Monarch 7 8x42vs... (1 Viewer)

[jremmons]

Hello all,

I am in need of a new set of 7x/8x as my prior ones catastrophically failed recently, and was wondering how the Monarch 7 compared to some similarly price models such us:

Vortex Viper HD 8x32/8x42
Zen-Ray ED3 7x43/8x43
Celestron Granite 8x42
Swift Audubon 8.5x44

or any other in that roughly 400-500$ range.

I like the idea of a huge field of view as well as the compactness of the Monarch 7, but I've read previously that their edges seemed very "soft" and that the "sweet spot" was quite small compared to others making the usable FoV similar to or smaller than other models.

Thanks a bunch!

Justin

 

[mikefreiberg]

Hello all,

I am in need of a new set of 7x/8x as my prior ones catastrophically failed recently, and was wondering how the Monarch 7 compared to some similarly price models such us:

Vortex Viper HD 8x32/8x42
Zen-Ray ED3 7x43/8x43
Celestron Granite 8x42
Swift Audubon 8.5x44

or any other in that roughly 400-500$ range.

I like the idea of a huge field of view as well as the compactness of the Monarch 7, but I've read previously that their edges seemed very "soft" and that the "sweet spot" was quite small compared to others making the usable FoV similar to or smaller than other models.

Thanks a bunch!

Justin

Justin,

As a Nikon rep I am putting bias aside to tell you what I honestly think. The sweet spot is hardly noticeable and I would never call it small. I put down my EDG to use the M7 given it is 23 ounces, 421 ft/1000 yds of FOV. Where this binocular excels over most is the contrast that is provided by the dielectric coatings on the sub prisms. This contrast out performs most even at the high end. Looking for fall warblers in dark Pine-Oak forest of the US Southwest was the primary venue when I initially tested this product. I encourage you to try it out in a real dark setting. The image seems pretty sharp to me. The M3 has a decreased sweet spot from the M7, but again that is to be expected as it is a grade down in glass. Please let me know if you have questions regarding these bins. Best of luck.

All the best,
Mike Freiberg
Nikon Birding Market Specialist

 

[eitanaltman]

Justin -- Why wouldn't you post this in the main forum? You are comparing across several different brands here.

I thought you already tried the McKinleys and loved them. Why don't you just go for those if that's what you really want?

The M7 is a great option at the price point -- huge FOV and also light and compact as Mike notes -- but as a NON Nikon employee I can assure you there are plenty of excellent options to choose from You kind of have to decide your priorities. If compactness is the goal then the Viper (especially the 8x32) and the Monarch stand out, or if you prefer a smaller better corrected FOV then the Zeiss Terra deserves a look. If you prefer a bigger open bridge design then you probably want to look at the ED3 (huge FOV) or the Vanguard Endeavor ED (smaller but better corrected FOV). And so on...

You also of course are in the price range ballpark of the Nikon 8x32 SE porro, if you are just after maximum optical quality for the budget and a porro will satisfy you then that seems like a very viable option.

 

[Dr.SamPoni]

Slightly off topic:
I have a stupid question about the wide FOV of Monarch 7 8x42 and its effect on image size. Does a wide FOV shrink the size of the subject being observed? In other words, to get the same size image of a subject as seen with a narrow FOV 8x42, will I have to move closer to the subject when using Monarch 7 8x42?

I am asking this because of the following observation: When I look at a bird with my Monarch 8x42 ATB and then look at the same bird with my Nikon SE 8x32, the size of the bird looks smaller on the SE which has a wider FOV. Is it an illusion caused by the wide FOV of the SE or is the image of the bird actually smaller in the SE due to smaller objective (although I believe objective size only impacts brightness)? I don't understand this, both have 8x magnifications, so the magnification of the bird should be similar on both, right?
I am soooo confused, sorry about the multiple questions.

 

[BruceH]

Dr. SamPoni ... I like the question in your first paragraph (image size in like binoculars with different FOV), but do not know the answer.

Your second paragraph touches I think on a somewhat different issue. The Monarch ATB is a roof and the SE is a porro. I have seen the same image scale results as you where the subject looks smaller in the porro as compared to a like roof model. This is a porro vs a roof issue due to the difference in spacing between the objective lenes. There was a recent thread on this. Scoll down for the response from Henry Link.

http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=264975

 

[Stanbo]

Slightly off topic:
I have a stupid question about the wide FOV of Monarch 7 8x42 and its effect on image size. Does a wide FOV shrink the size of the subject being observed? In other words, to get the same size image of a subject as seen with a narrow FOV 8x42, will I have to move closer to the subject when using Monarch 7 8x42?

I am asking this because of the following observation: When I look at a bird with my Monarch 8x42 ATB and then look at the same bird with my Nikon SE 8x32, the size of the bird looks smaller on the SE which has a wider FOV. Is it an illusion caused by the wide FOV of the SE or is the image of the bird actually smaller in the SE due to smaller objective? I don't understand this, both have 8x magnifications, so the magnification of the bird should be similar on both, right?
I am soooo confused, sorry about the multiple questions.

See my thread Why! http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=264975

I asked the same question and received some excellent replies.

Unfortunately, I forgot to thank everyone, so belated thanks to all.

Stan

 

[jremmons]

Eitanaltman,

I posted this thread because I am more interested in the Monarch 7 due to its incredibly low price, though I guess I could've posted it in the main forum. I did really like the view of the BX-4, but they are a couple of hundred over my budget and though I've seen some used ones for sale, I have to sell my 6x32 before I will have the funds for the 7/8x and so those used options may no longer be available.

Mike,
Thank you for your opinion and though I of course recognize that it may be slightly biased, I have heard decent things about the "second crop" of M7.

Sam,
I just compared the view between my two 10x42 models, one of which has about 40ft > FoV, and I didn't notice much of a difference in the size of the objects I observed. This isn't a very scientific test, so looking around the forum may provide a better answer.

 

[CSG]

I was impressed with the Monarch 7's yesterday when I compared them to the Vortex Viper and Talon. However, none impressed enough to actually purchase.

 

[eitanaltman]

Eitanaltman,

I posted this thread because I am more interested in the Monarch 7 due to its incredibly low price

I'm not sure I would refer to its price as "incredibly low". It seems pretty typically priced for what it is, and in a sense it is higher priced than a lot of its direct competition among Chinese-built, widefield ED bins with dielectric coating (e.g. Zen ED3 and Zeiss Terra ED). Obviously it's much cheaper than a $2k Swaro or Zeiss but it's not in that performance league either.

I'm not badmouthing the M7, it's an excellent binocular and the Monarch line has stood the test of time in the budget bin world, but it's not like it's some crazy insane value at its price point.

I did really like the view of the BX-4, but they are a couple of hundred over my budget and though I've seen some used ones for sale, I have to sell my 6x32 before I will have the funds for the 7/8x and so those used options may no longer be available.

Honestly even if you bought it new I don't see much difference, the M7 sells for $479 and the McKinley for $599. An extra 100 bucks shouldn't be an issue if the McKinley is the one you WANT. Even if you find a sale on the M7, an extra $200 amortized over years of use is pretty meaningless. If you loved the McKinley, get the McKinley, otherwise you might end up being bitter and resentful towards the bin you actually purchase instead!

 

[Dr.SamPoni]

OK, so the difference in image size I see between the SE 8x32 and Monarch 8x42 ATB is probably mainly a porro vs roof effect. I recently ordered an 8x42 Monarch 7. Once I get it, I will be comparing it to my 8x42 Monarch ATB and hopefully the 'subject' image won't be smaller in the M7.

Sam

Eitanaltman,

I posted this thread because I am more interested in the Monarch 7 due to its incredibly low price, though I guess I could've posted it in the main forum. I did really like the view of the BX-4, but they are a couple of hundred over my budget and though I've seen some used ones for sale, I have to sell my 6x32 before I will have the funds for the 7/8x and so those used options may no longer be available.

Mike,
Thank you for your opinion and though I of course recognize that it may be slightly biased, I have heard decent things about the "second crop" of M7.

Sam,
I just compared the view between my two 10x42 models, one of which has about 40ft > FoV, and I didn't notice much of a difference in the size of the objects I observed. This isn't a very scientific test, so looking around the forum may provide a better answer.

 

[Dr.SamPoni]

Justin,
Don't know if you saw it in the Binocular Bargains thread, Samy's camera is offering a $100 instant rebate on the M7 8x42. They were also offering it through amazon yesterday and I pulled the trigger. They also have a $50 instant rebate on M5 8x42. Their seller ratings seem to be good both on amazon and reseller ratings.
http://www.samys.com/p/Binoculars---Standard/7548/8x42-Binocular-Monarch-7-Black/Green/115090.html

Sam

PS: I am not affiliated with Samy's Camera in any way

Eitanaltman,

I posted this thread because I am more interested in the Monarch 7 due to its incredibly low price, though I guess I could've posted it in the main forum. I did really like the view of the BX-4, but they are a couple of hundred over my budget and though I've seen some used ones for sale, I have to sell my 6x32 before I will have the funds for the 7/8x and so those used options may no longer be available.

Mike,
Thank you for your opinion and though I of course recognize that it may be slightly biased, I have heard decent things about the "second crop" of M7.

Sam,
I just compared the view between my two 10x42 models, one of which has about 40ft > FoV, and I didn't notice much of a difference in the size of the objects I observed. This isn't a very scientific test, so looking around the forum may provide a better answer.

 

[jremmons]

Sam: Your note on the Monarch 7 is actually what got me interested in them - at roughly $380, they seem quite a bargain but I am still not exactly sure how they perform quality-wise.

 

[ceasar]

OK, so the difference in image size I see between the SE 8x32 and Monarch 8x42 ATB is probably mainly a porro vs roof effect. I recently ordered an 8x42 Monarch 7. Once I get it, I will be comparing it to my 8x42 Monarch ATB and hopefully the 'subject' image won't be smaller in the M7.

Sam

It won't be different. And if you compare size seen in your 8 x 32 SE with your Monarch 8 x 42 ATB at infinity distance you won't see a difference either. I spent an entire afternoon at Hawk Mountain comparing my 10 x 32 EDG with my 10 x 42 SE at all distances in practical use and I did not notice this at any time.

Bob

 

[fkrow]

Justin,
Don't know if you saw it in the Binocular Bargains thread, Samy's camera is offering a $100 instant rebate on the M7 8x42. They were also offering it through amazon yesterday and I pulled the trigger. They also have a $50 instant rebate on M5 8x42. Their seller ratings seem to be good both on amazon and reseller ratings.
http://www.samys.com/p/Binoculars---Standard/7548/8x42-Binocular-Monarch-7-Black/Green/115090.html

Sam

PS: I am not affiliated with Samy's Camera in any way

Thanks for the posting, I have ordered camera items from Sammy's Camera for many years, very reliable dealer.

Just placed my order for Nikon 8x42 Monarch 7,,, great price.

Regards,
FK

 

[Stanbo]

It won't be different. And if you compare size seen in your 8 x 32 SE with your Monarch 8 x 42 ATB at infinity distance you won't see a difference either. I spent an entire afternoon at Hawk Mountain comparing my 10 x 32 EDG with my 10 x 42 SE at all distances in practical use and I did not notice this at any time.

Bob

Bob,

I have just looked through my Nikon 8x32 EDG and 8x32 SE and I must disagree with you. The image through the EDG appears to be about 1.5x larger that the SE at 15m. The effect seems to diminish the closer you get to infinity. It shows up better looking at a distinct object (berries, flowers and leaves work well) rather than a general view.

Try Henry Link's trick of looking at an object with both eyes, then closing one eye. With the EDG the image decreases in size while it remains the same size with the SE. It's due to parallax differences apparently, caused by the spacing of the objective lenses.

Perhaps the difference between us is 10x to 8x magnification, but I don't see why.

Stan

 

[ceasar]

Bob,

I have just looked through my Nikon 8x32 EDG and 8x32 SE and I must disagree with you. The image through the EDG appears to be about 1.5x larger that the SE at 15m. The effect seems to diminish the closer you get to infinity. It shows up better looking at a distinct object (berries, flowers and leaves work well) rather than a general view.

Try Henry Link's trick of looking at an object with both eyes, then closing one eye. With the EDG the image decreases in size while it remains the same size with the SE. It's due to parallax differences apparently, caused by the spacing of the objective lenses.

Perhaps the difference between us is 10x to 8x magnification, but I don't see why.

Stan

Stan,

That's what I said. The effect diminishes the closer you get to infinity. Perhaps I was confusing because you can't do very much birding at Hawk Mountain unless you are at infinity. Occasionally some will fly closer but in that case it won't make much difference. Where it is most visible is when you have some time to examine birds when they are close to you like on your lawn, in your bird feeders or on your neighbors roof.

I let an Intern from Nepal who was working at Hawk Mountain that year try both the SE and EDG. He liked the SE better. He said that was the type of binoculars they used in Nepal when they were studying Himalayan Vultures.

Bob

 

[Dr.SamPoni]

Bob,
I haven't compared the SE 8x32 and Monarch ATB 8x42 at infinity, but only mostly around a neighbor's bird feeder, as you rightly imagined.
So from what I gather, when I compare my ATB to M7 8x42, the size of the subject will be similar regardless of how distant it is on both bins. Does that mean I will see a larger image (bigger circle) on the M7 due to its wide FOV?
Hope I am not too confusing.
Sam

Stan,

That's what I said. The effect diminishes the closer you get to infinity. Perhaps I was confusing because you can't do very much birding at Hawk Mountain unless you are at infinity. Occasionally some will fly closer but in that case it won't make much difference. Where it is most visible is when you have some time to examine birds when they are close to you like on your lawn, in your bird feeders or on your neighbors roof.

I let an Intern from Nepal who was working at Hawk Mountain that year try both the SE and EDG. He liked the SE better. He said that was the type of binoculars they used in Nepal when they were studying Himalayan Vultures.

Bob

 

[ceasar]

Bob,
I haven't compared the SE 8x32 and Monarch ATB 8x42 at infinity, but only mostly around a neighbor's bird feeder, as you rightly imagined.
So from what I gather, when I compare my ATB to M7 8x42, the size of the subject will be similar regardless of how distant it is on both bins. Does that mean I will see a larger image (bigger circle) on the M7 due to its wide FOV?
Hope I am not too confusing.
Sam

Sam,

The FOV will not affect the size of the subject being viewed as long as both of your binoculars are 8x roof prisms and the distance to the object is the same.

So yes, you will see a larger circular area around the object with the Monarch 7 because of it's larger FOV. The bird or the object will be the same size in both binoculars assuming both binoculars are 8x.

Try looking at a landscape at infinity with the 8x ATB. Center the binocular on an object, like a church steeple, in the middle and see how wide the view is. Then Center your 8x Monarch 7 on the same object and you will be able to see how much wider the view is. If they are both 8x the object in the middle will be the same size in both binoculars. Since they are both 8x roof prisms the size of the object should not change at any distance.

Bob

 

[Dr.SamPoni]

Thanks for clearing that up Bob.
Sam

 

[fkrow]

Sam,

Thanks again for the posting on Sammy's Camera special $100 discount pricing.

I ordered the Nikon 8x42 Monarch 7 on Tues, they were on backorder,,,, today I rec'd e-mail notice they have shipped.

Regards,
FK