddleRiver]

I, for one, am sorry that anybody feels the need to leave the forum due to pressure by other members. Perhaps it makes moderating the forum easier as you say, but this part is our issue, it is not a reason alone to leave and it is not really something to celebrate. At a personal level, I say the door remains open for you to return.

I agree.

I frequent several other (non bird) forums and all are heavily moderated in the sense that you can say anything you want - on topic - but as soon as you get personal or denigrate or even suggest ulterior motives, pffft. You're gone. It seems harsh at first but amazingly it works. Those that want to get into playground scuffles, can do it on a dedicated sub-forum, where anything (legal) goes.

To be honest, when I first starting reading (and posting) on BF, I was actually quite surprised that birders would be such a rough crowd. Each to his own I suppose, but to me it's a definitive turn-off. I'm certain that my politics, personality, and even birding style is diametrically opposite many others on here. That would make sense if we're a cross section of society. But I'm always interested in the bird threads and of course I'm also damaged-goods in my quest for the perfect bins, so this is otherwise a fun place to start the day over a cuppa'.

 

[Scott98]

I purchased a Swarovski SLC 8x42 for a good price with the intention to compare it to the Zeiss SFL 8x40 and since I don't need two 8x42/40 binoculars I decided to keep the best of the two. To my surprise, even though the SFL had a smoother focuser and was lighter, I liked the SLC a tad better because of the sharper edges. Swarovski's just seem to have those trademark sharp edges. So I kept the SLC and sold the SFL. It was just a matter of personal preference,



See you in the next life.

Sincerely, Dennis

Dennis - sorry to see you go, when it seems like the moderators have finally addressed these issues? Maybe give it one more try?

I've always been told I'm too "dramatic" or opinionated, I like to think it's just a little extra passion for life

 

[Elkhornsun]

It is very difficult to discount for the status associated with a particular brand. I paid $50,000 for a Chevy SUV and for a comparable BMW model I would have paid $75,000. No improvement in any aspect of performance or functionality but obviously a BMW confers higher status for the owner.

There is also the concern that one will be disappointed with the purchase of something less expensive. Mercedes ran a series of advertisements in the 1970's showing details on the front suspension and steering components and these were targeted at current owners of Mercedes cars. The point was to make their customers comfortable with have paid more for their car than for something comparable but costing less.

 

[GrampaTom]

"I just decided I don't need the vicious remarks I get when somebody disagrees with my opinion on a binocular. Steve is correct that there is a little gang of bullies on Bird Forum like Paultricounty, Grampa Tom, gweller, jgraider. tenex, dries and others that harass people if your opinion doesn't agree with theirs, or you change your mind about a binocular, which we all do. I know I watch the classifieds too. It is really nobody else's business how long you keep a binocular or what you buy. You have your own reasons for doing so. It hurts more than you think when you are attacked just because your opinion differs on a binocular that somebody owns."

Dennis as one of your named detractors, I once again have to step in and correct the record. I'm pretty sure I never personally insulted you. Though I get others may see it differently. I have been willing to point out the errors in the way you post incessantly on certain subjects, in this case glare, turning it into a thing, that it is not. I did post I saw glare in my NLs and have posted what I did to manage it, in rather personal ways. You chose to ignore that. I notice in your infamous, "Glare Monsters" thread others far more qualified than I, told you similar things, but you chose to ignore that advice as well. Thats on you, not us. You repeatedly chose and choose to lift partial quotes that support your opinions ignoring the larger more complete reports you take those quotes from. Thats not cool. You would not listen. This was not your first Brouhaha.

That you chose to start that post (after years of controversy), and kept it going no matter what you were told by real subject matter experts here, while our revered, respected and now sorely missed moderator was indisposed, thus taking advantage of the situation was unfortunate. Though they are apparently getting no credit, several posters, in Lee's absence, did their best to manage the thing. Its also unfortunate you chose to seize the moment and plead your case to a couple folks from Birdforum management who no doubt well intended, have been tasked to try and take over from Lee, albeit apparently without the history of what has gone on here for years.

I for one would like to congratulate you for this decision. I hope it proves to be a good one for you and for those of us who choose to or are allowed to remain. It is hoped you will take some time to stop and reflect on what many here have tried to say to you over the years. As I wrote early on in Glare Monsters, you write well, you have mastered bino speak. Somehow though the need to buy and sell, which is of course your prerogative, does not mean you end up with particularly meaningful opinions on the very many binoculars that have passed through your hands. Who does that serve?

It'll be good to see where your hiatus takes Birdforum. For those that remain, (perhaps those allowed to remain), there's obviously more going on than just this. The arguments coming from BF managers to justify their approach to this particular situation are based on what seems limited knowledge of what has gone on. As well the justification seems to want to say BF rules are somehow sacrosanct, perfect and all thats needed. I wonder... Am I alone? Maybe, just maybe, it is those policies and how they are interpreted that has contributed to the tenor that exists here that we all have commented on for way too long. That of course is a much more complicated conversation and one for which the energy, openness, patience and resources may not exist.

 

[Paultricounty]

I purchased a Swarovski SLC 8x42 for a good price with the intention to compare it to the Zeiss SFL 8x40 and since I don't need two 8x42/40 binoculars I decided to keep the best of the two. To my surprise, even though the SFL had a smoother focuser and was lighter, I liked the SLC a tad better because of the sharper edges. Swarovski's just seem to have those trademark sharp edges. So I kept the SLC and sold the SFL. It was just a matter of personal preference,

After 20 years of posting on Bird Forum, I have made the difficult decision to leave the forum. I am sure my haters will rejoice, although there are probably a few of you that appreciate my posts who will miss me. I seem to irritate quite a few people, even though that is not my intention. My intent has been to help other people in choosing a binocular, and that is why I started the Glare Monster thread. The list of glare prone and glare resistant binoculars was just intended to help first time buyers in their binocular search, not as a slam for somebody that owns a glare prone binocular.

I just decided I don't need the vicious remarks I get when somebody disagrees with my opinion on a binocular. Steve is correct that there is a little gang of bullies on Bird Forum like Paultricounty, Grampa Tom, gweller, jgraider. tenex, dries and others that harass me if my opinion doesn't agree with theirs, or you change your mind about a binocular, which we all do. I know I watch the classifieds too.

Dennis I don’t think you can find one time I was vicious to you. And if you remember or go back and read some of your posts you’ve been doing quite a bit of bullying yourself. A matter of fact I think or I believe you have been suspended for some direct threats to members. I’m not sure who’s harassing you, I read you posting an opinion for hundreds of posts about the best binocular, you disregard other members opinions , double down then sell them the following month and start a new discussion about how bad the they were. I for one don’t think it’s changing your mind, but I can’t be sure. If you look back you can clearly see I agreed with you most of the time. We’ve had friendly banter that you participated in for years. Btw it’s more members than the six you mentioned. You’re getting overly dramatic, so a few of us got under your skin, some of us not allowed to the same guilt?

Paultricounty would have to be given the most credit for getting rid of me. He almost obsessively stalks me on the forum and tries to negate any posts I make, and he even watches Astromart to see what binoculars I have posted and then comes running back to Bird Forum and blabs my private business for the whole forum and thousands of people to see to belittle me.

So it worked, again just kidding. I DO NOT want to see you leave, let me make that clear. Nobody is stalking you there are so many members here that also are members on those other sites you speak of, and we all talk about what’s going on here and there, and who’s selling what. Trust me Dennis nobody is singling you out. Again, I for one do not want to see you leave.

I guess some of my comments must have really caused him to have a grudge against me because he won't let it go. It reaches a point where I don't enjoy posting anymore. It is really nobody else's business how long you keep a binocular or what you buy. You have your own reasons for doing so. It hurts more than you think when you are attacked just because your opinion differs on a binocular that somebody owns.

Not at all and no grudge. I think you don’t like when someone points out some of your mistakes and that seems to irritate you. I’m sorry I’m so good at it. Again toughen up, I promise I’ll be nice from now on. I’ll even send you a free pair of binoculars 😆.

The trouble is, if you bully everybody off of Bird Forum that doesn't agree with you, you will lose the diversity of opinions that make Bird Forum so interesting. I felt I had something to add to Bird Forum, but obviously many disagree. I will still read Bird Forum because you learn a lot by doing so, but I have to admit I think I learned more when I had a thread going because I had to dig for answers a lot of time for rebuttals and I learned more from doing that than just posting.

Everybody’s not being bullied, drop the victim card. You do have much to offer the site and I’ve said that many times in between sparing with you.

Another reason I am leaving is I feel I am causing the moderators a lot of trouble that they shouldn't have to put up with, and my posts are disrupting the whole forum. This is just a forum to discuss binoculars and if I was a moderator the minute somebody started name-calling I would delete the post because other people especially visitors don't understand it and thousands of people from around the world read these threads.

Moderators already told me you’re not that much of a problem. God forbid you were a moderator.

It is not just our little group. These visitors come here to learn something about the topic, and they don't want to hear one member calling another member names. There should be some changes in moderation on Bird Forum, with 0 tolerance for bickering and name-calling because it denigrates Bird Forum as a legitimate and reliable place to read about binoculars.

I haven't posted in over two weeks because I was trying to let the threads I had started just fade into oblivion, but then Tenex revives a thread with a comment about a new way to ignore somebody meaning me and then hear comes gweller to point out I have a binocular in the classifieds and then Paltricounty joins into to point out I purchased an SLC to replace the SFL which by the way I thought was a private email. I guess you should be careful about people that you think might be your friends. You see how the gang of bullies work together. That was when I decided enough was enough. I don't need this anymore.

I like Tenex and a lot of people like Tenex. I don’t think Tenex was coming up with a good idea to improve the ignore feature specifically because of you, you might’ve helped. Dennis your the one that told me you bought the SLC, was it a secret? You and I were discussing your reasons (after you asked me why I’m selling the 50EL) for selling the SFL. You didn’t tell me to keep it to myself. I apologize if that annoyed you , it certainly wasn’t my intent.

Goodbye to all my friends, and thanks for supporting me in the past, and I much enjoyed all the interesting conversations we have had over 20 years. I am very sorry about Lee. He was a very good guy and enjoyed using his binoculars to observe nature very much. All my haters can all go out now and have a beer and celebrate.

Don’t go, don’t go. All joking aside I do not want you to leave, just town it down a bit, don’t ignore conversations when people are pointing something out you disagree with. This is my peace offering.

Paul

See you in the next life.

Sincerely, Dennis

 

[tenex]

Steve is correct that there is a little gang of bullies on Bird Forum like Paultricounty, Grampa Tom, gweller, jgraider. tenex, dries and others that harass me if my opinion doesn't agree with theirs, or you change your mind about a binocular, which we all do...

I haven't posted in over two weeks because I was trying to let the threads I had started just fade into oblivion, but then Tenex revives a thread with a comment about a new way to ignore somebody meaning me and then hear comes...

You see how the gang of bullies work together. That was when I decided enough was enough. I don't need this anymore.

With all due respect to both Steve and you, there is no "little gang of bullies", and if there was I wouldn't be part of it anyway. There is instead a much larger number of members taking issue with your posts at times for various reasons, whether factual content or something else. The more persistent ones may even be trying to help you understand something you seem not to, when you're oversimplifying or saying something potentially misleading.

The one thing that has struck me as troubling was the tendency of a couple of members (not including me) to impute actual dishonesty to you, the "pump and dump" accusation that you were trying to convince people to buy binoculars you had concluded were unacceptable glare monsters or whatever. I always wondered why you didn't object more strenuously to that, which may have encouraged it to continue. In retrospect I could have objected myself, but it was hard to even take seriously as it never really made sense, since everyone has different priorities and tastes, and your buyers were obviously happy. Perhaps those members were just having too hard a time imagining what made you tick and got frustrated. Others can get tired of you, too.

That is exactly why I've posted recently about the Ignore feature (whether the forum's or my own): because it's important not to allow these frustrations to boil over. Having resolved a technical difficulty, I have finally put you on Ignore (which I'm violating to reply here), but that's not some sort of insult, it's just how I'm going to avoid further unpleasantness for myself or you, and perhaps how others might also manage to. The feature exists for a good reason. Human beings devote a lot of mental resources to trying to figure one another out, and with you that hasn't been productive, so I don't want to keep getting dragged into it. I certainly haven't been trying to drive you away, and anyone who had would surely have given up long ago. Whatever you decide, I hope you try to understand your own contribution to the situation rather than just blaming some "gang of bullies". Since few members have the experience here that you have, you could be curious why, and what you could have done differently.

I hope the moderators will allow this digression to remain in place despite its touchy nature, and some other things get said that should have before and didn't.