That of which shall not be spoken...... (1 Viewer)

[CliveP]

I think I got exited and overused my 6x16 and the eyestrain began so I'm noticing that these things are more for taking a quick look than keeping to your eye and that's a major drawback were a binocular rules instead.

Been wondering also if this Optima is actually even fully coated never mind multicoated as when I look down it at something white like the white part of this screen for instance then it's distinctly not near to white, more a tobacco tint and I no longer smoke. The Viking is like this also but not just as much but you would think that a Japan supposed quality and relatively expensive monocular would have decent coatiings to go with the high end build but I don't see it and it should be more expected I would have thought given the tiny 2.5mm exit pupil. People use these as medical eyesight aids but I couldn't honestly see this being of much help to them in anything other than very good light in fact it's likely to give them eyestrain?

I am now thinking that this other one I bought is unlikely to be any better so probably made another mistake with that but will see when I get it

Did try the Helios again also today and while it remained unfogged temporarily it actually was quite bright, colourful and good contrast but small fov. It was quite noticeable how much more magnification it had over the 6x16 but I think it seemed more of a difference because of the wide 10deg fov of the 6x16.

Ok, monoculars are nice and small or can be but these are hard work and none that I have are relaxing on the eye for long. This is not good. The 6x16 is perhaps to most useable because of the largest view of the three and it's pretty non-distorted to the edge. The Helios is best for distance but most difficult to use and the Viking is best for macro with it's 3mm exit pupil and better dof close in.

They are all ok if you can be bothered with them but unfortunately none of them are in any way outstanding. My brief at the beginning was for something pocketable that could do some macro and be better than having no binocular along and I suppose these all do that but it's not clear to say that any of them is really satisfying whereas all of my 9 bins are, well maybe that's stretching it a bit with the Bresser, but the others definitely.

 

[CliveP]

"Someone told me it's all happening at the zoo.
I do believe it, I do believe it's true."


Brock

We were worried you had escaped8-P3o

I just realised today that I already had a monocular built into the front door. Good wide angle but bins would probably be better. Maybe I will mount a pair in the door. My 6.5x Papilio would be good or maybe use one of these spare 6x16 monocs.

 

[Stephen Prower]

CliveP

Of course monoculars are hard work! Squinting is hard work!

To get easy two-eyed viewing for any time from a new monocular, you're into the mid-range, 30/32mm objective, phase-corrected, dialectric-coated, etc 250g heavyweight roofs for starters.

You won't find out whether they're for you by starting at the bottom end, and working up.

I only did so by plunging, after that favourable experience 'learning' two-eyed viewing on the nice, but dark, Chinese 'Military' 8x30 Porro.

I didn't however try out what it might be like through viewing through one tube of a decent 8x30/32 binocular.

One for the Kowa 8x32 SV perhaps?


Stephen


Don't waste any of your tiddlers on Rathlin Island! Or even Inch Island. Only your best binocular will do!

 

[Stephen Prower]

Be prepared!

Brock

Glad to have brought back memories of Golders Hill Park zoo!

I did have binoculars with me on the visit I refer to. You got me!

I just thought what a nice example if I hadn't.

And the Stone curlews (plus wild Stock Dove and Redwing) did catch me totally by surprise.


Stephen

 

[CliveP]

I have plenty of and am happy with my bins so I wanted something smaller that might be useful or good.

Why would I want a large monocular? I do have a spotting scope which is fine.

I already mentioned before in the thread that I thought the Kowa SV would make a good monocular as I tried it but I've already got one with both sides which is even better.

The small monocs do what they do but it isn't great. I think I should have gone for something properly coated and with some eyerelief if there even is something small with such things. Why are these things seemingly non-existant in a small monocular yet so common in even small bins?

If the Specwell/Optima 6x16 was a 6x18 or 20 and had full multicoating and more than 1mm eyerelief then we would be getting somewhere.

The 4x12 is good for close in and that's fine and it's the smallest. I like it for what it does well and it probably would be good at an indoor event or museum etc. The others though ......... probably are really only for reading a bus display or road sign.

 

[CliveP]

Ok, this is quite interesting.

I sort of accidentally dismantled the ocular lens group as you can see in the photo.

I forgot which way to put them back of course after I gave them a clean.

So I remembered the outer ocular lens was flat and so for the 3 lens groups (2 doublets and the outer single) I knew at least how one went but I eventually just tried all 8 combinations just to see what would happen and it was quite interesting.

I could get more centre sharpness and dof but with more distortion or edge softness so I settled back with how it was originally, basically no distortion but not the best sharpness in the centre.

It does seem in cleaning these lenses I got a tiny bit more clarity and contrast so worth doing.

Edit: Actually decided I liked one of the sharper versions better so switched to that even thought the out edge is now a bit softer but it definitely seems an improvement to it's distance usefulness now as it focuses very nice and precisely to a good sharpness in the centre. Maybe the cleaning has helped also but I'm thinking now that that could have been better also if I would have had a pure alcohol solution or maybe some strong vodka lying around as my lens cleaner fluid has some detergent in there along with the alchohol and it leaves a slight smear that you can only really see once it all is reassembled so next time I'd get some proper fluid. I did have some but no idea were it is or if it all evapourated and I threw the bottle out as I remember the lid was cracked. Might have another search for it as I think with that I could really get the Optima clean. Should get the new Specwell on Monday so interested to compare with this one.

 

[CliveP]

So on the way to the supermarket today I took the opportunity to put the 6x16 Optima - in the pounch that came with the Helios 8x21 - into my jacket sleeve zip pocket.

Stopped at the river to look at the receding floods and got the monocular out.
To fuzzy around the edges so did a quick infield dismantle and flip around of one of the ocular lenses (I'm good at it by now) and hey presto, all good and the view definitely looks better now after I cleaned the internals than when I first tried it outdoors on the way home from collecting it.

So basically this is what I was after. Definitely much better than having no bins and even sort of enjoyable and it sure is small and pretty unnoticeable to carry.
I was able to check out the view far into the distance that would be impossible with just my eyes and it's a pretty poor light day. What most impressed me about it was the quite good large view relatively speaking for such a tiny thing.

I continued to do my shopping quite contented now knowing for sure that this little thing will be good to have along. I now think there definitely is a place for these so now I'm even pleased with my purchase.:-O:t:

As you may have read it has been quite an up and down emotional journey with these monocualrs as they definitely take some perserverance and accustoming and a bin is in a different sort of league compared to these small monocs but as I say if it demonstrates that it is off use then I'm happy and I think that sorted it out today and I'll probably carry this a lot, maybe even as well as my bins or it alone when I don't have them.

I now recommend them therefore but be aware they are different.

 

[Stephen Prower]

So on the way to the supermarket today I took the opportunity to put the 6x16 Optima - in the pounch that came with the Helios 8x21 - into my jacket sleeve zip pocket.
...
So basically this is what I was after.

CliveP

And we've both arrived at the specifications (and me model also) of mgsphilips' 3 Jan 2014 current two best owned: you, Minox MD 6x16 and me, Helios AMD+ 8x32!


Stephen

 

[CliveP]

Got the new Specwell rebrand (it's an Edward Marcus) and comes with the pouch and endcaps etc.

It seems to have a bit more contrast than my now cleaner Optima so I guess it's properly new clean but seems I didn't do to bad a job with the Optima. Otherwise they seem identical so if I would have discovered that I could clean the Optima earlier I could have done without this new one but it's still very nice and it was a very good bargain, actually they both were.

All I need now is some way of attaching them together to make a binocular although one side would be a bit brighter than the other 8-P

I tried yesterday to bring my 10x25 bin -just folded with the endcaps on- in the same way I had brought the monocular the previous day and to the same place and the bin was more bulky and weighty noticeable on the arm flapping about some in the pocket while I cycled along so I will choose the monoc in future or bring both with the bin in my bag.

I'm still impressed with the Viking brightness etc. Seems to be a good bargain and I would think the 6x16 or 8x20 in that range is just as clear as the Specwell types although the Specwells are supposed to have apochromatic lenses but I see no issue with the Viking lenses in this 4x12. Eye relief is a bit more with my Specwells but I don't think either would work with glases very well.

Still haven't had a proper try with the Helios but I think I'm happier with the wide view 6x16 and it's easy operation plus close focus and after all it fits easily into the Helios case (actually easier than the Helios) so it's just as compact and you do get that spy feeling with it and it did seem to have good contrast outdoors.

I think I'm satisfied and finished with buying any more but if I was looking for another the 8x20 RSPB HD does look the best spec for a higher mag, compact monoc but I think I prefer bins at that stage.

So that's it. I've basically got 2 of the monocular that is of most use to me and my choice of the 3 but I would use the Viking for indoor stuff although the 6x16 works also.

I'm sure now that I am more used to them I will always have a monocular of some sort if not several and I think there should actually be a section created for them on BF as I'd like to read other experiences and reviews of different models for future buying consideration. I'm sure I will look for something more high end down the line. Why not fully multicoated, dielectric prism coated, ED lens, compact monoculars and waterproof? I'd like that but perhaps that's already the RSPB HD 8x20 so if they brought out a 6x16 I'd be on the case but my Specwells will certainly do for now.

 

[tom666]

I have one zeiss 6x18 monocular. I like it. It is light 60grs, a bit narrow fov 120m and ER is acceptable 15mm .
I wonder if Carson MM 6x18 is enough good for eyeglasses for buck up ,what about ER?
I can buy them for about 20 euros.I apreciate any personal opinion.Its dificult in Greece to find any optical instrument and now its difficult buy any from ebay.
.

 

[CliveP]

I have one zeiss 6x18 monocular. I like it. It is light 60grs, a bit narrow fov 120m and ER is acceptable 15mm .
I wonder if Carson MM 6x18 is enough good for eyeglasses for buck up ,what about ER?
I can buy them for about 20 euros.I apreciate any personal opinion.Its dificult in Greece to find any optical instrument and now its difficult buy any from ebay.
.

I just ordered a Carson 7x18 10deg monoc (for about 10euros new cond) and a new MiniScout 7x18 bin (9.3 fov) so I am interested to see how these cheap things fare against my Optima 6x18 which I have been using outdoors and finding suitable enough mainly due to the big flat view, relatively speaking of course and still liking the small size.

The Carson monoc has 7x mag and 10deg fov so the view theoretically should seem even larger than the Optima at 6x with 10deg. I imagine the Carson will be softer at the edges but I look forward to seeing it and if these Carsons are any good then I imagine the MM 6x18 should be also.

Anyhow was trying the Helios 8x21 out yesterday and basically decided it was not for me and then about 15 mins later I met a woman who liked it and bought it there and then which I wasn't expecting. I wasn't going to be using it much if at all so probably for the best.

Then I broke the Hawke Endurance 10x25 binocular focus while I was trying to see if I could fix it so it's gone to the menders and the bill will be as much as I paid for them and more than I just paid for both Carson items but hopefully I will get it back focusing nicely. It started to get on my nerves how the left side was slack compared with the right. To good to throw away so off it had to go.

Had my Kowa SV 8x32 bin along also and using one side of that like a monocular is amazingly good. I had actually to look hard to see much of an improvement using both sides as normal which I find a little disturbing as this is not supposed to happen I don't think but it only seems to be with the Kowa although I haven't tried the Sapphire 8x43 but a Kowa 8x32 monoc just exactly like half of my bin would almost convince me to carry that instead. I was genuinely amazed. Super sharp big bright contrasty view. Actually using both sides seemed to take some of the sharpness and contrast away slightly? in exchange for the bit larger view. The Optima is actually a sort of smaller, duller etc but similar view.

I was looking around with the small monocs and then swopped to the Kowa bins and there was a nearby bush suddenly bursting with birds and I hadn't seen a single one of them previously with the monocs so that put things into perspective for me and still I like the Optima?

3 Whooper swans flew about 20ft over my head and I think I had the Helios to my eye at the time and that was fun, best (closest)view I ever had of them in my life, full soundtrack to. Good last view with the Helios. I was surprised they came straight towards me from a distance and so close over me also when they seem to normally like to avoid people and there was plenty of free space away from me to either side but I certainly didn't mind.

 

[CliveP]

Just been initial checking these Carsons I ordered and first impressions are:

The monocular is very poor. Nice big view but does not give a sharp focus. All very plastic, even the ocular lens I discovered when I dismantled it to check if I could help the focus. There is a glass doublet lens in there also. I thought this was 10deg fov but I was caught out by the 10 inch close focus written on the barrel which looks like 10deg but the fov is fine whatever it actually is? Maybe this was a reject as I got it cheap but they did say it was checked over they just didn't say by a blind person but it has no contrast either. It may do my nephew as a toy he can destroy. I see also that they sell an accessory to attach to phones to turn this into a telephoto lens. I definitely don't think this would be capable of that use even if I returned it and got one that focused sharply. I would not like to think of the photos this would achieve. It is still like looking through plastic (and not even clear plastic) instead of clear glass. Highly don't recommend this.

So the little 7x18 bin. The box says Mini Compact Sport Binocular which may be a Euro name? Anyhow this is a good little bin. How is this even connected to the monocular by the same company it makes you wonder? Ok it isn't the best binocular in the world but there is a really very pleasant view if you get it jammed against your face with the focus wheel resting on your forhead just between your eyebrows. Well you can hold it 1 mm away and still get a decent view and probably with eyecups folded it would be fine for wearers of glasses. Yes I'm a little shocked and I suppose glad that it is actually fun. That's the feeling I get from it, fun. It's so small but the really surprising thing is that it has very good resolution even excellent around the centre. I've been watching gulls flying around and they are very clear and it's easy to see all the different feathers and shades and no CA and small birds in trees are vibrant coloured, clear and sharp. Very good contrast, bright and good natural colour. Off center gets a bit soft but there's plenty of fov in the centre part (it is 9.3 fov) that you can still see all you need to. The focus is not very precise but by no means bad and seems to work for me with the diopter set spot on zero. It really surprises me the detail it can deliver. Doesn't seem to suffer from glare either. It totally blows my Optima monoc away but it is about twice as big and only focuses down to about 3m. I must check it against my Papilio 6.5x but I'm sure that is a much better bin but this is much smaller and seems perfectly acceptable so I'll have to get a run out with it to see how it looks then. The exit pupils are very truncated by the prisms and the hinge isn't very tight but other than that it seems fine. Better ocualars with some Papilio style aspheric lensese and it would be quite brilliant I think though even the Papilio prisms truncate the exit pupils and it doesn't seem to adversely affect that even in low light. I've just compared it against my Bresser 8x28 which I have sitting here and the Carson seems to have better contrast but the light is starting to fade and the Bresser is becoming much clearer but earlier when I compared them the Carson seemed more fun with a better 3d type view. That it even competes with the larger Bresser for satisfaction is pretty good as the Bresser is good to use from sitting here with it's good dof, colour and contrast but the gulls were actually larger and clearer with the Carson?

For the price a remarkable little binocular for sure and there will be a lot of happy tourist with these but it also looks good for very compact bin birding to me. I suppose it would depend on how good a one you get but a good one is going to be be very good. I'm definitely satisfied with this one and I never liked the Olympus PCI 8x21 I had. This seems to be much better.

Shame the monocular wasn't more similar to this as then it would be very good also.

Ok forget all that, the bin just failed. The focus wheel has just screwed off partly and jammed. Not very reliable at about 2 hours.

 

[JerryLogan]

Just noticed new release from Olympus;

http://goo.gl/nrF3Yy

Best,
Jerry

 

[gunut]

those all look useable, and some are very reasonably priced...and its interesting to hear all the varying opinions......but Minox [price/view wise] in my opinion gets the thumbs up for current units Iv tried....and for nostalgia buffs the folding Zeiss Turmon ....

 

[Binastro]

Sliding focus doesn't work for me, and also may nip my fingers.

 

[Troubador]

I have one zeiss 6x18 monocular. I like it. It is light 60grs, a bit narrow fov 120m and ER is acceptable 15mm .
I wonder if Carson MM 6x18 is enough good for eyeglasses for buck up ,what about ER?
I can buy them for about 20 euros.I apreciate any personal opinion.Its dificult in Greece to find any optical instrument and now its difficult buy any from ebay.
.

Hi Tom
Your Zeiss 6x18 is brilliant at close-focus work.
I use it in a sitting or laying down position for looking at creatures in sea-side rock pools and fresh-water ponds.

Lee

 

[gunut]

Hi Tom
Your Zeiss 6x18 is brilliant at close-focus work.
I use it in a sitting or laying down position for looking at creatures in sea-side rock pools and fresh-water ponds.

Lee

Lee;
thought mermaids were just a myth.....??.....:-O

 

[Troubador]

Lee;
thought mermaids were just a myth.....??.....:-O

G

Just because you ain't got mermaids in the Great Lakes, don't mean they don't exist. :-O

Get close up to one with your 6x18 and :eek!:

Lee

 

[ceasar]

I have a Zeiss 6x18 too. It fits easily in a shirt pocket. However it has draw tube focusing and it gets longer the closer you get to the subject you are viewing while its depth of field gets shorter. You really need to be well braced to use it on close objects and plenty of light on the subject also helps.

The good point about it is that its DOF is so long that you hardly have to move the draw tube to focus on objects that are much more than 20 feet away from you.

Bob

 

[CliveP]

I'm getting another 7x18 Carson bin sent out. I definitely found the first one very interesting until it broke.

Not expecting any reliability with another but if it is ok I was really looking forward to taking it out to see just how useful it could be and how convenient to carry. It's certainly small and light and without the case wouldn't take much room so maybe just bring it in a zip lock bag. I really was able to acheive a quite satisfying view with it and definitely surprised at the brightness, etc.

I think this is a great compact bin format although is very small to hold. I could see me wanting to bring this little bin over the Optima and if I want macro then bring the Optima instead or also.

Anyone else tried these 7x18 bins? Seems to be a lot of makers doing them so perhaps all from the same origin but the Carson definitely has good transmission coatings and good prisms and good plastics in the body but the mechanics and assembly are maybe lacking what the optics deserve. I think the focusing mechanism is aluminium so the threads mess up and I think that's what happened to the first one and probably will the next also.

My Japanese Optima monoc is sort of the opposite. Perfect, brilliant mechanics, beautiful velvet smooth focus mechanism ( I can hold and focus it with one hand) but somewhat lacklustre optics and the new one is not much better. Perfectly adequate but nothing to excite. It's obvious therefore that the Chinese optics are really coming on but they're stuffing them into unworthy builds. Ok the Viking is fine. I think a tank could roll over that and it might survive. If this Optima had these Chinese optics it would be great and I'm disappointed that it does not when it should actually have something better optics wise.

The thing though that I don't like about the Optima 6x16 monoc is that with it's wide fov it almost seems to shrink the view or miniaturise it in some way to fit everything into the view so that you wonder are you actually getting 6x magnification. Perhaps it would have been better with less fov and less of this effect. Works great for looking at this screen but can seem under powered outdoors. The 7x18 bin on the other hand with 9.3 fov definitely is on the magnifying the view effect side and really gave me the impression of being an 8x almost mid size bin view if I got my eyes close in but when I checked against the Bresser only then could I see that it is a 7x by looking at the overall view but the gulls centred in the Carson were bigger.

7x18 bins. Go get em, and let me know which are best. I see also Carson do an 8x22 and 10x25. Judging by the 7x18, these could be very good also, while they work of course.

Almost forgot: Sister/nephew very happy with the Carson monocular. Sister seemed to think it was "brilliant" and would be handier than the Olympus 8x21 revporro I gave her previoulsy. Nephew liked it also but I don't think he got how to focus it but seemed happy regardless.