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New edition of Fågelguiden (Collins Bird Guide). (1 Viewer)

Butty

Well-known member
the hardback version is published before the soft back. When the fist edition was published I preordered through Bird Watch magazine but was frankly annoyed sometime later when the soft back.appeared.
Common/standard practice in publishing. Obviously it is deliberately engineered purely to increase profit and arises from the facts that a) due to the nature and willingness of the market there are higher profit-margins on hardbacks, and b) some who would actually prefer softback are prepared to buy hardback rather than wait for the version they really want - and then perhaps even buy the softback too. In other words, it's nakedly taking advantage of people's susceptibilities. Such are capitalism and the free market.
 

kuzeycem

Medicinal Birding
Turkey
Anyone get the Swedish version of this? Dying for some sneak peeks.
Apparently Saunder's Tern has been elevated to full treatment - was surprised at first but then I remembered about the tiny Egyptian population.
 

John Cantelo

Well-known member
Anyone get the Swedish version of this? Dying for some sneak peeks.
Apparently Saunder's Tern has been elevated to full treatment - was surprised at first but then I remembered about the tiny Egyptian population.
Regarding Saunder's Tern I gather that Killian Mullarney & Oscar Campbell have co-authored a paper in the latest issue of Dutch Birding dealing with the identification of the immature and winter plumages of this species pair. Contra previous statements this is easier than identifying adults in breeding plumage. I wouldn't be surprised if the paper includes the illustrations from the new edition.
 

nkbj

Niels Kristian Bech Jensen
Denmark
Anyone get the Swedish version of this? Dying for some sneak peeks.
Apparently Saunder's Tern has been elevated to full treatment - was surprised at first but then I remembered about the tiny Egyptian population.
Yes, Saunder's Tern has a full entry in the Swedish edition. On the other hand Tajga Bean Goose and Tundra Bean Goose are not split. They are in Denmark.
 

John Cantelo

Well-known member
Slightly off-topic, but relevant to the last few posts, there's been a bit of a spat between Killian M and Ian Sinclair on the former's FB page (which shows the illustration of Saunder's Tern in the new guide) about the status of Saunder's Tern. Sinclair was, I thought, somewhat intemperate and didn't do himself any favours but is there anything online (a paper by 'Clancy' was mentioned) about the taxonomic status of this pair?
 

nkbj

Niels Kristian Bech Jensen
Denmark
Slightly off-topic, but relevant to the last few posts, there's been a bit of a spat between Killian M and Ian Sinclair on the former's FB page (which shows the illustration of Saunder's Tern in the new guide) about the status of Saunder's Tern. Sinclair was, I thought, somewhat intemperate and didn't do himself any favours but is there anything online (a paper by 'Clancy' was mentioned) about the taxonomic status of this pair?
IOC World Bird List shows Saunder's Tern with species status.
 

Maffong

Well-known member
Slightly off-topic, but relevant to the last few posts, there's been a bit of a spat between Killian M and Ian Sinclair on the former's FB page (which shows the illustration of Saunder's Tern in the new guide) about the status of Saunder's Tern. Sinclair was, I thought, somewhat intemperate and didn't do himself any favours but is there anything online (a paper by 'Clancy' was mentioned) about the taxonomic status of this pair?

Ian Sinclair has proven himself times and times again to be an insufferable asshole on Facebook. It's not the first time he outright attacks someone, because he simply does not believe that Saunders's Tern could be a valid taxon. He may have been somewhat of a "great" birder in the past, but right now he is someone who keeps launching cyber bullying attacks on others just out of spite.
 
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pbjosh

missing the neotropics
Switzerland
One more reason to get rid of honorifics
...apart from the quaint ones. Leave Mrs Moreau's warbler alone. And Montezuma oropendola.

I agree with you both. I dislike almost all honorifics, even if the folks involved were good people. The problem is that the honorific tells you NOTHING about the bird. An example I like is Geoffroy's Daggerbill and Choco Daggerbill. One of the names tells you a LOT about where to find the bird, the other only tells you that it is distinct. In this case, I am guessing I'm not alone in just remembering them as "Choco and the other one."

However I do think a few well established honorifics, or a few that are sort of beloved by birders are worth keeping. IE, Lady Amherst's Pheasant, Mrs Moreau's Warbler, Prince Ruspoli's Turaco, Rosita's Bunting (shame this was changed IMHO), Wallace's Standardwing are really evocative and I would be bummed to see them go.

It would also be VERY disruptive, and not very helpful to general knowledge in the public, to rename something like Anna's Hummingbird or Harris's or Swainson's Hawk which are relatively very well known by lay people.
 

Maffong

Well-known member
Anyways, let's not turn this thread into another one of those. I'm sorry I started with the topic to begin with.
I look forward to the new 'Svensson' as it's often called in Germany. KM has also pointed out in the Facebook thread mentioned above, that it'll likely take a while before the app will be updated too. I really hope that when that happens the usability gets addressed too...
 

Butty

Well-known member
I really hope that when that happens the usability gets addressed too...
I can't understand why the app isn't criticised more often. As a modern app it is really minimal in functions and operation, and barely better than a straightforward PDF with sound recordings added. Given its dismal functionality, if they make any charge at all for upgrading it to edition 3 level they really will be taking the p...
 

kuzeycem

Medicinal Birding
Turkey
Yes, Saunder's Tern has a full entry in the Swedish edition. On the other hand Tajga Bean Goose and Tundra Bean Goose are not split. They are in Denmark.
Any other juicy tidbits? I am especially curious if Turkestan/Mediterranean Short-toed Larks are split.
 

exilipes

Well-known member
I can't understand why the app isn't criticised more often. As a modern app it is really minimal in functions and operation, and barely better than a straightforward PDF with sound recordings added. Given its dismal functionality, if they make any charge at all for upgrading it to edition 3 level they really will be taking the p...
“Some” sound recordings added. I purchased this purely for the sound recordings. I have been disappointed that when wishing to refresh my memory in the field nearly all of those i have wanted to listen to have been absent (to be clear, it’s calls rather than song i have been looking for)
 

nkbj

Niels Kristian Bech Jensen
Denmark
Any other juicy tidbits? I am especially curious if Turkestan/Mediterranean Short-toed Larks are split.
No, they are not split. Turkestan (Alaudala rufescens heinei) and Mediterranean (Alaudala rufescens rufescens) seems to be treated as subspecies of Lesser Short-toed Lark (Alaudala rufescens) with a note that they eventually might be split.
 
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pbjosh

missing the neotropics
Switzerland
No, they are not split. Turkestan (Alaudala rufescens heinei) and Mediterranean (Alaudala rufescens rufescens) seems to be treated as subspecies of Lesser Short-toed Lark (Alaudala rufescens) with a note that they eventually might be split.

Already split by IOC and Clements unless I'm really missing something here? I've only been back in Europe for about 1,5 yrs (wasn't a birder when I lived in Germany previously) and have never thought about the taxonomy of the guidebook. Do they consider themselves their own taxonomic authority?
 

nkbj

Niels Kristian Bech Jensen
Denmark
Already split by IOC and Clements unless I'm really missing something here? I've only been back in Europe for about 1,5 yrs (wasn't a birder when I lived in Germany previously) and have never thought about the taxonomy of the guidebook. Do they consider themselves their own taxonomic authority?
The authors write in the introduction that they follow the taxonomy from Sveriges Ornitologiska Förening (https://birdlife.se) with a few exceptions. The Swedish list is here: https://cdn.birdlife.se/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/Sverigelista2022-kat-A-C.pdf.

The Swedes seems to have split the larks in february 2022 (according to the footnotes in the list), which was probably to late to be included in the book.
 
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pbjosh

missing the neotropics
Switzerland
The authors write in the introduction that they follow the taxonomy from Sveriges Ornitologiska Förening (https://birdlife.se) with a few exceptions. The Swedish list is here: https://cdn.birdlife.se/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/Sverigelista2022-kat-A-C.pdf.

The Swedes seems to have split the larks in february 2022 (according to the footnotes in the list), which was probably to late to be included in the book.

So does the guide change the taxonomy in use for each language edition it publishes, or do they just change the introduction to state that they don't follow whatever the local authority is 100%? Google tells me IOC split the Short-toed Larks in Dec 2020.
 

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