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Olive Sparrow and Olive Warbler (1 Viewer)

Maroon Jay

Airborne
Canada
Do Peucedramidae (olive warbler) and Arremonops (Olive sparrow and family) have English names? For example Trochilidae = Hummingbirds and Laridae = Gulls.
 

Jim LeNomenclatoriste

Taxonomy and zoological nomenclature
France
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Maroon Jay

Airborne
Canada
I guess, yes, warbler and sparrow
https://media1.tenor.com/images/348caef7f383e12d740d7777726e54a3/tenor.gif?itemid=9271200


Are you one of those people who thinks the genera Peucedramus and Arremonops (and a fortiori the family Arremonidae) should change their names, Ocotero and Towhee respectively?

Olive Warbler and Olive Sparrow are not in the same family as other Warblers and Sparrows, and no, I am not wanting to change any names, just trying to find English translations.
 

James Lowther

Well-known member
Peucedramidae = “olive warbler”. (No plural for monotypic families)
Arremonidae = “American sparrows” (John Boyd). I guess “new world sparrows” would work as well

Cheers
James
 

Jim LeNomenclatoriste

Taxonomy and zoological nomenclature
France
Olive Warbler and Olive Sparrow are not in the same family as other Warblers and Sparrows, and no, I am not wanting to change any names, just trying to find English translations.


I think the English name "olive" refer to the invalid protonym of the Ocotero : Sylvia olivacea Giraud,1841, which is preoccupied by Sylvia olivacea Vieillot, 1918 (but I don't know this current synonym). Although the specific name has been changed from olivacea to taeniatus, the English name remained. That said, why olive for a bird that's neither a warbler nor olive ?
 

Maroon Jay

Airborne
Canada
Peucedramidae = “olive warbler”. (No plural for monotypic families)
Arremonidae = “American sparrows” (John Boyd). I guess “new world sparrows” would work as well

Cheers
James

The Olive Warbler is the only bird in its family so I guess "Olive Warbler" will work for a family name as well as the species.
North American Sparrows are in the family Emberizidae, which does not include the Olive Sparrow which is in the family Arremonops which live in Central America and South America. Perhaps I will call them "Southern Sparrows" or something like that. There does not seem to be an English name for them.
 

DLane

Well-known member
Is "Arremonidae" a family now? I thought New World Sparrows were Passerellidae. Even if Arremonidae was a family, its type genus would be Arremon, not Arremonops.
 

Maroon Jay

Airborne
Canada
Is "Arremonidae" a family now? I thought New World Sparrows were Passerellidae. Even if Arremonidae was a family, its type genus would be Arremon, not Arremonops.

You are correct. The family is Passerellidae. I should have used the word genus.
 

DLane

Well-known member
The Olive Warbler is the only bird in its family so I guess "Olive Warbler" will work for a family name as well as the species.
North American Sparrows are in the family Emberizidae, which does not include the Olive Sparrow which is in the family Arremonops which live in Central America and South America. Perhaps I will call them "Southern Sparrows" or something like that. There does not seem to be an English name for them.

I think you have this a bit confused. Olive Sparrow is part of the New World Sparrow family, Passerellidae, which includes all North American sparrows and towhees (minus the members of Passer: House and Eurasian Tree sparrows. These are the "true sparrows" in family Passeridae). Emberizidae is now restricted to the Old World Buntings (but note that Longspurs and Snow Bunting are no longer part of that family, but in their own: Calcariidae).
 
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James Lowther

Well-known member
The Olive Warbler is the only bird in its family so I guess "Olive Warbler" will work for a family name as well as the species.
North American Sparrows are in the family Emberizidae, which does not include the Olive Sparrow which is in the family Arremonops which live in Central America and South America. Perhaps I will call them "Southern Sparrows" or something like that. There does not seem to be an English name for them.

That’s not correct, regardless of whether the name is Arremonidae or Passerellidae, Olive Sparrow is in the same family as the North American Sparrows (see Dan’s post). Genera like Arremonops do not generally have English names.
Cheers
James
 
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DLane

Well-known member
Difficult to change habits XD

Maybe, but I suspect it has to do with the fact that no one has called the committees' attention to the issue. Many/most allow proposals from outside the committee to make such corrections, it just requires someone to do it.
 

Maroon Jay

Airborne
Canada
Olive Sparrow is part of the New World Sparrow family, Passerellidae, which includes all North American sparrows.

Correct but Arromonops live mostly in South America (and Central America). I guess it should say Passerellidae include all North and South American Sparrows. Because it said only North America, I was thinking that the South American Sparrows were in a different family.
 

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