Spiders for id/confirmation... Devon (1 Viewer)

[Matt Prince]

Hello, me again.

First off - meta mengei? (Partly on timing - I understand meta segmentata is later in the year)

 

[Matt Prince]

Secondly, is this an achaearanea sp. or am I barking up the wrong web?

Many thanks for any help.

Matt

 

[ta brandreth]

British spider can be notoriously difficult to ident and a specimen is normally required to ID to species level, these pictures, although great don't really give much identifyable, however the structure of the first spider is in my opinion wrong for Meta mengei, it should be bigger in the abdomen and less long in the cephalothorax.

second is an orb weaver, but again would be very difficult to ident to species level...

 

[ta brandreth]

closest guess for spider one would be something like Tetragnatha extensa - hence its long reaching forward legs...

 

[Matt Prince]

Wouldn't t. extensa be even longer in the abdomen than m. mengei?

 

[ta brandreth]

what size is it? - Metas are rarely over 6mm, as i said - to me the structure is wrong, the abdomen should be much more elongate - the clincher would be to examine the epigyne of the female, these spider can not be identified via colouration either - massive variation in individuals.

 

[Matt Prince]

Thanks for the input Ta - I'll see if I can dig out one of the photo's of a male in the pot - should be able to size it from that.

It still looks pretty close to the following to me though - spines, shape, colouring:-
http://www.gardensafari.net/pics/spinnen/meta_mengei_ha2_4601.jpg

And according to Roberts, meta will stretch out when alarmed.

 

[Matt Prince]

Not brilliant resolution, but can see the cm scale in the background (the 1cm mark is just off screen).

I guestimate its around the 5mm mark total body length (assuming the abdomen is slightly curled under in this picture, otherwise its under 5mm)

 

[ta brandreth]

second picture is better - nice palps!

I can see the fairly diagnostic spiky leg hairs - still unconvinced by the first pictures cephalothorax - overall shape and lack of colouration - the structure of the male looks good for Meta.

I think my main point was not to dissuade you from your ident - its great that you are up for entering the tricky world of Spiders UK, and to get good records,from capable people is extremely important,but to species level this is a 'good' hand lens/ microscope job.

 

[ta brandreth]

great website and a fine organisation;

http://wiki.britishspiders.org.uk/index.php5?title=Main_Page

with a link to the online delta key...

 

[Matt Prince]

second picture is better - nice palps!

I can see the fairly diagnostic spiky leg hairs - still unconvinced by the first pictures cephalothorax - overall shape and lack of colouration - the structure of the male looks good for Meta.

I think my main point was not to dissuade you from your ident - its great that you are up for entering the tricky world of Spiders UK, and to get good records,from capable people is extremely important,but to species level this is a 'good' hand lens/ microscope job.

This point is not lost on me. This year I'm "mucking around" to sample a bit of everything. If nothing else this year is showing me the VAST holes in our distribution knowledge for many common things. I wholeheartedly agree with the 'if in doubt leave it out' ethos for records and hence I won't be submitting any of my numerous "punts" at an id. Duff info is worse than no info. However, for my own personal year list - this one is in as probable meta mengei. On the assumption that meta segmentata won't be out yet, otherwise probable meta sp.

Once again thank you for your comments and points.

 

[Matt Prince]

..and especially for the link.