Vespobuteo
Well-known member
And using only one eye.., looks like some type of optical? sensor blocking the right ocular (connected with a flat-cable on top) but the logo is too small to read...makes me very curious...what's goin on...
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Yet another review of the 8x40 SFL (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter b-lilja
- Start date
Well, Kiska's involvement in the past has been with the external design of binos and while one might diminish this by calling it styling, one should remember that external design of binoculars includes its ergonomics too.And using only one eye.., looks like some type of optical? sensor blocking the right ocular (connected with a flat-cable on top) but the logo is too small to read...makes me very curious...what's goin on...
Lee
Vespobuteo
Well-known member
Definitely more than styling, and also building the Zeiss brand.
Did surprise me a bit when they let the gray SF slip through...reminded me a bit about the "Night owls"... fortunately the ergonomics where much better thanks to Kiska! No more bricks in the Zeiss line up.
And with the black SF II everything is back in (Zeiss) black again...
Found another photo in the page on prototyping, looks a bit hard to evaluate ergonomics with the amount of extra cables and sharp piggy back circuit boards on the bin, maybe it's an early Swaro rangefinder prototype with electronics on the outside or a new bin with a built in acupuncture feature?
But I have no clue really...
Experience prototyping makes better products – KISKA Exchange
Experience prototypes make better products, win over decisionmakers, and wow customers – KISKA Exchange
kiska.com
Yes the acupuncture feature piggy-backs on a satellite navigation system. You ask for route to a destination and if you deviate from the route you get stabbed.Definitely more than styling, and also building the Zeiss brand.
Did surprise me a bit when they let the gray SF slip through...reminded me a bit about the "Night owls"... fortunately the ergonomics where much better thanks to Kiska! No more bricks in the Zeiss line up.
And with the black SF II everything is back in (Zeiss) black again...
Found another photo in the page on prototyping, looks a bit hard to evaluate ergonomics with the amount of extra cables and sharp piggy back circuit boards on the bin, maybe it's an early Swaro rangefinder prototype with electronics on the outside or a new bin with a built in acupuncture feature?
But I have no clue really...
Experience prototyping makes better products – KISKA Exchange
Experience prototypes make better products, win over decisionmakers, and wow customers – KISKA Exchange
Lee
OK, one more comment, and comparos to other bins I have.
I hadn't put on the objective covers, but wow - these are terrific - perfect. They fit well, close tightly, but easy to take on and off. Aesthetically, they look totally of one piece with the bins - even including ridge continuations, and angles which reflect the hinge angles!! Someone was on top of it. This set up is ideal, because if you want to take off the covers, there's just the clean tube ends. Well done!
The pouch is pretty good. One day, someone will splurge on an actual 50 cent YKK zipper that doesn't break within a year - these bags are always throw away items for me for that reason.
Summary comparo to other bins
vs Nikon 8x32 SE's This is the only view I find equal to the SFLs, in different ways. Great resolution, deep 3d, wide field, but most importantly calm and easy - they just feel like an extension of my eyes. I find the smaller distance between eyepiece and objectives lessens axial shake. Light. I also find the view better when not using my glasses. However, not waterproof and lack hydrophobic coatings, and this has many ramifications (bad in rain, condensation/fogging, hard to clean (I just run my waterproof bins under the sink tap with lukewarm water), and subject to internal dust etc. and thus need regular cleaning. Both have easy diopters, a priority for me. The SFLs have more lift and contrast, and of course are better in low light. The SFLs are also more immersive - maybe due to larger exit pupils?
vs preLotutec, old coating Zeiss FL 8x42s I am a total softie for the FLs. Funky and cool, with calm views and excellent resolution. However, no hydrophobic coatings, making rain and condensation an issue, and definitely in overcast conditions they have a washed out, low contrast view. Also, a lot bigger and a little heavier. This is not pocketable with many coats.
vs Leica 7x42s UVHD+s The Leicas have their wonderful saturated views. I do think they are a half step lower resolution than the others on the top, including the Noctivid. I find them to be the ideal boating binoculars because they are tough and have the lower magnification, and there is something about their view at sea that really is nice. Also, wonderful design and craftsmanship.
vs Leica 8x32 BNs Sort of an unfair comparison - but I love the BNs for their old school chunkiness, and they're still not far off the mark. Resolution even slightly below the UVHD+s. If I had to leave on a mountaineering trip with a full size set of bins, this is what I'd take.
vs Swaro 7x21 Curios I know, totally unfair comparison, but speaks to how highly I regard the Curios. In a strange way similar views, however far less lift, light, and immersive views in the 7x21s, for obvious reasons.
As others have mentioned - they're all great. But as I sit here looking at all of them together, there is a clear winner in the all round category - the SFLs.
I hadn't put on the objective covers, but wow - these are terrific - perfect. They fit well, close tightly, but easy to take on and off. Aesthetically, they look totally of one piece with the bins - even including ridge continuations, and angles which reflect the hinge angles!! Someone was on top of it. This set up is ideal, because if you want to take off the covers, there's just the clean tube ends. Well done!
The pouch is pretty good. One day, someone will splurge on an actual 50 cent YKK zipper that doesn't break within a year - these bags are always throw away items for me for that reason.
Summary comparo to other bins
vs Nikon 8x32 SE's This is the only view I find equal to the SFLs, in different ways. Great resolution, deep 3d, wide field, but most importantly calm and easy - they just feel like an extension of my eyes. I find the smaller distance between eyepiece and objectives lessens axial shake. Light. I also find the view better when not using my glasses. However, not waterproof and lack hydrophobic coatings, and this has many ramifications (bad in rain, condensation/fogging, hard to clean (I just run my waterproof bins under the sink tap with lukewarm water), and subject to internal dust etc. and thus need regular cleaning. Both have easy diopters, a priority for me. The SFLs have more lift and contrast, and of course are better in low light. The SFLs are also more immersive - maybe due to larger exit pupils?
vs preLotutec, old coating Zeiss FL 8x42s I am a total softie for the FLs. Funky and cool, with calm views and excellent resolution. However, no hydrophobic coatings, making rain and condensation an issue, and definitely in overcast conditions they have a washed out, low contrast view. Also, a lot bigger and a little heavier. This is not pocketable with many coats.
vs Leica 7x42s UVHD+s The Leicas have their wonderful saturated views. I do think they are a half step lower resolution than the others on the top, including the Noctivid. I find them to be the ideal boating binoculars because they are tough and have the lower magnification, and there is something about their view at sea that really is nice. Also, wonderful design and craftsmanship.
vs Leica 8x32 BNs Sort of an unfair comparison - but I love the BNs for their old school chunkiness, and they're still not far off the mark. Resolution even slightly below the UVHD+s. If I had to leave on a mountaineering trip with a full size set of bins, this is what I'd take.
vs Swaro 7x21 Curios I know, totally unfair comparison, but speaks to how highly I regard the Curios. In a strange way similar views, however far less lift, light, and immersive views in the 7x21s, for obvious reasons.
As others have mentioned - they're all great. But as I sit here looking at all of them together, there is a clear winner in the all round category - the SFLs.
Yes, the objective covers were a nice surprise. The case is usable, but rather meh. A step back from the FL cases.
Vespobuteo
Well-known member
Better a softie than a bulky SF type hardcase.
Robert Moore
Well-known member
I just sold the 8x42 NL and decided to keep the 8x42 SFL and my 10x42 NL. The SFL is so light I can hold without fatigue for a really long time so I decided to keep it for my main 8x. The 10x NL is awesome and I am keeping it for my 10x. CA is a non issue in the SFL and is better than the Leica HD plus in 8x42 to my eyes. It had none in the center and only slight lateral CA for me. The Swarovision 10x50 has more CA than the SFL from my memory.
Wow, that was quick. I can't bring myself to sell the 8x42 NLs just yet.
Robert Moore
Well-known member
Well I bought the 10x NL that is the main reason I sold the 8NL. Not just because of the SFL 8. I probably should have kept the 8x NL because it was the best I have ever had but I wanted to try the 10 NL and needed to sell to pay for them.
tenex
reality-based
Can you clarify what you mean by "lift" here?
I am borrowing "lift" from the wine world. I think of lift being brightness and energy in wine, usually some combination of acidity and flavor and energy. Maybe in optics, a combination of contrast and brightness? And that special je ne sais quoi. But that last is no more descriptive than, "lift". Maybe, "pop", but less extreme?
Last edited by a moderator:
Putting "lift" in quotation marks like this indicates your use of this word to have a special meaning. When you use words in this way it is always helpful on the first occasion of use to explain what you mean.
Lee
james holdsworth
Consulting Biologist
Dynamic?
Paultricounty
Well-known member
Nice write up , I liked it thank you. May i Ask when you say “ I do think they are a half step lower resolution than the others on the top” (UVHD tot eh SFL) are you referring more towards sharpness and just using the word resolution. I can’t speak of the SFL but I have SF832 and UVHD+ 832 and I find the resolution very difficult to see any difference and that’s the SF. I will say without doubt to me the SF are sharper, but I think that’s intended by Zeiss and Leica is not trying for ultimate sharpness and more for a Beautiful color rendition and very saturated color image. Very easy on the eyes, like Nikon EDG’s.
Thank you
Paul
"I do think they are a half step lower resolution than the others on the top.”
In repeated field comparisons with 8x42 NLs, both hand held and supported, I somewhat lean towards the same opinion. However I'd likely need a resolution chart and booster to be certain. The quick focus of the SFL makes it difficult to get to absolute best focus to compare to vs the NL, which has a somewhat slow focus. However I've found the fast SFL focus to be better for actual birding use.
In repeated field comparisons with 8x42 NLs, both hand held and supported, I somewhat lean towards the same opinion. However I'd likely need a resolution chart and booster to be certain. The quick focus of the SFL makes it difficult to get to absolute best focus to compare to vs the NL, which has a somewhat slow focus. However I've found the fast SFL focus to be better for actual birding use.
Bill, I am pretty sure b-lilja is referring to Leica 7x42 here. He goes on to mention how he likes the lower magnification so is presumably talking about the 7x mag of the Ultravid.
Lee
I guess in my mind "resolution" and "sharpness" are the same. But I am happy to be schooled.
