A problem woodpecker out of Africa (1 Viewer)

During our last trip to Kenya - July and August 2004 - we met a woodpecker we could not identify, due the fact we believe it was not in the book. We saw many forms and many species of woodpeckers before in Kenya, but it did not mach with any of these.

Description: It was definitily a female Campethera woodpecker, looking like a female Nubian Woodpecker. Why we think it was not a Nubian is because of:
- Her back was spotted all over (as the breast of a Bennetts Woodpecker), and not streacked as the back of a Nubian should have;
- One of the most obvious characteristics of a Nubian is the white chin, but one of the most obvious characteristics of this one was the yellow throat and chin;
- A dark stripe is projected from the bill to past the eye.

If everything works as it should be, two pictures are displayed underneath this message. The first (geelkeel1) shows the yellow throat and chin, the second the spotted back.
We think about a Fine-Spotted Woodpecker, but we have never seen this species, we do not have a guid of an area where this bird should live and we can't find any clear pictures on the internet of a female. Can anyone confirm that this is a Fine-Spotted, or have anyone suggestions which species this could be?

Thanx anyway.

Greats, Rick

Hi Rick,

A warm welcome to BirdForum from all the Admin and Moderators.

I am afraid I can't answer your id question but I am sure someone will be along soon who can.

Rick,
Where exactly in Kenya were you for the shot? So far it looks like a female Nubian to me. Perhaps the wing barring that you talk about may be age-related. You were there and saw an evident yellow throat - but not that apparent on the photo. The female nubian in a slightly out of focus shot can appear to have a light eye stripe depending on the angle and the lighting as evidenced in the photo I am uploading though you have to imagine this photo out of focus.

Hi Rick,

I would tend to agree with Steve. Looks very much like a fine Nubian to me. Most authorities have split up Fine-spotted (C. punctuligera), so the birds in Kenya are generally now called Tullberg's Woodpecker (C. tullbergi). This species is quite different from the bird on the picture. Tullberg's has a greenish back without spots. C. punctuligera sensu strictu isn't found anywhere near Kenya and can't really be considered a possibility as Kenya is a well-surveyed country. Even if it had occurred, this is a rather different woodpecker with relatively vaguely marked underparts & back. Also note that Tullberg's (the one in Kenya) inhabits a rather specific habitat, montane forest, and is therefore rather limited in distribution in Kenya. Anyway, as said, this really looks like a fine Nubian to me. A few comments:

Corotauria said:

-Her back was spotted all over (as the breast of a Bennetts Woodpecker), and not streacked as the back of a Nubian should have;

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Nubian has a spotted back aswell. Only wings (primaries, secondaries & tertials) normally appear striped and this is a feature that is subject to a lot of individual variation.

Corotauria said:

- One of the most obvious characteristics of a Nubian is the white chin, but one of the most obvious characteristics of this one was the yellow throat and chin;

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This is a typical feature of young Nubian's. Even adults rarely have a shiny white throat.

Corotauria said:

- A dark stripe is projected from the bill to past the eye.

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Fine for Nubian. Note the photo added by Steve in post #3. So far I see no reason why it isn't a Nubian. Anyway, an exact locality would be nice.

Rasmus

If you put it all to that, I am almost convinced. I am for sure that it wasn't the Tullbergs... And I have to admit that the bird on our pictures looks like the one Steve send... But I'll find it quit strange that my birdguide don't mention a spotted back at all. And we made some more pictures of Nubian Woodpeckers, but they all had a streacked back. Do the spotts or streacks also occur at different ages or something?
But thanx for the replies anyway...

By the way, the picture is made around Lake Naivasha. Just in the same habitat Nubian is found. So no Tullbergs :S.

Greats, Rick

Corotauria said:

But I'll find it quit strange that my birdguide don't mention a spotted back at all. And we made some more pictures of Nubian Woodpeckers, but they all had a streacked back. Do the spotts or streacks also occur at different ages or something?

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I have never seen a Nubian with all of the back striped. Neither have I been able to find info supporting that it occurs (though it possibly could). Normally, Nubian has a mainly spotted back (mantle, scapulars & wing-coverst), with the stripes being restricted to the primaries, secondaries & tertials. Racial variations in this species (and infact the whole superspecies) are poorly understood and appear to intergrade whereever surveys have been conducted along borders. There are clear indications that much of this variation is due to habitat; woodland & highland birds appears to be relatively heavily marked on the back, while lowland & arid area birds appear relatively vaguely marked - this is obviously to be expected. In any case, neither of these normally have a back that is striped all over (though the fact that the spots often are placed on lines can cheat) - I am not saying that it couldn't occur, just that isn't usual.

Rasmus

NB: I forgot to say it earlier: Welcome to BirdForum...

Rasmus Boegh said:

I have never seen a Nubian with all of the back striped. Neither have I been able to find info supporting that it occurs (though it possibly could). Normally, Nubian has a mainly spotted back (mantle, scapulars & wing-coverst), with the stripes being restricted to the primaries, secondaries & tertials. Racial variation in this species (and infact the whole superspecies) are poorly understood and appear to intergrade whereever surveys have been conducted along borders.

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There is an funny (a bit odd maybe...) difference in observations. And I certainly have some pictures to support the occuriency of streacked backs... Unfortunatly my scanner gave up working, so I own you that one. And like I told you before, the drawings in my birdguide don't show the spots on his back but the streacks I am used to see.

Rasmus Boegh said:

There are clear indications that much of this variation is due to habitat; woodland & highland birds appears to be relatively heavily marked on the back, while lowland & arid area birds appear relatively vaguely marked. In any case, neither of these normally have a back that is striped all over (though the fact that the spots often are placed on lines can cheat) - I am not saying that it couldn't occur, just that isn't usual.

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I didn't know that one. Of course it could be that the bird on my mysteryphoto's wasn't the first one with spots on her back we saw, but simply the first where we noticed some slightly differences with we though we used to see. Looking at our pictures from earlier trips and earlier birds (and the are common around Lake Naivasha) we concluded that this bird was not the same as we knew the Nubian Woodpecker. Actually, I'll find it a quit funny situation. You are use to see Nubian Woodpeckers with spotts and find the streacks quite unusual, and we just found it the other way round.

Rasmus Boegh said:

NB: I forgot to say it earlier: Welcome to BirdForum...

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Thanx!

Corotauria said:

Actually, I'll find it a quit funny situation. You are use to see Nubian Woodpeckers with spotts and find the streacks quite unusual, and we just found it the other way round.

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I can't remember ever having seen a Nubian Woodpecker with an overall streaked back. In any case I still went through a few of my books to see if I could find any mentioning or drawings of this. These are the books I checked:

1) "Handbook of the Birds of the World" (2002) vol. 7 (Woodpecker chapter by H. Winkler & D.A. Christie).
2) "The Birds of Africa" vol. 3 (1988) by Hilary Fry et al.
3) "Birds of Africa south of the Sahara" (2003) by Ian Sinclair & Peter Ryan.
4) "Birds of Kenya and northern Tanzania" (1999 - Helm edition) by Dale Zimmerman et al.

None of the above gave any indication that the back can be striped all over (note my comment on primaries, secondaries & tertials in post #4). Only in one book could I find a small drawing where the Nubian Woodpecker appeared to have a mainly striped back: "Birds of Eastern Africa" (1995) by Ber van Perlo. In any case this is a book with many rather poor drawings, so I really wouldn't rely on that. Again; I am not saying that it never occurs, just that if it does, it appears to be rather infrequent.

Rasmus

Hi all, I'm the guy who was with Corotauria when he encounterd that bird.

The thing is, we saw the nubian a quiet a few times, but when we saw this one we inmidiately thought it wasn't a nubian woodpecker.
well I tried to look for a good picture of a nubian, but I could only find the one atached.

tnx for all the help sofar

Here are a 5 photos of Nubian's; various sex, but they should still give a good idea of the variation of the spots on the back (also remember the photo attached by Steve in post #3). I am not sure who holds the copyrights for these - if anybody feel they do and want them to be removed PM me and it will be done as soon as possible.

oke, the back on some of the pictures is totaly differend as drawn in birds of kenia and northen tanzania by Zimmerman. I must say those look a lot more like the bird we saw.
and if you say the yelowish brest is becouse it is a young bird....sigh,
so we should degrade this woodpecker to a nubian woodpecker *snif*
Ah well tnx even though you helped a nice dream out of this world

So now what?

Are you going to cry now???


Maybe we must stop discuss about the first bird (with the spots), and start talking about the other Nubians we saw. With an all streaked back. The seemed to be more unusual than the spotted form.
And I have to agree with broodje, that the books we had (besides the one of Zimmerman, also the birdguide to East-Africa by Fanshaw and Stevenson) don't show the spotted but the streacked version... :S