Multi Binocular Comparison of popular models | Kowa, Pentax, Nikon, Sightron, Atlas (1 Viewer)

[Chicolom]

Hi All,

I'm a new member. I've been researching binoculars for a while and the search results kept bringing me back to this forum. I learned a lot by reading through tons of threads, so I wanted to say thanks to everyone here for contributing all this useful info on binoculars!! :t:

My first and only binocular was the original (I think) Nikon Monarch ATB 8x42 (this one). I purchased them back in 2005, and I loved them and used them for over a decade until I lost them about 2 years ago. I looked for them everywhere, but sadly they're gone for good. So I've been in the market for some new bins.

After researching I decided to go with two popular recommendations: the Kowa YF 6x30, and the Pentax Papilio II 6.5x21. I've had them about two weeks now and I absolutely LOVE them both.


I've posted some thoughts on them below:

Pentax Papilio II 6.5x21

• Affordable!
• Adorably compact
• Lightweight (only 10 oz!)
• Very bright for a 21mm objective (3.2mm exit pupil)
• Good DOF
• Insanely Sharp
• Close focus is fantastic

The Pentax Papilio is definitely my favorite. I've always had a soft spot for the compact reverse-porro designs, and love the look and ergonomics of the Papilio. They look like some piece of high-tech spy gear. Build quality seems good, there's some soft rubber armoring, but I wouldn't want to drop them as the close focus enabling objectives-on-a-rail system probably isn't the most durable design. I like the focus wheel, as it's very fast to turn which lets you rapidly "roll" in and out of focus to nail that sweet spot. I love the 6.5x magnification on them as it gives you the advantage of having a brighter image, larger exit pupil, and bigger DOF. I'm glad I went with the 6.5x as it makes the whole binocular more versatile and usable at more varying light settings (whereas 8x would be more for daytime only). The image seems quite large for only being 6.5x though. I literally had to do several double-takes looking at the body to make sure I had ordered the 6.5 and not the 8.5 model by mistake. I compared them to my brothers Nikon 8x25 ProStaff ATB, and I definitely prefer the view from the Pentax. I think If I could only have one bin this would be them. They're so versatile and sharp, and the compact size means there's no excuse for not taking them with you.


Kowa YF 6x30

• Affordable!
• Small size for a (non-reverse) porro
• Compact, ergonomic, rugged and waterproof
• Super bright with large exit pupil
• Relaxing view with wide FOV and massive DOF
• Pleasing 3D image

I picked these up new for $59 on amazon. The feel in the hand is excellent - they're compact yet very ergonomic and easy to grip onto. The rubber armouring feels good in the hand. They feel fairly durable and capable of taking a few knocks (certainly more than the Papilio). The all black armouring and "Kowa" badge looks classy, although the red on the focus wheel looks a bit toy-ish. Makes them harder to loose though |:$| The focus knob on mine is a little stiff, but it's not that big a deal as things are usually in focus most of the time anyways due to the massive DOF.

I actually bought both the 6x30 and the 8x30 to compare, but I ended up preferring and the 6x30 (and I went into it wanting to like the 8x more). The 6x30 just gave a more pleasing and relaxing view IMO, thanks in part to the non-shaky 6x mag, the wider FOV and deeper DOF (making focus easy), and the easy-to-place 5+mm exit pupil. Just an overall more relaxing/pleasant view. The 8x30 I had might have some some kind of minor collimation problem as the sharpness seemed a slightly warbly in one of the barrels (not sure though, I'm no expert on things like that). I just know I kept fiddling with the diopter adjustment on the 8x but never quite got it to look 100% right to my eyes. Overall I just enjoyed the 6x a tad more, and it was a more relaxing view. It was also a better complimentary binocular to my Papilio. I say that because I noticed that the 8x mag on the Kowa actually seemed like less magnification than the 6.5x mag on the Papilio. I was getting a larger and sharper image on the Papilio then the 8x30 Kowa. So overall the 6x30 model was the winner in my book. They're also super bright, and the color appears very neutral. The Papilio's have a more warm-reddish tint.



The Kowa is going to live in my car as my rugged always-on-hand beater binocular, and the Papilio is my compact versatile all-rounder (I LOVE it).

I want to get one more, this time in the popular 8x magnification to complement them, and then I swear I'll be done *crosses fingers* o

_________________________________________________________________

I ordered the three 8x's to compare. Winner stays, losers go back. They are:

Nikon Aculon 8x42
Sightron SII Blue Sky 8x32
Atlas Intrepid ED 8x42.

What do you guys think?? Good choices? Anything else I should look at in the 8x42ish range? Keep in mind I'm only interested in Binoculars that punch above their price point and offer the best values.

I'll post my thoughts on the above three when they arrive later in week!

Thanks for reading

 

[Chicolom]

I also have a sweet spot for cheap compact reverse porro prisms, so I MIGHT order another one, just to have around and throw in the pocket.

Some options would be the Olympus Tracker 8x25, and the Roamer 8x21, both of which I've read many positive comments.

Also, has anyone heard of or tried this Kenko 8x25 reverse porro?
http://www.kenkoglobal.com/optics/binoculars/sg/8x25mc_sg_twist-up.html

Anyone recognize the design as an OEM for another bin? The specs seem decent, fully multi-coated, Bak-4 prisms, twist up eyecups, a click-stop diopter.
It's on amazon for $36. If it's as good as the Olympus Tracker that's a great price, but I haven't come across much on it apart from this japanese review

 

[CliveP]

I got a 7x18 Carson Mini Scout which so impressed I have now ordered the 8x22.

The 7x18 has a larger view that my 6.5x Papilio II and it's about 1/3 of the volume of the Papilio and less weight of course.

The drawbacks are it is very small (this is also a positive) so not easy to hold and not as comfortable as the Papilio due to needing to get your eyes in much closer with the Carson.

I'm hoping the 8x22 will solve some of these issus in that it will be slightly larger and easier to hold and has a little more exit pupil and may not have such truncated exit pupils as the 7x18 which leads to a sort of fuzzy cloudy edge to the wide view and seems to tire the eyes more.

I'm taking the 7x18 out today (finally some sun due) to have a proper appraisal but using from home it's great and very cheap but the coatings and prisms are definitely good as I can see it has more clarity and contrast than some of my larger 8x25 and 8x28 roof prism bins.

The Papilio resolves a bit more but shows less vibrant colour than the Carson but over all the Papilio is a better quality view with it's sharper edege to the view and perfect CA control but the Carson is also very sharp resolution wise and with very good CA control.

I hope the 8x22 Carson Scout will be more comparable to the Papilio and yet still much smaller only without the extreme close focus.

The 7x18 I can put in the zip pocket on my sleeve and hardly notice it there which is another major point for it and the view is surprisingly large and detailed but still retains the eyetiringness of a true compact which I suppose is the issue with pretty much all of them. The nature of the beast.

I had a quick view outdoors with the Carson yesterday and I was surprised again at it's distance viewing ability but there is a question of it's ease of use regarding eye straining and I hope to discover more about this today. Viewing garden birds it is very good indeed. I also want to see how it compares with my 6x16 monoc for something compact to carry when I don't have my larger bins.

I think if the Carson 7x18 simply had larger prisms then it could be entering the realms of excellence so this is what I am hoping for with the 8x22 when I finally get that but I would definitively buy another 7x18 if there was one with slightly larger prisms although event the Papilio suffers from truncated exit pupils as you can see the flat edge quite easily when you look at the them but it doesn't affect the view really. The Carson is much more truncated and with less eyerelief also this does cause a problem and yet they are still very good especially for the price.

 

[David in NC]

Welcome to the forum Chicolom!

I can't help much at all as I've never "gotten on" with the compacts bins. I've owned a few and handled a few more but I just like a larger exit pupil.

Of the three 8x bins you mention, the Blue Sky is the queen of this forum but I've never had the opportunity to handle one. The Atlas has STELLAR reviews on Eagle Optics website. I *think* I'd like the Atlas personally as I like the larger EP but that's a guess only.

Good luck and enjoy "the hunt" for the best bins for you. Please keep us updated and participate!

 

[Chicolom]

I got a 7x18 Carson Mini Scout which so impressed I have now ordered the 8x22.

The 7x18 has a larger view that my 6.5x Papilio II and it's about 1/3 of the volume of the Papilio and less weight of course.

I saw that one a while ago and put it on my Amazon wishlist.

You don't by chance of a picture of the Carson next to the Papilio so I could judge the size difference?

 

[Chicolom]

Welcome to the forum Chicolom!

Good luck and enjoy "the hunt" for the best bins for you. Please keep us updated and participate!

Thanks!

 

[CliveP]

I saw that one a while ago and put it on my Amazon wishlist.

You don't by chance of a picture of the Carson next to the Papilio so I could judge the size difference?

No sorry, not at the moment but the dimensions of the Carson MiniScout I can confirm (websites not always accurate) are 4x2.5x1.5 inches.

It's certainly less than half the Papilio size. Definitely fit a shirt pocket without the case.

 

[Chicolom]

The three binoculars arrived, and I gave them a day of testing.
I'm definitely keeping the Atlas, definitely NOT keeping the Nikon Aculon, and most likely...keeping the Sightron too


The Nikon Aculon's eye-cups are an instant deal-breaker. Their massive diameter prevents me from getting them in my eye sockets. I can't get a nice big round "O" view - instead I get the distant vignetted double-O vin diagram bicycle wheel view. As for the optics, they're nice and sharp in the middle, but things are more washed out with less contrast compared to the others. There's noticeably more CA compared to the others too. The lack of full multi-coatings must be hurting it. To top it all off, they're pretty massive size-wise. I easily prefer the Kowa's to these.


The Atlas Intrepid. Wow, these are very bright, and they have a very large and immersive FOV. When I looked through the Atlas for the first time, the image really popped and I heard myself say "Whoah" out loud, which is always a good sign. Bright and immersive, amazing colors and clarity, sharp, no CA. Nothing to complain about here image wise. The body is a bit plain and OEM looking, but looks pretty understated and classy. Reminds me of Swarovski. I like it fine. Smooth and comfy to hold and I love the open bridge design. The eyepiece and objective covers are solid too.


When I jump from the Atlas down to the Sightron, the main thing I notice is a bit dimmer image and a narrower FOV. That's about it. Basically I'm a little more aware that I'm looking through a scope, and the view isn't quite as immersive. Apart from that there's little to complain about. Sharpness between the two is so similar that I can't really say which is sharper. Slightly different white balance skew on each. The Atlas focuses closer by a foot or so. The Sightrons are smaller and lighter than I was expecting. The ergonomics are great. The focus wheel on mine is just perfect, not too lose or too tight and with no wiggle or play. An all around excellent little binocular. I swapped the Sightron's eyepiece rainguard with my Kowa, as the Sightron's rainguard fits perfectly snug on top of the Kowa.


I can't decide between the two...so I think I may have to keep both!

 

[Chicolom]

More comparison photos...

 

[CliveP]

Ok I took a few pics. Just give me a second and I'll add them to this.

It is an interesting size comparison.

 

[Chicolom]

Ok I took a few pics. Just give me a second and I'll add them to this.

It is an interesting size comparison.

Thanks for the pics! That helps a lot.

Oh wow, that IS tiny. And I do love tiny binoculars...

 

[CliveP]

Thanks for the pics! That helps a lot.

Oh wow, that IS tiny. And I do love tiny binoculars...

Don't expect the build to be as good as the Papilio. The Carson body and lenses are good but the focus mechanism is very rudimentary although accurate both near and far. The first one I got came loose and seized solid.

Yesterday I filed the end off the focus wheel on this new one as it was sticking into my forehead and not allowing me to get close enough to the eyepieces but that fixed it, however it was plain to see that it's not a great mechanism. While I was at it I also tightened the hinge and sorted out the close focus to about 2m and this worked well outdoors yesterday but I did have to shorten the focus wheel by just a mm or so and I want to get out and check them again but I'm as usual waiting on another bin delivery:eek!:

 

[PhilR.]

Thanks for putting up the very detailed picture of the Intrepid. They look to be a clone of the Zen-Ray ED2, and I would wager that they are made in the same factory. The Z-R's are a decent buy at their normal prices, but the Atlas versions would qualify as an excellent buy at their current sale price. I can't think of a better 36mm or 42mm bino for $199.......

 

[Chicolom]

Thanks for putting up the very detailed picture of the Intrepid. They look to be a clone of the Zen-Ray ED2, and I would wager that they are made in the same factory. The Z-R's are a decent buy at their normal prices, but the Atlas versions would qualify as an excellent buy at their current sale price. I can't think of a better 36mm or 42mm bino for $199.......

Yes, the colors and clarity on this Atlas are really incredible. Everything looks better than real life.

Amazing view for $199.

 

[Chicolom]

Some more detail shots. Click images for high res...
Left to right: Pentax Papilio 6.5x21, Kowa YF 6x30, Sightron SII 8x32, Atlas Intrepid 8x42

 

[Chicolom]

I picked up the Olympus Roamer 8x21 and the Pentax UP 8x21.

The Pentax is superior.

Slightly brighter, better color, and more contrasty. The view on the Pentax UP 8x21 is essentially very similar to the Papilio, but in a 8x21 format. So compared to the Papilio, all the usual higher mag changes apply - the UP 8x21 is dimmer, more narrower FOV, eye placement a bit more finicky, etc. Color balance seems slightly cooler/bluer. Sharpness is still excellent, just like with the Papilio.

Personally, I think a 7x magnification would probably be better on a tiny porro like this, as it gets harder to hold 8x steady when you get this small, and the 6.2° FOV is getting a bit cramped. The 6.5x on the Papilio is great. Still, this Pentax UP porro performs as good as an 8x21 can, so I can't fault it. 7x would suit it better though. I'd recommend against getting it in 10x21

It's fully multi-coated, which seems to pay off. The Roamer (and Carson 7x18) are only fully coated. They are both more washed out, hazy, and greenish compared to the Pentax. Build quality is also better on the Pentax. It has a touch of rubber armoring and is more solid with pull out eye cups vs fixed on the others. Size is very close between Pentax UP and Olympus Roamer. The Pentax is a touch taller, making it slightly more bulky overall, but otherwise they're pretty similar in size. The Pentax definitely weighs more though.

The Pentax UP 8x21 is a keeper. I returned the Olympus Roamer.

 

[Chicolom]

More pics

 

[Ratal]

I've the Sightron 8x32, and wouldn't swap my pair for anything, I'm totally able to be happy whilst I save for swaro 8x32s.

# Even then the sightrons will be a perfect second set of a loan pair. Mine are for the money and weight, incredible.

 

[CliveP]

I picked up the Olympus Roamer 8x21 and the Pentax UP 8x21.

The Pentax is superior.

Slightly brighter, better color, and more contrasty. The view on the Pentax UP 8x21 is essentially very similar to the Papilio, but in a 8x21 format. So compared to the Papilio, all the usual higher mag changes apply - the UP 8x21 is dimmer, more narrower FOV, eye placement a bit more finicky, etc. Color balance seems slightly cooler/bluer. Sharpness is still excellent, just like with the Papilio.

Personally, I think a 7x magnification would probably be better on a tiny porro like this, as it gets harder to hold 8x steady when you get this small, and the 6.2° FOV is getting a bit cramped. The 6.5x on the Papilio is great. Still, this Pentax UP porro performs as good as an 8x21 can, so I can't fault it. 7x would suit it better though. I'd recommend against getting it in 10x21

It's fully multi-coated, which seems to pay off. The Roamer (and Carson 7x18) are only fully coated. They are both more washed out, hazy, and greenish compared to the Pentax. Build quality is also better on the Pentax. It has a touch of rubber armoring and is more solid with pull out eye cups vs fixed on the others. Size is very close between Pentax UP and Olympus Roamer. The Pentax is a touch taller, making it slightly more bulky overall, but otherwise they're pretty similar in size. The Pentax definitely weighs more though.

The Pentax UP 8x21 is a keeper. I returned the Olympus Roamer.

I have mentioned a few times that the Roamer, is that in the US of Oxford?, DPS thing was no good.

I like the colour with the Carson. It's richer than with the Papilio, to me. The Papilio seems on the cool side by comparison.

Have you not taken a file to the Carson focus wheel yet. Does the focus wheel not press into your head when to try and get close enough to the eyepieces to get the full view?

How do you know the Carson isn't multicoated? It doesn't matter anyhow as it is well bright enough whatever it is.

I'm going to take mine out to see what difference sanding down the open end of rubber focus wheel cover made as it does seem to have helped with my eye placement and therefore the distortion seems greatly reduced and it may now be very useable but I hope to find out for sure today if there is any real improvement. It certainly is better from here at home. If I have managed to fix it then I think I will definitely have to order the 8x22 Scout or maybe I might just use this 7x18 a lot.

 

[The-Wanderer]

The little RP Kenko is for sale via Amazon uk for about £37: i recall paying nearly twice that for my Olympus in the same format, and I regarded the latter as a good buy at the time!