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Mountain Chiffchaff or Common? Iran, Sistan & Baluchestan, Mar. 2022 (1 Viewer)

Pedrambirder

Well-known member
Iran
Hi all,
 

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KenM

Well-known member
Can you lighten the images Pedram, it might result in a contrasty white throat suffused with a “pinky” under-wash, plus a white fore-super and a brown cape, nape and mantle, because at the moment it’s very much in shadow and it’s not helping?

Cheers
 

Pedrambirder

Well-known member
Iran
Can you lighten the images Pedram, it might result in a contrasty white throat suffused with a “pinky” under-wash, plus a white fore-super and a brown cape, nape and mantle, because at the moment it’s very much in shadow and it’s not helping?

Cheers
Sure, check the modified ones, pls.
 

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KenM

Well-known member
Thanks Pedram👍 by my reckoning, looking at Mountain Chiffchaff in Collins, this compares extremely well!, and I would like to hear any arguments against it being so.

PS did it look “pinky washed on the underparts in the field Pedram?

Cheers
 

Pedrambirder

Well-known member
Iran
Thanks Pedram👍 by my reckoning, looking at Mountain Chiffchaff in Collins, this compares extremely well!, and I would like to hear any arguments against it being so.

PS did it look “pinky washed on the underparts in the field Pedram?

Cheers
Thanks for your comment,
Actually, I didn't notice the colour in the field, I just tried to take some focused shots of this fast moving Warbler!
 

Muppit17

Well-known member
The bicoloured supercilium that is bright before the eye, and meets over the bill, is what I remember most from the Mountain Chiffchaffs I saw in Georgia.

This bird has the same features.

However, I am not sure if P.c. brevirostris is that simple to eliminate.
 

andyb39

Well-known member
The bicoloured supercilium that is bright before the eye, and meets over the bill, is what I remember most from the Mountain Chiffchaffs I saw in Georgia.

This bird has the same features.

However, I am not sure if P.c. brevirostris is that simple to eliminate.
Or the menzbieri race, which could conceivably winter here. I know virtually nothing about it.
 

Muppit17

Well-known member
Or the menzbieri race, which could conceivably winter here. I know virtually nothing about it.
I did a bit of research on menzbieri after I saw a strange phylloscopus in Uzbekistan this year. Most of the illustrations in UK books don't match the birds seen in Iran/Turkmenistan. This are greyer with cleaner underparts, more akin to tristis.

On that basis, I don't think it can be menzbieri
 

Grahame Walbridge

Well-known member
Or the menzbieri race, which could conceivably winter here. I know virtually nothing about it.

I did a bit of research on menzbieri after I saw a strange phylloscopus in Uzbekistan this year. Most of the illustrations in UK books don't match the birds seen in Iran/Turkmenistan. This are greyer with cleaner underparts, more akin to tristis.

On that basis, I don't think it can be menzbieri
Does not look like menzbieri either in terms of plumage or, structurally Chiffchaffs in Iran and Armenia

Looks good for Mountain Chiffchaff, presumably, sindianus at this location.

Grahame
 

andyb39

Well-known member
Thanks for this, Grahame. An interesting long read.

Yes, the modified images look good for Mountain Chiffchaff. It's interesting to note just how far this location is from the breeding ranges of both lorenzii and sindianus, although on eBird, there's a record from Minab, near Bandar Abbas. Most images from Iran are from the Tehran area and presumably involve lorenzii from the Caucasus.

The reason I asked for a more precise location is that if the bird had been seen near the coast, it would not have been that far, as the crow flies, from the Batinah coast of Oman - it's still unclear whether all birds in the Gulf are abietinus or whether other races are represented. After seeing the actual location and noting that menzbieri is found in N Iran and Tajikistan, my little theory was that it might be a bird from one of those populations moving south for the winter. However, the photos in the article clearly show a very different form.

@Muppit17 Do you have any images of the bird you saw in Uzbekistan?
 

Muppit17

Well-known member
Thanks for this, Grahame. An interesting long read.

Yes, the modified images look good for Mountain Chiffchaff. It's interesting to note just how far this location is from the breeding ranges of both lorenzii and sindianus, although on eBird, there's a record from Minab, near Bandar Abbas. Most images from Iran are from the Tehran area and presumably involve lorenzii from the Caucasus.

The reason I asked for a more precise location is that if the bird had been seen near the coast, it would not have been that far, as the crow flies, from the Batinah coast of Oman - it's still unclear whether all birds in the Gulf are abietinus or whether other races are represented. After seeing the actual location and noting that menzbieri is found in N Iran and Tajikistan, my little theory was that it might be a bird from one of those populations moving south for the winter. However, the photos in the article clearly show a very different form.

@Muppit17 Do you have any images of the bird you saw in Uzbekistan?
Hi Andy

Images were posted on this ID query thread.
 

andyb39

Well-known member
Hi Andy

Images were posted on this ID query thread.
Apologies, it must have slipped past me.
 

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