Rare and Scarce Birds in Staffordshire (1 Viewer)

[Richard Powell]

Now you mention it, this seems to be a recent phenomenon, and definitely post-1974. This county council map seems to have wiped off Stoke-on-Trent :eek!:. That white bit to the right of Newcastle Under Lyme would suggest that Stoke isn't in Staffs any more, not in the county council's eyes anyway.

No adding Westport birds to your county list any more! 3

Will you South Staffs boys ever get over those dastardly boundary changes of 1974!

 

[Phil Andrews]

Now you mention it, this seems to be a recent phenomenon, and definitely post-1974. This county council map seems to have wiped off Stoke-on-Trent :eek!:. That white bit to the right of Newcastle Under Lyme would suggest that Stoke isn't in Staffs any more, not in the county council's eyes anyway.

No adding Westport birds to your county list any more! 3

Stoke is a unitary authority (as opposed to the more typical county / district council set-up).

Just out of interest, which birding sites were lost in 1974 (when the Moor-hen was still in nappies?); I might be able to add a few more armchair ticks to my p@ss poor Stafs list.

 

[coloz]

weston sprink nature reserve
A Spotted flycatcher was seen this morning , cheers col

 

[The Moore-hen]

Stoke is a unitary authority (as opposed to the more typical county / district council set-up).

Just out of interest, which birding sites were lost in 1974 (when the Moor-hen was still in nappies?); I might be able to add a few more armchair ticks to my p@ss poor Stafs list.

Still in nappies!? I'll have you know I'm not as old as I look (wasn't born until 1975) so strictly speaking I should 'recognise' The West Mids...but I don't (anything for a bigger list I say!)

The main sites I can think of that were lost (and have added species to my Staffs List) are:

Sandwell Valley (Great Snipe), part of Sheepwash (Dusky Warbler), Fens Pools / Dudley area (Night Heron, Red-backed Shrike) - basically the West Mids took Wolverhampton, Walsall, West Brom, most of Dudley (some was Worcs) etc from Staffs - so you can count the above sites and Stubbers etc if you follow 'Ye Olde Staffs' boundaries...:t:

 

[The Moore-hen]

Just interested to know do any Warks or Worcs birders do the same and include species on their county lists from the old boundaries? I know a lot of birders in e.g. Yorkshire don't recognise any of the new counties up there (Cleveland, Humberside etc)

 

[Kevin Clements]

Nope! I'd lose about 4 species off me Staffs List...:-O

It's hard enough seeing rare birds in Staffs without some pesky politicians nicking part of your county and making a new one...

West Midlands...never! :eek!: (soz Kev! )

No worries Ian. My Staffs list is Ye Olde Staffs. I do keep a West Mids County list (some of the same birds counted on both!), but that's also affected by boundary changes - Chasewater was split between the two in 1974, but the sw half and Swag were transferred back to Staffs in 1994.

Kevin

 

[Nick Smith]

Well 2014 is the 40th anniversary of the creation of the West Mids county, when that terrible annexation took place. British Birds ran an article in July 2008 (Recording areas of Great Britain) and its aim was to try and iron out any anomalies with the boundaries. The following is a quote from the article -
30. Staffordshire
Most of VC 39. Post-1974 county, thus excluding
areas in SW then transferred to West Midlands, and
incorporating UA of Stoke-on-Trent.
Problem Areas: Chasewater was from 1974 to 1995
partly in West Midlands, now again wholly in
Staffordshire.
Maybe in 2014 we can all start singing from the same hymn sheet and have a simple Staffs list? i.e All following the same boundary criteria as set out in BB? Time to move on from those boundary changes of 40yrs ago I think?

 

[Phil Andrews]

Still in nappies!? I'll have you know I'm not as old as I look (wasn't born until 1975) so strictly speaking I should 'recognise' The West Mids...but I don't (anything for a bigger list I say!)

The main sites I can think of that were lost (and have added species to my Staffs List) are:

Sandwell Valley (Great Snipe), part of Sheepwash (Dusky Warbler), Fens Pools / Dudley area (Night Heron, Red-backed Shrike) - basically the West Mids took Wolverhampton, Walsall, West Brom, most of Dudley (some was Worcs) etc from Staffs - so you can count the above sites and Stubbers etc if you follow 'Ye Olde Staffs' boundaries...:t:

Bloody hell - you're younger than me; must have been a tough paper round 8-P

Think that will give me 3 extra Staffs birds (Wryneck, Hoopoe, Night Heron); not bad for a day's work without even leaving Brum!

As far as I am aware most Worcs birders do now use the modern boundaries although it may be that most of the rarer birds from the "lost lands" have been recorded elsewhere in the County. I think I would only gain GN Diver (at Bartley Res).

 

[nutcracker1965]

im only down the road at brocton and will twitch anywere in the uk,if you want a day out mate p.m. me ian

 

[The Moore-hen]

Thanks Phil! Yeh I'm still a 'young' 36 but them paper rounds in South Staffs were tough...bloody long drives them posh people have got...:-O

Can't see any of us old school changing from old boundaries to post 1974 any time soon...guess if some politicians did the same again and took a prime site like Gailey, Westport or Utch we wouldn't be too happy if in 40 years time the 'wipper snappers' of the day told us we couldn't count them on our Staffs Lists...

News for the 14th May

Osprey - near Longton at Weston Sprink NR at 13.20
Sanderling - Branston Pits

 

[chris23565]

Still in nappies!? I'll have you know I'm not as old as I look (wasn't born until 1975) so strictly speaking I should 'recognise' The West Mids...but I don't (anything for a bigger list I say!)

The main sites I can think of that were lost (and have added species to my Staffs List) are:

Sandwell Valley (Great Snipe), part of Sheepwash (Dusky Warbler), Fens Pools / Dudley area (Night Heron, Red-backed Shrike) - basically the West Mids took Wolverhampton, Walsall, West Brom, most of Dudley (some was Worcs) etc from Staffs - so you can count the above sites and Stubbers etc if you follow 'Ye Olde Staffs' boundaries...:t:

Ok, apologies in advance but I will no doubt upset a few of you.

I don't see a problem having species on your list, IF at the time these areas were under the banner of Staffs but once under West Mids then they should only come under your West Mids list, as someone said too me this morning, imagine losing somewhere like Blithfield to Derbys (as if they aint got enough reseviours) then what you saw when under Staffs stays on your list but anything after that surely can't be counted on your Staffs list as it would be in Derbys.

I'm originally come from St Helens, which was until 1976 was in Lancashire, now it's under Merseyside, I remember I use to keep two seperate lists, pre 76 and then after, although I was only 12 and didn't actually have much on it back then!!

Do the same as Martin Yapp (Regional Tick) and just have a West Midlands list, problem solved.

At the end of the day I guess we all have our own lists and it's up too us all to keep and do whatever we want with those lists.

 

[RetroDude]

The 1974 changes were administrative and were never intended to affect the traditional geographical counties; see e.g. http://www.forl.co.uk/confuse.html

That said, it would now after all these years seem perverse to continue to include e.g. Hengistbury Head/Christchurch Harbour sightings on a 'Hampshire' list. We should have gone with Watsonian vice-counties from the start!

 

[The Moore-hen]

Yeh I agree on some points Chris and I think a lot of the reason birders like myself, Ste Nuttall, The Snapper etc keep an 'olde Staffs' list is because the birders we grew up with like Higgo etc did the same and so to compare lists 'like for like' we did the same. The creation of areas like The West Mids and Merseyside etc were more for administrative purposes for Councils rather than the creation of 'true' new counties. I think the old counties are called Watsonian counties (or something like that!) and these will remain whatever happens in the future in local or national Government so I'll certainly stick to the old routine...plus it's not so far to drive for us 'southern softies' than it is for you 'northerners'...

 

[The Moore-hen]

The 1974 changes were administrative and were never intended to affect the traditional geographical counties; see e.g. http://www.forl.co.uk/confuse.html

That said, it would now after all these years seem perverse to continue to include e.g. Hengistbury Head/Christchurch Harbour sightings on a 'Hampshire' list. We should have gone with Watsonian vice-counties from the start!

Haha I think we definitely cross posted there! Watsonian vice-counties that's what I was thinking of! Nice one...:t:

 

[tighthead]

Weston Sprink NR

Thought it was about time I became a more active participant on the forum, instead of just reading other peoples news. Given that I live in Blurton S-O-T, where the hell is Weston Sprink NR (I'm guessining somewhere near/in Weston Coyney)?

all the best
Pete F

 

[chris23565]

Thought it was about time I became a more active participant on the forum, instead of just reading other peoples news. Given that I live in Blurton S-O-T, where the hell is Weston Sprink NR (I'm guessining somewhere near/in Weston Coyney)?

all the best
Pete F

I was asking that very same question this morning and I live in Stoke on Trent! I believe it's around the Longton area so yes not to far away from Weston Coyney, I'm sure someone will pop up with the answer soon enough.

 

[chris23565]

Westport this morning in heavy rain and snow!! for a spell, produced a mega here in a Turtle Dove in trees by the top pool, it then flew over towards the old sewage works, not sure til I get hold of WJL but I think its only the second ever record at Westport.

 

[coloz]

Thought it was about time I became a more active participant on the forum, instead of just reading other peoples news. Given that I live in Blurton S-O-T, where the hell is Weston Sprink NR (I'm guessining somewhere near/in Weston Coyney)?

all the best
Pete F

The main entrance to the reserve is from (Coyney Grove ) off the main weston rd heading in to the Meir, col

 

[sylvia staffs]

Westport this morning in heavy rain and snow!! for a spell, produced a mega here in a Turtle Dove in trees by the top pool, it then flew over towards the old sewage works, not sure til I get hold of WJL but I think its only the second ever record at Westport.

Keep us updated Chris. Stuck at work so won't be back in Stoke until 6pm at the earliest :-C

 

[Steve Turner]

Westport this morning in heavy rain and snow!! for a spell, produced a mega here in a Turtle Dove in trees by the top pool, it then flew over towards the old sewage works, not sure til I get hold of WJL but I think its only the second ever record at Westport.

Excellent record :t: Like hen's teeth around North Staffs these days...