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NL Focus Wheel Problems After Washing (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter quincy88
- Start date
I'm a NL Pure fanboy.
However these focus wheel failures are rather troubling. The reason I got into Alpha optics was their waterproofness and durability. After hearing a few stories about bins fogging up and failing on tropical tours I bought my first Alphas, Leica 8x32 BAs, for my first foreign trip. Weeks later that I caught a wave from the chest down while we were landing a boat on the Osa peninsula. I and the Leicas got soaked. Rinsed the salt water off the bins in a nearby stream and they were good to go, and are still good to go 25 years later.
Western US hunters have a saying: "Vortex has a great warranty and you are going to use it." A fair number have sworn off Vortex after failures on hunting trips. I'd rather Swarovski not get the same reputation.
However these focus wheel failures are rather troubling. The reason I got into Alpha optics was their waterproofness and durability. After hearing a few stories about bins fogging up and failing on tropical tours I bought my first Alphas, Leica 8x32 BAs, for my first foreign trip. Weeks later that I caught a wave from the chest down while we were landing a boat on the Osa peninsula. I and the Leicas got soaked. Rinsed the salt water off the bins in a nearby stream and they were good to go, and are still good to go 25 years later.
Western US hunters have a saying: "Vortex has a great warranty and you are going to use it." A fair number have sworn off Vortex after failures on hunting trips. I'd rather Swarovski not get the same reputation.
Update:
After some use, the focuser has returned to normal friction (as far as I remember anyway). I'm not sure what happened. Perhaps there was some residual moisture. Or perhaps some grit worked its way in during the wash and has since worked its way out.
I called Swarovski and waited for my turn on hold. I spoke with someone there who was very nice, but ultimately just referred me to the online repair page via a pre-written follow up email. While on the phone, they told me that I could respond to the email if I had anymore questions, and the email came from their company email address. I've since responded twice. I have explained that normal functionality seems to be restored, and asked them what I should do. I haven't heard back yet. I expected a response by now, but its only been a few days so I will wait a for a bit. I'll update if and when they get back to me with a recommendation.
After some use, the focuser has returned to normal friction (as far as I remember anyway). I'm not sure what happened. Perhaps there was some residual moisture. Or perhaps some grit worked its way in during the wash and has since worked its way out.
I called Swarovski and waited for my turn on hold. I spoke with someone there who was very nice, but ultimately just referred me to the online repair page via a pre-written follow up email. While on the phone, they told me that I could respond to the email if I had anymore questions, and the email came from their company email address. I've since responded twice. I have explained that normal functionality seems to be restored, and asked them what I should do. I haven't heard back yet. I expected a response by now, but its only been a few days so I will wait a for a bit. I'll update if and when they get back to me with a recommendation.
dorubird
The unskilled mechanic blames his tools!
If we look at the outside of the binoculars it is noticeable that NL has a complicated shape hinge. From an aesthetic point of view, it looks like a pair of binoculars whose armor has been removed from the hinge, showing the parts of the mechanism. He looks very mechanic/over engineering! So, it has several joints at the hinge and focus/diopter system which may require more complicated sealing than usual. That's just my guess...
Update:
The Swarovski rep that I had been corresponding with got back to me eventually.
He said that brand new focusers can be stiff particularly in cold weather.
I said that the binoculars are not brand new, as I've had them over a year and a half, which includes two winters. And reminded him that this weirdness only happened after washing them.
No response so far. I'm not going to reach out to Swarovski again. The focuser seems fine now, and I'm satisfied that whatever was wrong was a temporary side effect of the wash. I'll do something more if the issue comes back.
The Swarovski rep that I had been corresponding with got back to me eventually.
He said that brand new focusers can be stiff particularly in cold weather.
I said that the binoculars are not brand new, as I've had them over a year and a half, which includes two winters. And reminded him that this weirdness only happened after washing them.
No response so far. I'm not going to reach out to Swarovski again. The focuser seems fine now, and I'm satisfied that whatever was wrong was a temporary side effect of the wash. I'll do something more if the issue comes back.
CliveBushnell
New member
@quincy88 - Hi Quincy, I've been reading this thread with interest as my 3 month old SLC 8x56 has this issue. It's only a few months old and happened after a wash. It was stiff enough that I thought I needed to send it in for repair. However, I've found that the wheel has freed up after taking it out and using it for an afternoon. How did you get on with yours?
Clive
Clive
Might this be an example of throwing the baby out with the bathwater? Before Swaros inclusion, how many washed their binoculars of any stripe? Might a different takeaway be to be careful whats on your hands when you handle your binoculars. Dont clean them just cuz. If you feel you must, know of the issues described here and be VERY careful, maybe put some tape around the junction of mech and armor. To not own what many seem to think is a wonderful bino because of something likely unnecessary and that we have control over seems.. well.. a shame.
dwever
Well-known member
We don’t know. The baby has been sent in for warranty work because he couldn’t handle the bathwater.
My bins were coated in fine dust every day in East Africa during days in open observation vehicles (Even my OM-D EM-1 mirrorless didn’t mind a daily thorough rinsing). Salt deposits after hours to and from Robbin Island, South Africa or Ponce Inlet. Alaska red dust in September observing during two six day trips from a six wheeler. I should be able to rinse my sold as waterproof binoculars with impunity. And with Zeiss 7X50 Marines that was no problem.
While different from a washing, it is notable that high-end models thrived in albinos.com’s water submersion tests* without problem (Allbinos on EL 8.5X42, “No reservations in this category. One hour submersion the binoculars managed to survive without any problems.”). We know from Swarovski EL 8.5X42 and current EL RF TA’s that Swarovski knows exactly how to build robust waterproof alpha optics. The take-away is, why is this model so delicate? It is why I use EL’s from another market for birding and nature observation. I remain in awe of the NL’s FOV and image.
*one hour under water at 5 meters depth.
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Hermann
Well-known member
Not really.
Swarovski wasn't the first manufacturer to recommend cleaning their binoculars under running water. Leica was the first if I remember correctly, some three decades ago. And I sure cleaned my Leica 8x32 BAs dozens of times under running water, for instance after I got a lot of saltwater on them. Friends of mine do the same with their Conquest HDs. No problems at all.
BTW, Canon recommends soaking the 10x42 IS in a bucket of water if they got really dirty. Done that once so far after a sailing trip, no problems.
In other words: Don't believe the manufacturers' claims. They can't be trusted. And don't use your binoculars in conditions where they might get dirty. After all, cleaning must be avoided.
No comment.
Hermann
Yes well,
Doesn't seem too big a stretch Hermann to think there might be a difference between running binos under water, dipping them in a trough of water, then carefully drying them off VS using a bar of soap, a brush and water to create a bubbly soapy, sudsy mess combined with that brush flicking stuff hither and yon (how's that one Troubador?).... maybe? Dont ya think?
Did not say cleaning was to be avoided. Careful.
"No comment"? Of course you did and do
Well I can tell you guys one thing for certain. The results of a muriatic acid bath followed by a good wire brushing and pressure wash rinse are suboptimal.
This is admittedly not the most fascinating topic. Hope it doesnt go on forever. And apologize for my part in prolonging the thing.
There seems a need though for some perspective. First please read #32 and notice the distinction I failed to make in #28, that there's a difference between immersion in running water, indeed "water proofness," and reportedly what happens with a brush and bar of soap. As I recall it, the very first report of this issue came from a contributor named "NZbinodude" very early on in the life of NLs. NZ was banished for a time (from BF), if memory serves for the temerity of admitting he was primarily a hunter! Returning sometime later, he reported returning the binos to Swaro, moving on to some other brand/model, but I don't recall he reported the outcome of the return. There's been a couple other reports of this issue but like many things with online forums, a story or 2 get repeated and repeated, pretty soon a thing goes from report, to rumor, to myth, to fact. Was it possible there was a flaw in the sealing of the focuser mechanism of early NLs or even something not quite right in the focuser itself? Sure. Is this something that happened with earliest delivered examples? Is it still happening? Is it common? Maybe more importantly, we do not know, how these folks employed their cleaning regime. What if an over zealous brushing/scrubbing produced the result?
I confess the inclusion of a bar of soap and a brush seemed a pretty underwhelming thing for Swaro to do, especially with a luxury priced/positioned new product, that is arguably fundamentally a tool. If technique was critical to the successful use of the soap/brush and Swaro did not either understand that, or properly describe it, that kinda compounds the "off key" of the whole. If its still an issue, thats especially dumb. But, do we have any proof that an NL would not survive that same 1 hour submersion in water test? Add in the potential for this mythology, (indeed folks here are citing this worry as a reason not to buy an NL - baby and bathwater), and the lack of any concrete information, once again Swaro's policy of non comment has not helped them.... or us.
Dwever you've opined more than once your belief the NL is too delicate for serious field work. The argument you have made seemed pinned to a subjective opinion from handling, its feel, lightness, combined with these few stories, yet again repeated above. I read with interest your report that your new EL RF TAs are something special, different, built from the ground up with tougher use in mind, told to you by a Swaro agent. I hope that is true. Other than what you were told, we have no proof of that though do we? No one has taken one of those apart. Never mind apparently used one enough to report whether long term tough field use proves the promise.
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There were several reports of focuser stiction issues from NL owners (early on). If memory serves, there were a variety of suspected causes - reportedly after cleaning or from just saturation. Similarities were, NL worked fine, then suffered an unexplained dramatic increase in stiction upon saturation or cleaning - some recovered when thoroughly dried, some didn’t. We have no reason to doubt the veracity of these first-hand accounts. However, we are equally unlikely to ever discover the physics/mechanics behind the reported increases in stiction, as it is highly unlikely Swarovski Optik will ever publish a report or press-release on the topic. Hopefully, it was just an issue with very few early units or a materials/design that SW has subsequently corrected. Folks here on Birdforum are very passionate about optics - this often leads to thorough examination of issues/topics, but also frustration when inconclusive.
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