some warbler from south Poland (2 Viewers)

[Michał Jaro]

This bird caught my attention because of the voice (which I attach). Slender, long body, whitish, little buff underparts, rather grayish mantle, whitish supercilium, pale beak ?

 

[KenM]

Looks not dissimilar to Arctic Warbler which might be a candidate, as the initial notes sound like it, without the normally accompanying trill?

Cheers

 

[Michał Jaro]

Thanks Ken, also I can't think of anything else, I record the sound with an ordinary smartphone recorder, maybe it doesn't catch everything?

 

[Michał Jaro]

I add some more photos, maybe they will be helpful.

 

[KenM]

Might be a 3rd record for Poland Michael?

Cheers

 

[PYRTLE]

Did you notice any wing bar or bars at all? And perhaps the leg colouration .

 

[opisska]

The key question is: is it still there and if yes, where?

 

[Michał Jaro]

Ken, I don't know exactly, but it would be one of the first. Maybe the species is slightly overlooked.
Legs were pale. In the pictures - you can see some paler parts on the coverts, but I can’t see any bar. However, the part arctic warblers does not have a visible bar. Also there are some other doubts. On a few pictures, the primary projection looks short - it's not good for arctic. But I don’t know if it is decisive ...
Janie - of course I don't know if the bird is still there - near Czarny Dunajec.

 

[HH75]

Hi all,
I am afraid that I must state straight up, as a starting point, that I really don't think that this is an Arctic Warbler, much as it would be great if it were. For a start, dealing solely with the call, it is an interesting sound, there's no denying that, and it could be said to bear a (very) superficial resemblance to the common call of nominate Arctic Warbler. However, Arctic Warbler calls are far more strident and penetrating, akin to the common flight call of a (White-throated) Dipper, and really rather different to the calls heard in the recording here. See https://www.xeno-canto.org/485166 for a nice example of typical Arctic Warbler calls.
In addition, the short primary projection is a real black mark against Arctic Warbler, and I can't see how one can reconcile this with that species. I freely admit that the head pattern seems well-defined, and could match an Arctic Warbler, or seem to in any case, and that the pale tips to the greater coverts could well be worn away by mid June, but, for me, I suspect that this, in spite of the rather well-defined head pattern and less obvious eye crescents than usual, may well be a juvenile Common Chiffchaff. Here in Ireland, where Common Chiffchaff and Willow Warbler are both very common familiar species, I am very used to being faced by silent birds of either species, and, most of the time, just a glance at the facial pattern is enough for a confident identification to be made. However, I suspect I am not alone in finding at least the occasional fresh juvenile bird, with their unusual plumages, variable bare parts colouration and difficult calls, far trickier than one might expect based on adults in spring/summer and birds on passage in autumn. Some Common Chiffchaffs have surprisingly pale bills and even legs, and I don't mind admitting that I tend to feel better about some juveniles when a parent comes to feed them!
Ignore the adult calls on this recording, and imagine the begging juveniles a little louder. https://www.xeno-canto.org/492403. Of course, I could be wrong, but I feel that I should invoke Occam's razor...
Regards,
Harry

 

[Michał Jaro]

Hi, thank you very much for the extensive explanations. I am not optimistic about arctic, I wrote about my doubts. However, I am far from chiff chaff. Maybe the voice is not very piercing, but remember that I recorded with weak equipment. In the field the voice was quite sharp. Now I will send a slightly strengthened recording. However, I agree - it still doesn't sound exactly like arctic. What's more - the voice is two-syllable, which I noticed only now. I am sending the spectrogram, it is completly different from the linked chiff caff recording. I also showed 2 syllables.

 

[RafaelMatias]

Hi, thank you very much for the extensive explanations. I am not optimistic about arctic, I wrote about my doubts. However, I am far from chiff chaff. Maybe the voice is not very piercing, but remember that I recorded with weak equipment. In the field the voice was quite sharp. Now I will send a slightly strengthened recording. However, I agree - it still doesn't sound exactly like arctic. What's more - the voice is two-syllable, which I noticed only now. I am sending the spectrogram, it is completly different from the linked chiff caff recording. I also showed 2 syllables.

IMO the call is monosyllabic. The alleged second part of the call (the shorter bit, to the right, within the red oval area) belongs to something else calling rhythmically on the background, and indeed overlaps with the sharper "first part of the call" in places (e.g., right on the 7 seconds mark), making it impossible being the same bird uttering both sounds.

 

[Michał Jaro]

Yes indeed, thanks Rafael. So still the most similar voice is arctic ... I would add that the bird was flying between two trees and the recording definitely comes to the individual in the pictures.

 

[lou salomon]

it has already been said, especially by harry, but such a short primary projection excludes arctic warbler. and the call isn't convincing either for me.

 

[Michał Jaro]

First, I'm sorry for tormenting the subject
In the case of primary projection - I noticed the details.
I send two enlarged photos. On one you can see 'stairs' on the primaries (is it possible distruction of the feathers? or is it a normal look?). On the other - the right wing will drop behind the branch, showing a fairly large projection?

 

[lou salomon]

pic 1 in post 1 is the best pic to see primary tips and tertial tips (without being able to measure tertial length). but primaries definitely look short.

 

[Michał Jaro]

Ok. Thanks so much for your help and patience. I have no further questions The bird remains unrecognized

 

[KenM]

It’s interesting how the thread has developed into what it isn’t, as opposed to what it is (If possible from these ambiguous images). I believe the notion of Chiff Chaff is somewhat “shortening” a Phyllosc. that appears attenuated somewhat, not just on the images provided but by Michael’s own observations in the field?

Indeed if the Phyllosc. is as long as it appears in the images, then the supposed position of the pp relative to the overall tail length becomes less than credible for any Phyllosc. that I’m aware of.

Surely the pp must be longer than what might appear in these less than perfect images?

Cheers

 

[Michał Jaro]

I thought I would write nothing more, but Ken provoked me to make some remarks.
The first: voice - which caused my interest. What can we read about it - the arctic's call is quite unlike other phylloscopus. but this one for sure is similar. So let's assume I was wrong - another bird in the area called - which one? There were, pipits (tree, meadow), yellowhamer, whitethroat, citrine wagtail. None match ?.
Further, the morphological features - there are some that match the arctic, like body shape, long neck, supercilium that doesn't pass on the forehead, long, bright bill. I have one more word in my head - hybrid? is possible ?

 

[RafaelMatias]

I thought I would write nothing more, but Ken provoked me to make some remarks.
The first: voice - which caused my interest. What can we read about it - the arctic's call is quite unlike other phylloscopus. but this one for sure is similar. So let's assume I was wrong - another bird in the area called - which one? There were, pipits (tree, meadow), yellowhamer, whitethroat, citrine wagtail. None match ?.
Further, the morphological features - there are some that match the arctic, like body shape, long neck, supercilium that doesn't pass on the forehead, long, bright bill. I have one more word in my head - hybrid? is possible ?

I think Harry's last sentence in post #9 applies here

 

[Michał Jaro]

When I find any similar voice of some common bird, I will certainly agree with it . Thanks Rafael, thanks to everyone who gave their opinions.