henry link
Well-known member
My two Nikon refurbs have tiny dimples punched into the lower left side of the front axle cover plates.
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Your opinion on refurbished. (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter bonesmalones
- Start date
My two Nikon refurbs have tiny dimples punched into the lower left side of the front axle cover plates.
eitanaltman
Well-known member
Yeah Bob, I think Brock is right, I don't know how you could read Mike's response in the way you are suggesting. It seemed pretty unambiguous to me that he was saying warranty coverage on refurb was done after 90 days and thus it might be worth paying more for second hand. I really would like some definitive clarification on this.
brocknroller
porromaniac
Well, that 'splains it. The repair techies don't need to check a database to find out if it's a refurb, they can just check for dimples.
The only problem I see with that is with the Nikon SHE Adventure bins, which are so cute, they must have naturally occurring dimples.
SHE BINS
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BruceH
Avatar: Harris Hawk
According to my paperwork, a Nikon USA refurbished binocular comes with a "Nikon Reconditioned Product Ninety (90) Day Limited Warranty". It is not a "No Fault" warranty. It is limited in that it covers problems in materials and workmanship. The other "policy" that may or may not come into play on a Nikon USA refurb is called the "Nikon No-Fault Repair / Replacement Policy". That is the "Policy" were Nikon will handle issues for $10 plus shipping when the issue is not covered by a limited warranty. It also starts on day one of the purchase and has no stated end date. The question is whether the No-Fault Policy applies to a Nikon refurb.
I have no idea what Mike was trying to say in his post. There are many ways that it can be interpreted.
Is Nikon's original warranty transferable with the binocular if it is sold second hand to another party?
What is the answer to that? I believe that I have read here that the warranty is transferable but I can't remember where I read it and I am not going to look it up. Perhaps my memory is wrong. If so, please advise.
If my memory is not wrong then I ask: Why would Nikon treat the purchaser of one of it's refurbished binoculars (who is, in reality, the buyer of a second hand binocular) any differently than they would treat the purchaser of non-refurbished second hand binocular?
Bob
What is the answer to that? I believe that I have read here that the warranty is transferable but I can't remember where I read it and I am not going to look it up. Perhaps my memory is wrong. If so, please advise.
If my memory is not wrong then I ask: Why would Nikon treat the purchaser of one of it's refurbished binoculars (who is, in reality, the buyer of a second hand binocular) any differently than they would treat the purchaser of non-refurbished second hand binocular?
Bob
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elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
Bob,
If you hadn't written it then I would have. A refurbished binocular is a second-hand binocular! If the no-fault policy doesn't apply to it, then the whole @##$% thing makes no sense at all!
As I stated in an earlier post, no-fault coverage applied when I bought my 8x32 LX L. But, I gave the paperwork to the new buyer (who now owns a third-hand binocular).
As others have suggested, if the no-fault policy doesn't apply to factory refurbs, then avoid them like the plague. Know them by their white dot stigmata.
Ed
Attachments
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The Nikon repair form asks if the requested service is under warranty. If so, you must provide a receipt and a warranty card. I've done this myself.
If you don't check the under warranty box you simply continue with the form and the charge is generally stated as $10 plus shipping costs, applicable taxes, et cetera. I've also done this for a bin I owned that suffered water damage (to a waterproof SE no less) that WAS NOT covered under the warranty.
https://repair.nikonusa.com/ProductEntry
I'm confident Nikon USA will address issues with refurbished products during and after the 90 day warranty period.
If you don't check the under warranty box you simply continue with the form and the charge is generally stated as $10 plus shipping costs, applicable taxes, et cetera. I've also done this for a bin I owned that suffered water damage (to a waterproof SE no less) that WAS NOT covered under the warranty.
https://repair.nikonusa.com/ProductEntry
I'm confident Nikon USA will address issues with refurbished products during and after the 90 day warranty period.
brocknroller
porromaniac
Yes, it turns out the cute dimples are actually pock marks! :eek!:
However, not all refurbs are second hand. A store that was selling refurb Nikons on eBay said in its ad that for whatever reason if a store returns a Nikon bin, overstock, demo, defect, the store can't sell it as new, so Nikon sells them as refurbs, but they have never been privately owned. Not sure what percentage of refrubs are like that, but my impression from corresponding with someone from the store was that a good number of refurbs are store returns.
As Bob said, it doesn't make sense (at least to us), but it must make sense to Nikon. My experience has been very good with Nikons on the second-hand market (knock on rubber). Only one Nikon was defective, my first 8x32 LX, and I didn't even know it was defective, I thought that's the way LX focusers were supposed to work - like a spinning wheel. There were lots of comments on BF about the "fast" LX focusers. But my first 8x32 LX sample's focuser was so loose that I could spin it almost a 1/4 turn before it dampened, and there was also some backlash. I used to keep my finger on the focuser after getting to my target, so I wouldn't accidentally nudge it out of focus simply by handling the bins.
After I sold it, I read more posts and reviews about the Nikon 8x32 LX and found that while very fast, the LX focuser should not spin but dampen as soon as you let go of it. So I tried again and bought a second sample, and while the second sample's focuser was still too fast for my taste, it's movement was precise. The depth perception (or at least my depth perception with my accommodation) was too shallow and the ergonomics were not a good fit for my hand. It eventually ended up with another BF member who seems pleased with it (he has good focus accommodation, no doubt!). Since it was bought second-hand, not refurbished, if something should go awry, the LX will be covered under Nikon's No Fault Policy for second-hand bins, which only a few other companies have (and those, I think, are unofficial).
I probably wouldn't have the SE and EIIs if Nikon didn't have that policy in effect. It took the worry out of buying second hand.
Brock
elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
Look at post #13. We're talking about factory refurbished units with a prominent white dot (see my photo above). Apparently the way they address issues with these after 90 days is to charge for services. I don't know any other way to interpret what Mike said.
Ed
Brock,
Read your third sentence about what the e-bay store said in it's ad. It is saying that Nikon sells returned binoculars as "refurbished" even if Nikon doesn't refurbish them! I don't believe that for a minute and I would never do business with any dealer who gave me a horse crap story like that!
Bob
brocknroller
porromaniac
I don't remember the store's name, but they frequently sell Nikon refurbs on eBay and run the same blurb. If you look for Nikons on the 'bay, you'll eventually run across their ads.
Yes, that's what he said, stores send them back to Nikon, Nikon technicians check them out, clean them or repair them if necessary, and then Nikon sells them as refurbs.
Where do you think the refurbs come from? Customers?
Mike can probably clarify this.
Brock
I agree, however, what specific charges are involved. I assume the standard 25-year warranty for new bins is replaced with a 90 day warranty for refurbished models. After 90 days the refurb owner is responsible for payment under the No-Fault policy currently in force. As we all know, the USA No-Fault policy is a nominal cost.
I think the assumption is that the owner bears all responsibility for repairing a refurbished model after day 91. If so, I'd forgo purchasing a refurbished model. I imagine the cost of repairing a flooded EDG on day 91 would more than offset any savings.
Nikon should clarify this ASAP. Some sites sell refurbished items with a notation that the No-Fault warranty applies after the 90 day warranty. Others make no mention of the No-Fault warranty. The Nikon repair form does not mention refurbished models. https://repair.nikonusa.com/ProductEntry
Mike can and should clear this up. My guess is Nikon will repair under the No-Fault policy, but I could be wrong. Not likely, of course, but always a possibility!
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FrankD
Well-known member
Based on my experience with purchasing refurbished Nikon products(and having those bins serviced at a later date) the above statement is the accurate one. This was certainly the case with one of the Nikon Venturer 8x42s that I owned.
eitanaltman
Well-known member
The confusion comes from Mike's earlier post in which he appears to state that there is NO warranty after 90 days. I hope you guys are right but he needs to get back here and clarify.
elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
Mike,
Would you please clarify your earlier statement? I think everyone understands that there is only a 90-day Warranty on a factory refurbished item. The question is: Does Nikon's No-Fault Policy apply after the 90-day warranty expires? A definitive answer would be yes or no.
Many thanks,
Ed
mikefreiberg
Well-known member
Okay everyone, this is the final word from Nikon. Our refurbished optics offer a 90-day manufacturer's warranty. NO-FAULT IS NOT INCLUDED! This is strictly a manufacturer's warranty. They can track each binocular with serial number at service and repair and will know immediately if it is refurbed or not. Hope this helps.
All the best,
Mike Freiberg
Nikon
mikefreiberg
Well-known member
Hi Bob,
The warranty is transferable from what I have seen in the past. Everything is tracked by serial number thus Nikon really never knows how the original owner is.
Concerning your second question, I don't know. The only answer to that is highly subjective and since I don't make the policy at Nikon, it is hard to say. I wish I had the answer to that. Sorry for the confusion.
Quite simply, with refurbed items you get a 90-day manufacturer's warranty and that's it. Used or new product keep the 25 No-Fault policy and lifetime manufacturer's warranty.
All the best,
Mike Freiberg
Nikon
mikefreiberg
Well-known member
eitanaltman
Well-known member
Has hell frozen over? B
Thanks Mike for clarifying, but I am really disappointed to hear that answer. It seems crazy to me that Nikon will not stand behind products that they have refurbished themselves by Nikon trained factory technicians.
It also seems a deviation from past policy because others (Frank and Ed at least) have reported that they have utilized the No-Fault Warranty in the past for refurb products.
OK Mike,
I have one refurbished Nikon binocular; a 10 x 35 EII, which I purchased as such around 2006 at Highpoint Scientific in Montague, New Jersey. I bought it there in person and I observed that they had at least a half dozen of them which they were selling as refurbished items. I assume they received them from Nikon to sell. The binoculars had the standard Nikon 90 day warranty for refurbished binoculars. They all were priced at $250.00 which was about $200.00 below their retail price at that time. All of them looked like they were brand new and all of them had a little slot stamped into the Nikon logo on the front of the binocular's hinge.
My guess, and it is only a guess, is that these binoculars were returned to Nikon by the original purchasers because their exterior leatherette coverings had worked loose. This was a common complaint about EIIs in those years. (Many people ignored it and glued it back on again as I did with my 8 x 30 EII which I purchased new.) This must be the only reason so many of them were refurbished. What else could have been wrong with an EII?
Anyway, they are no longer sold in the USA so in the event I have trouble with one of mine I will not risk having Nikon USA work on it and that includes my 8 x 30 EII which I purchased new. I'll pay a qualified privately employed binocular repairman instead.
Thanks for trying to answer my question. The fact that Nikon USA will not do anything, or more likely cannot do anything, to resolve what is clearly an incoherency in their warranty policy because of a hide bound, secretive, unresponsive management in Japan, makes me think that they did Eagle Optics a favor by dropping them.
Please pass my comments on to Nikon USA.
Cordially,
Bob
