• Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.

    Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

Leica’s design sense… (1 Viewer)

Can someone tell me what the Leica BL, BN, etc. designations mean? Are these older models? If so, what are the new designations (if there are new designations).
Thank you.
Mark
 
Leica zee best ! Love the Ultravids especially. I use only a Nikon HG right now but have been thinking lately I want to go back to Leica again. I just have to decide what to buy.

Does anyone here use and enjoy the Trinovid HD 8x32?
Its relatively narrow fov and small IPD range give me some pause.
My wife has Trinovid HD 8x32 and I have pre-HD Trinovid 8x42. I also have a Kowa Genesis 8x33, because my 8x42 Trinovid has no close focus at all :confused:. The little Trinovid HD 8x32 weighs 650 g, but it feels in hands of ~same weight as the Kowa (590 g). It feels substantially lighter than the Trinovid 8x42.

Trinovid HD 8x32 is made very nicely, of the same standard as the pre-HD 8x42, even though the diopter mechanism is simpler (but it works just well, no issues there). It fits my (and my wife's) hands very well and it is a pleasure to use. The image is very nice, it has that "silky" feel to it, like the 8x42 does, but the view through 8x42 feels a little more "peaceful" for not having a better word. This may be due to the larger aperture of the latter, but I am not sure. The colour rendition between the two Trinovids is different. They both still give those beautiful glowing colours, just that the whites in the HD look perhaps more neutral (slightly less warm in tone). Centre-field resolution (without any testing through measurements) seems about the same between the three binoculars. They all give crisp image and I cannot distinguish any more detail with any of them than with the other two. (It is interesting to compare their "sharpness" to Nikon EII 8x30, which somehow displays sharper image in the centre, however this sharpness looks somehow unnatural-almost ruthlessly- and it does not allow me to see any more texture or any other detail than the other three binoculars).

The field of view (FOV) of the two Trinovids is about the same and it does look narrow when switching from Kowa (7.1 vs. 8 degrees). However, the brain quickly re-adjusts and soon it does not bother me at all. I remember when I ordered the Trinovid 8x42, after using Nikon EII for a year or so, I was concerned the FOV would be too limited with the Trinovid. When the Trinovid finally arrived, I was amazed how little the smaller FOV meant when birdwatching. True, it is nicer to have a wider FOV, but in the use I was not bothered by the narrower FOV at all. The Trinovid was actually much better in finding the birds in deep bush-I am still puzzled why this is so. I know there are strong views about FOV on this forum, but my experience is that, while large FOV is nice, it is not really essential to have >8 degrees FOV: 7 degrees is still good enough in practice for birdwatching.

Trinovid HD 8x32 has 17mm eye relief, which is actually too large for the eyecups supplied, both for my wife and me. With eyecups fully extended we both got the black-beans effect :unsure:. However, I realized the eyecups of Trinovid 8x42 and 8x32 HD are interchangeable and the rubber eyecup pads on the 8x42 are about a mm thicker than on the 8x32 HD. I ordered the eyecup pads for Trinovid 8x42 ( Article No 434-430.001-010, if someone needs them) and replaced them onto the 8x32 HD eyecups: problem solved.

The focusser on Trinovid 8x32 HD is nice, smooth, well damped, with no backlash. This is much better than on Trinovid 8x42, which has the well known static friction: once the focuser is stopped, it takes a substantial effort to start moving it again and then it "jumps" because the dynamic friction is smaller than the static one. Kowa has much better focuser, smooth and very, very light (at least for my specimen, the newer version seems to have much stiffer focuser): going back to Trinovid 8x42 feels a bit irritating but it only takes a few minutes to get used to it again.

The sweet spot of the two Trinovids is about the same size. Kowa has substantially smaller sweet spot, which is irritating when trying to find well-camouflaged birds on the ground (but is not an issue in other situations for me). Both Trinovids work well for finding the birds on the ground and the curvature of the field of sharp focus actually helps here (i.e. the field of sharp focus is farther in centre than towards the edges of the field of view).

Chromatic aberration for Trinovid 8x32 HD is substantially better than for 8x42, it is still there but does not bother me; Kowa is the best.

Trinovid HD has AquaDura coatings, while the plain Trinovid does not. To me, this makes a substantial difference in cold weather, as the Trinovid HD oculars fog very little, while the other ones fog a lot.

Trinovid 8x32 HD has very short close focus (~ 1m) which is very nice, not only for observing insects and flowers, but also small birds that sometimes come very close. One peculiar feature of my wife's binocular is that when you focus at less than 2 m and push the two binocular tubes together (lowering interpupilary distance (IPD) to help retain binocular view at close distances) and then push the tubes back apart as you want to view something at larger distances, the focuser now suddenly becomes quite stiff. This is resolved as you keep working the focuser and/or change IPD a few times. I am not sure if this happens with all Trinovid 8x32 HD's...

OK, I got it off my chest, I apologize for ranting on. What I really want to say is that Trinovid 8x32 HD is an enjoyable binocular to use despite some of "technical shortcomings" when compared to some other brands and it probably did not receive all the praise it deserves. With other brands you may get a larger FOV and lower weight (Zeiss SFL comes to mind, even though it is more expensive), but you don't get that "Leica look".
 
Last edited:
Can someone tell me what the Leica BL, BN, etc. designations mean? Are these older models? If so, what are the new designations (if there are new designations).
There are others that will answer more precisely, but essentially the BA, and later the BN models are on the larger binoculars and stands for (if I remember correctly) Brille, which stands for something like glasses? and A for Armoured, later changed to N for Near focus capability. The BR and BL are Ultravid designations with the R standing for Rubber covering and L for the Leatherette covering.
 
Last edited:
OK, I got it off my chest, I apologize for ranting on. What I really want to say is that Trinovid 8x32 HD is an enjoyable binocular to use despite some of "technical shortcomings" when compared to some other brands and it probably did not receive all the praise it deserves. With other brands you may get a larger FOV and lower weight (Zeiss SFL comes to mind, even though it is more expensive), but you don't get that "Leica look".
no need for apology. Your post is very helpful. thanks for all the info !
 
There are others that will answer more precisely, but essentially the BA, and later the BN models are on the larger binoculars and stands for (if I remember correctly) Brille, which stands for something like glasses? and A for Armoured, later changed to N for Near focus capability. The BR and BL are Ultravid designations with the R standing for Rubber covering and L for the Leatherette covering.
Thank you.
 
Am I alone in preferring the black armour over the green editions?

I've never owned a Leica, but if I do treat myself, it might be an Ultravid 10x25 (that's if the Zeiss Victory Pocket doesn't suit me better).

I'm also curious to see if the excellent physical quality of their binos translates to the Televid scopes.
It does, but Leica sadly comes a poor third or fourth in the 'alpha' scope hierarchy too. The old 77 & 62 Televids were superb and good samples can still pretty much hold their own against todays frontrunners.

RB
 
It does, but Leica sadly comes a poor third or fourth in the 'alpha' scope hierarchy too. The old 77 & 62 Televids were superb and good samples can still pretty much hold their own against todays frontrunners.

Were those the ones actually manufactured by Meopta? I have a Meopta MeoStar S2 82 HD with the 30-60x WA constant 66º AFOV eyepiece and am very happy with it.
 
Were those the ones actually manufactured by Meopta? I have a Meopta MeoStar S2 82 HD with the 30-60x WA constant 66º AFOV eyepiece and am very happy with it.
Yes, they were indeed manufactured by Meopta - to Leica's design, which is what is really what is being discussed in this thread I suppose. I have an APO Televid 62 and wouldn't swap it for anything else I've seen. It's superb with the 26x WW eyepiece and no slouch with the 16-48x zoom either!

RB
 
Funny you should say that. I was just reading The Independent's list of the top 50 most influential women in the UK in honour of World Women's Day, and No. 41 is ornithologist Mya-Rose Craig, who seems to share your choices in equipment:

mya.jpg
 
It does, but Leica sadly comes a poor third or fourth in the 'alpha' scope hierarchy too. The old 77 & 62 Televids were superb and good samples can still pretty much hold their own against todays frontrunners.

RB
That's interesting. Can you say a bit more about why the new APO Televids (82) don't stand up to the old models, let alone the new alpha competition, e.g., Swaro ATX, Zeiss Harpia?

Thanks!
 
As is typical, threads kind of drift off track after awhile, nothing wrong with that, off topic discussions are fun too, but my main point was Leica as a company seems to put a greater emphasis on style and industrial design than their counterparts. Swarovski does well in that regard, but the others seem to stick with total function, let the looks follow.
 
my main point was Leica as a company seems to put a greater emphasis on style and industrial design than their counterparts. Swarovski does well in that regard, but the others seem to stick with total function, let the looks follow.
Zeiss certainly isn't about pure function; they actually hired an outside firm to design the HT and SF exteriors which naturally wound up full of pointless overwrought details. (I don't know whether that was also true of the weird Design Selection models of the 1990s where one could hardly operate the focuser, does anyone?) So I suppose taste is one thing, design another...
 
Swarovski hired Marc Newson to design the 7x21 CL Curio.


but yes, Leicas are things of beauty, including the cameras and even the microscopes and surveying equipment made by separate companie.
 
Last edited:
That's interesting. Can you say a bit more about why the new APO Televids (82) don't stand up to the old models, let alone the new alpha competition, e.g., Swaro ATX, Zeiss Harpia?

Thanks!
I have little experience of the newer Leica Televids I'm afraid, so I can't really answer from personal experience. On the occasion that I have used one (82mm), I have found nothing at all wrong with them. If you run a search on the forum, I'm sure you'll find reasons why others don't rate them very highly. Much of it is more about fashion and what's in vogue at the moment than optical performance, I suspect. The wide angle zoom on the Televids is an excellent, well-designed bit of kit IMHO and the scopes are very compact and feel very robust. FWIW, when I bought my APO Televid 62 back in 2004, I tested it exhaustively against the equivalent Swarovski (65mm) at the time and the Leica came out tops for me by some margin and I'm a Swarovski binocular user.

RB
 
I have little experience of the newer Leica Televids I'm afraid...
Thanks for the note!

I'm considering upgrading my Vortex Razor (from 'alpha minus' to alpha, you might say). I'm still juggling the options, including an ATX, Harpia, Kowa 88/99, etc., but I still fancy taking a look at the 82 Televid.

Optics aside, I was a little surprised by the build quality of the ATX and Harpia models that I have tested. The ATX certainly doesn't have the same sense of quality you get with the NLs, for example. Strangely, I think the Razor is a nicer piece of kit than the ATX and Harpia, physically speaking (but the glass is another matter, of course). The Kowa seems to have a good balance of qualities.

If the Televid 82 is as nice as a Noctivid to hold and use, and the AFOV is not restrictive, to my eyes, then I'd be interested to try one.
 
The wide angle zoom on the Televids is an excellent, well-designed bit of kit IMHO and the scopes are very compact and feel very robust.
Does anyone know whether they're still made by Meopta? (Scope body at least; surely Leica makes the highly regarded wide zoom eyepiece themselves.) I would think some people might still prefer a classic coarse/fine zoom to the now trendy single collar.
 
I've used Swarovsikis since 2003, but I've never forgotten the absolute thrill of buying and using my first pair of Leitz Trinovid 7x35Bs in the early 1970s. What a comfortable binocular to carry all day in the field! For their era, they were the standard of excellence. Nothing since then has ever felt as wonderful in the hand. Hope to come across a birder with a pair of Retrovids in the near future so I can take a peek through them.
 
Last edited:
Warning! This thread is more than 1 year ago old.
It's likely that no further discussion is required, in which case we recommend starting a new thread. If however you feel your response is required you can still do so.

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top