Tits and Chickadees related ? (1 Viewer)

[Neil Grubb]

I've been sorting through some photos and am struck by the similarity between the Coal Tit and the Black-Capped Chickadee. Are tits and chickadees related or are the similarities coincidental ? (In pic, Chickadee is left and Coal Tit right.)

 

[david2004]

I may be wrong in this, but I've read that Chickadees and European Tits are related somehow. I think the latin names are different or were changed recently. Black Capped Chickadee is Poecile, whereas Coal is Parus. However, as I said there was a change in some of the latin names recently for something.

I'm sure someone will correct me soon enough!

 

[Bluetail]

Yes, Neil. Chickadees are tits (and vice versa). In the past the chickadees have been placed in Parus, at least by some authorities (e.g. in the Helm guide Tits Nuthatches and Treecreepers), though the AOU places them in poecile as David points out. Not sure what the history behind this is, but there was another thread about this not so long ago which might have something.

 

[Edward woodwood]

same family Paridae

Tim

 

[Steve Lister]

One of them, Parus cinctus or Poecile cincta, actually occurs in both America and Eurasia and is called a chickadee - Grey-headed I think - in one and Siberian Tit in the other.

Steve

 

[Nutcracker]

Yes, same genus Parus. The Americans split some of the genus off into a separate genus Poecile (though this isn't widely followed); the ones they split off into this genus include Willow Tit and Marsh Tit over here, as well asl all the American chickadees

In the past, Willow Tit and Black-capped Chickadee were considered the same species by some authors

 

[Neil Grubb]

Interesting! I've never seen or heard a Willow Tit but from my books its call is probably different. But species calls seem to vary anyhow; for example the Chaffich's call varies across Europe. I remember well when I saw the Black-Capped Chickadee in Boston and wondered what it was - the bird answered very obligingly 'chickadeeedeedee'!!!

 

[KnockerNorton]

Poecile is still used for Marsh Tit in some Easten Europe countries - saw it in a paper recently.

Marsh Tit has been considered conspecific with BC Chickadee in the past too, and this group is ripe for more splitting (eg the East Asian races of Marsh Tit).

There is a strong case for placing the European brown tits in the same genus as the Chickadees rather than blue/great tit etc.