RSPB Middleton Lakes (1 Viewer)

[JHDraytonbassettpits]

RSPB Middleton lakes

I do hope you are right John but there's lot of 'ifs and buts' or should it be 'ifs and bunds'?

The RSPB might have been compensated but it's no compensation for the breeding and passage birds?

As must be summized by the tone of my posts i for one am very dissapointed with the current situation at Muddleton - hence i do'nt visit anymore. More concern seems to be being shown with regard to permits and where you can access the place (the sure sign of a reserve). They ought to be grateful to anybody who wishes to visit imho. I remember getting pulled over for having my dogs with me whilst a 'birder' was wandering down the spits flushing birds etc!

As for the hide - how much did that cost?

Should i visit i shall access from the top end from the canal it will save a lot of time and trouble.

All the best -

Laurie:t:

Controlling the water levels on the Reserve is the main problem at the moment and EA permission is needed to attempt to do this, regarding flooding, even in serious flood event, it has been at Fazeley only, as a result of river flood water entering the Canal, the only place I have seen this is at KWP where the canal passes Canal pool. The new EA Bund goes from here now to Fisher's mill Bridge to prevent this.
The other factor is reedbed growth (no permission needed from the EA for this ) Nick Martin on the recent guided visit said they would drain the newreedbed pool a little and plant newreeds, this would also bring in those Migrant waders. As unless we have an extened dry period you will only get bits on the reserve (this does not rule out a rare bird turning up) even with water levels up the reserve looks good to attract Spoonbill with it's sloping shores, Nick Martin mentioned the hide cost £60, 000.

Regards, John

 

[baggie_dave]

Hi All

I currently visit the reserve every 2-3 weeks but would like to go every week if possible. I to am concerned about the flooding on the reserve and can only hope in the long term arrangements are agreed which suit all parties and encourages best management of the various habitats of the reserve.

I won't pretend to know all that much about conservation management and the intricies of flood management, all i know is i need wellies pretty much whenever i go!!

This place has had a long history of names and borders with counties and i was wondering if there was anywhere which outlines (say on an overhead satellite shot) the names and locations of the main parts of the reserve? I know where the North Pit is for example, but not up to date on the Jubilee Wetlands or Dosthill etc, as I have never been to that side of the reserve nor know how to get there, where i am and aren't allowed to walk/park etc. The historical names like Drayton Bassett Pits etc have also confused me in the past and the RSPB map doesn't do much to help with names either. I also have no clue of county borders (which doesn't bother me but might be useful if something rare comes along!)

If anyone has any information it would be a huge help to an amateur! Despite visiting more often now i am still relatively new to this birding lark (excuse the pun) and have yet to catch up with the likes of a LSW or Cetti's on the reserve. If anyone is willing to help out one day in showing me around (i am hopeful of maybe coming along to the all-dayer vs UW etc!) it would again be a great help.

Also forgot to ask when the hide will be open and how it will be accessed for example? I tend to get there at the crack of dawn when no-one is around, will it be open then or only via volunteers etc like at Sandwell Valley?

Many Thanks

:t:

 

[geoffw1946]

This morning I called in at the Villa Pit first as not expected much to be on the reserve, here there were 3 Green Sandpiper, 2 Oystercatcher, 1 Little Grebe and 2 Common Tern. The reserve itself was better than I thought although the water levels were still high. 1 Whimbrel and 2 Oystercatcher were on the Jubilee Wetlands and another Green Sand was on north pit. Also seen were 3 juvenile Shelduck, 1 Little Egret. A family party of Nuthatch were on the feeders.
Geoff

 

[rollingthunder]

£60,000 !!!

I've known reserves being bought for less than that..........My god how times change, even taking into account inflation that is a sh1tload of money.

As for water entering the canal - not good for the boaters, take that from me - i have a wellie in either camp.

Until things get 'resolved' the RSPB will be the EA's 'bitch'?

Laurie:t:

 

[JHDraytonbassettpits]

Middleton Lakes

Hi All

I currently visit the reserve every 2-3 weeks but would like to go every week if possible. I to am concerned about the flooding on the reserve and can only hope in the long term arrangements are agreed which suit all parties and encourages best management of the various habitats of the reserve.

I won't pretend to know all that much about conservation management and the intricies of flood management, all i know is i need wellies pretty much whenever i go!!

This place has had a long history of names and borders with counties and i was wondering if there was anywhere which outlines (say on an overhead satellite shot) the names and locations of the main parts of the reserve? I know where the North Pit is for example, but not up to date on the Jubilee Wetlands or Dosthill etc, as I have never been to that side of the reserve nor know how to get there, where i am and aren't allowed to walk/park etc. The historical names like Drayton Bassett Pits etc have also confused me in the past and the RSPB map doesn't do much to help with names either. I also have no clue of county borders (which doesn't bother me but might be useful if something rare comes along!)

If anyone has any information it would be a huge help to an amateur! Despite visiting more often now i am still relatively new to this birding lark (excuse the pun) and have yet to catch up with the likes of a LSW or Cetti's on the reserve. If anyone is willing to help out one day in showing me around (i am hopeful of maybe coming along to the all-dayer vs UW etc!) it would again be a great help.

Also forgot to ask when the hide will be open and how it will be accessed for example? I tend to get there at the crack of dawn when no-one is around, will it be open then or only via volunteers etc like at Sandwell Valley?

Many Thanks

:t:

Hi Dave,
I produced a guide which will answer the majority of questions available from the Courtyard Coffeee shop Middleton Hall craft center, there should be a few copies left. I intend to update the guide soon with all the changes in the mid-Tame valley over the last 2 years.
Jubilee wetlands is the new re-landscaped area between the North pit and the Newreedbed area, so Jubilee wetlands ends at the 2 wicker screens along the bank.
Regarding the hide they are letting the concrete floor dry, when the hide opens we will put out details on here as information is received.

Regards, John

 

[geoffw1946]

Hi All

I currently visit the reserve every 2-3 weeks but would like to go every week if possible. I to am concerned about the flooding on the reserve and can only hope in the long term arrangements are agreed which suit all parties and encourages best management of the various habitats of the reserve.

I won't pretend to know all that much about conservation management and the intricies of flood management, all i know is i need wellies pretty much whenever i go!!

This place has had a long history of names and borders with counties and i was wondering if there was anywhere which outlines (say on an overhead satellite shot) the names and locations of the main parts of the reserve? I know where the North Pit is for example, but not up to date on the Jubilee Wetlands or Dosthill etc, as I have never been to that side of the reserve nor know how to get there, where i am and aren't allowed to walk/park etc. The historical names like Drayton Bassett Pits etc have also confused me in the past and the RSPB map doesn't do much to help with names either. I also have no clue of county borders (which doesn't bother me but might be useful if something rare comes along!)

If anyone has any information it would be a huge help to an amateur! Despite visiting more often now i am still relatively new to this birding lark (excuse the pun) and have yet to catch up with the likes of a LSW or Cetti's on the reserve. If anyone is willing to help out one day in showing me around (i am hopeful of maybe coming along to the all-dayer vs UW etc!) it would again be a great help.

Also forgot to ask when the hide will be open and how it will be accessed for example? I tend to get there at the crack of dawn when no-one is around, will it be open then or only via volunteers etc like at Sandwell Valley?

Many Thanks

:t:

Hi B.Dave,
If you go to www.tamevalleybirding.blogspot.co.uk
You will see under Local Sites (Courtesy of A Archer) "Tame Valley" click on this and it will bring up a satellite picture with names of the various sites on it.
Regarding the flooding, I'd have thought it would be possible to raise the incoming culvert 3 or 4 foot so that it only floods through occasionally, (it needs to be higher anyway to stop erosion). I don't see that it would need permission off the EA as the culvert would still be open.
A volunteer I spoke to today said the hide should be open in September. I don't see why it needs to be kept locked unless there is any vandalism.
Might see you on the all dayer then?
Geoff

 

[JHDraytonbassettpits]

Middleton Lakes

Hi B.Dave,
If you go to www.tamevalleybirding.blogspot.co.uk
You will see under Local Sites (Courtesy of A Archer) "Tame Valley" click on this and it will bring up a satellite picture with names of the various sites on it.
Regarding the flooding, I'd have thought it would be possible to raise the incoming culvert 3 or 4 foot so that it only floods through occasionally, (it needs to be higher anyway to stop erosion). I don't see that it would need permission off the EA as the culvert would still be open.
A volunteer I spoke to today said the hide should be open in September. I don't see why it needs to be kept locked unless there is any vandalism.
Might see you on the all dayer then?
Geoff

Every bit of work completed on the Reserve has to be signed off by the EA, the bund bewtween North and South Jubilee wetlands could be raised and a sluice put in, but then would the EA give permission, the EA also like fish to move freely into the reserve some Spawn here. The RSPB believed they had the design here to stop flooding in south Jubilee wetlands unless a serious flood. Nick Martin on the guided open day walk said they would in some years let the SE or SW Jubille wetlands completely dry out because predators would increase to out number prey. With 3 floods already in a dry summer, I don't believe the SE and SW Jubilee wetlands would ever dryout unless an extreme drought year. It could have been worse if the plan had gone the other way with no water going into south Jubilee wetlands creating stagnant water at least the ducks are happy.
Don't believe all you here from the vols, at the end of May a vol told me the water was not going into the Jubilee wetlands until the fencing was up in late summer as you can see that information was incorrect.
There is more danger to hides in summer than winter with more teenagers about then (the usual culprits, but not always). I have been told a hide has been set alight again at Ladywalk recently.


Regards, John

 

[rollingthunder]

Re: Hide.......

You could, of course, have made the whole thing out of concrete - it would'nt have been the first one! The exterior could be visually 'landscaped' to make it easier on the eye and the material is cheap. The inside could be insulated using non-flammable materials and would render the thing less prone to being burnt down? After all, there's enough 'arson' about at present

As for more predators than prey that situation does'nt exist as far as i know. The food/prey/predator pyramid dictates thus. Predators can gather in large numbers but it is usually for the purposes of mating not feeding - that's a simplification of sorts.

Volunteers are great, i've been one myself but they are a source of 'chinese whispers' as, due to an interest, a little of their own thoughts and wants can often be part of the 'news'.

Some former parts of the 'reserve', non-wetland, have been lost and with the wetland areas not being as useful for either resident or migratory species i would suspect that there has been an overall loss in the range of species. I hope the situation changes but only time will tell. At present it's not a comfortable place to wander around and considering the size and expectations it's nowhere near as productive as it should be even at this stage of it's development. It's not a coastal reserve on the North Norfolk coast where even a grotty puddle will pull something down. Conditions have to be optimum and condusive in order to attract migrants, particularly waders. At present it might be suitable to Eastern European migrant fisherman who will also have a hide to brew up and cook their ill-gotten gains. If you think i am joking then look no further than Sheepwash or Fens Pools...........:C

Laurie:t:

 

[JHDraytonbassettpits]

Middleton Lakes

Re: Hide.......

You could, of course, have made the whole thing out of concrete - it would'nt have been the first one! The exterior could be visually 'landscaped' to make it easier on the eye and the material is cheap. The inside could be insulated using non-flammable materials and would render the thing less prone to being burnt down? After all, there's enough 'arson' about at present

As for more predators than prey that situation does'nt exist as far as i know. The food/prey/predator pyramid dictates thus. Predators can gather in large numbers but it is usually for the purposes of mating not feeding - that's a simplification of sorts.

Volunteers are great, i've been one myself but they are a source of 'chinese whispers' as, due to an interest, a little of their own thoughts and wants can often be part of the 'news'.

Some former parts of the 'reserve', non-wetland, have been lost and with the wetland areas not being as useful for either resident or migratory species i would suspect that there has been an overall loss in the range of species. I hope the situation changes but only time will tell. At present it's not a comfortable place to wander around and considering the size and expectations it's nowhere near as productive as it should be even at this stage of it's development. It's not a coastal reserve on the North Norfolk coast where even a grotty puddle will pull something down. Conditions have to be optimum and condusive in order to attract migrants, particularly waders. At present it might be suitable to Eastern European migrant fisherman who will also have a hide to brew up and cook their ill-gotten gains. If you think i am joking then look no further than Sheepwash or Fens Pools...........:C

Laurie:t:

Middleton Lakes will become the most important site for breeding waders in the Midlands
These details were taken from the RSPB Website. Regards, John

 

[rollingthunder]

John - could be wishful thinking, maybe they meant to say 'at present an important site for birdwatchers walking around in waders'

I share their long-term optimismB

Laurie:t:

 

[geoffw1946]

This morning water levels had dropped about a foot but still fairly high, a Ruff was on the Jubilee Wetlands with a Green Sandpiper and also reported were a Snipe, Dunlin and a Common Sandpiper. Apart from a Little Egret and a singing Willow Warbler it was quiet.
Geoff

 

[GoldenI]

Middleton Lakes will become the most important site for breeding waders in the MidlandsThese details were taken from the RSPB Website. Regards, John

thats a bold statement when rutland water and langford lowfields rspb are taken in to consideration.

as for the £60k hide, i'm staggered. a house could be built for that. a major waste of money :C

 

[punta]

Have to agree 60K is a ridiculous amount of dosh - I would of done it for half that and included central heating and cushions :-O

 

[AlanTh]

Surely the figure should be £6,000 ?

£60,000 would include heating, toilets , coffee machine etc?

 

[JHDraytonbassettpits]

Hides

Surely the figure should be £6,000 ?

£60,000 would include heating, toilets , coffee machine etc?

I believe the Skan hide KWP built many years ago cost £20,000 and it's made entirely of wood, some people have lit fires in there in the past and sections have been replaced.

Regards, John

 

[GoldenI]

sorry, but i dont believe these figures, they are plain silly.

i've been in the skan hide many times and it simply cant have cost that amount

as for the new one i think you need to check the figure

somebody is having a laugh here :-O

 

[JHDraytonbassettpits]

Proposed Visitors centre

sorry, but i dont believe these figures, they are plain silly.

i've been in the skan hide many times and it simply cant have cost that amount

as for the new one i think you need to check the figure

somebody is having a laugh here :-O

Those costs will be nothing compared to the proposed new visitors centre which was planned to go the otherside of the silt pool, the cost of getting electricity and water laid on done there is a fortune. I spoke a while back to a chap who worked for Middleton Hall Trust, Middleton Hall Trust thought about buying Middleton Hall, believing they would get it for next to nothing but the offer he said was £1 million from the Iranian consortium who own it, they purchased the Hall from the gravel company many years ago with a plan for an adjoining Golfcoure, however the planners threw it out.

Regards, John

 

[geoffw1946]

Have to agree 60K is a ridiculous amount of dosh - I would of done it for half that and included central heating and cushions :-O

The concrete for the hide was being laid on the 10th April so it's now taken 4 months at a cost of wages of say £1000 pw for 2 workers, works out at £16,000 but will probably take another month for the guttering and benches to go in (My estimate may be way out of course). However it's only a small proportion of the £400,000 the whole scheme costs.
I'd rather have seen several cheap hides built instead of one expensive one (cheaper to repair if they get vandalised)
The Gazebo in the play area would probably make a good hide if it was moved onto the main reserve, I think that was put up in a day.
Geoff

 

[Phil Andrews]

sorry, but i dont believe these figures, they are plain silly.

i've been in the skan hide many times and it simply cant have cost that amount

as for the new one i think you need to check the figure

somebody is having a laugh here :-O

Having had knowlege of the cost of the recent hides at Upton Warren nothing would surprise me :eek!:

 

[JHDraytonbassettpits]

New hide

The concrete for the hide was being laid on the 10th April so it's now taken 4 months at a cost of wages of say £1000 pw for 2 workers, works out at £16,000 but will probably take another month for the guttering and benches to go in (My estimate may be way out of course). However it's only a small proportion of the £400,000 the whole scheme costs.
I'd rather have seen several cheap hides built instead of one expensive one (cheaper to repair if they get vandalised)
The Gazebo in the play area would probably make a good hide if it was moved onto the main reserve, I think that was put up in a day.
Geoff

It sounds like your desperate to get in that new hide Geoff.
Will be good in bad weather you will be able to see any birds drop in and keep dry at the same time, a luxury at Middleton lakes.

Regards, John