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ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

10x56 FL review (1 Viewer)

ronh

Well-known member
I have been curious about the 10x56 FL ever since Henry Link made his case for the large exit pupil advantage in his review of the 8x56. But I like higher magnification for low light, distant views, and stargazing. Like the 8x, the 10x56 is not very popular here, but the occasional reports glow about its optical performance. Who wouldn't want a 10x with at least part of the optical advantages so eloquently described in Henry's review?

So after a lengthy period of personal twisting and rationalizing, I went for a demo at a good price and have had the big FL about a week now. I have used it heavily in this short time, daily including a full day of birding with lots of distant waterbirds, and nightly on the stars through a period of clear October skies. I have taken it on my daily sunrise walks, and even on a 2000 foot climb to the top of a local mountain. I have stared through it, turned backwards, at a computer monitor through a polarizing filter to judge the quality of the phase coatings (very good I'd say), and admired things around the house, mainly my wife's incredible collection of blues CDs, the cases I mean.

I've been using an 8x42 FL and a Leica 10x50 BR about equally, so I'll describe the 56mm mostly as it compares to those two.

The green rubber of the 10x56 is actually softer and tackier than the starting to gleam black of the 8x42, the opposite what some users have found respecting the two colors. It certainly benefits from the (as Piers would say) "grippibilita'"-- with its size and weight it needs all the help it can get. Thankfully, the bowed out barrels dictated by the AK prisms leaves a good thumb's width between the barrels so you can get your wrist under the front end for a comfortable and stable support. Eyecups have three click stops in addition to full down, and the middle click fits me perfectly. With cups down, with my big sunglasses, I can see 5/6 of the field, about like with the 8x42.

The Zeiss focuses to about 10 feet vs 11 for the 10x50. From 11 feet to infinity requires 0.8 turn with 10x56, 1.25 turn with the 10x50, but only a blinding 0.55 turn with the 8x42. Despite the faster ratio, the 56 is actually slower for me to bring to sharpness than the 50. I think this is because of the feel of the focus knobs, the Zeiss being silky smooth but still quite resistive and heavy feeling, the Leica having the feel of unlubricated sticktion in such a way that when it moves, it really moves, and you are, like, THERE. I must just learn to crank the 56 boldly. The 10xs are both nicely tuned for the difficulty of focusing higher power, but are elephants compared to the 8x42's gazelle. No doubt about what is the warbler medicine here.

The apparent field of the 10x50 will contain the entire box of Cassiopeia with a little room to spare, but the 10x56 won't quite fit it in. In turn, the apparent field of the 8x42 FL is a little smaller still. All have pincushion distortion, and in practice the difference is negligible, as all pan smoothly. Off axis blur is due to field curvature in the Leica, but mostly astigmatism in the FLs. The sweet spots of the two makes are similar, and although the edge sharpness of any would disappoint fans of binoculars that correct this well, others would not notice the minor differences among the three.

I have tried to objectify what I easily could, but regarding the overall quality of the view, I will fall back on the fearless naked eyeball method.

Looking through the 10x56, the view is just about like that in the familiar 8x42, only bigger. Any differences are overwhelmed by the magnification difference. This was actually my fondest hope, because for me it means "as good as I've seen". By Henry's logic, the 8x56 should be even better. I don't think I want to look through one of those, thank you!

Compared to the 10x50 BR, the obvious in house competition, the view is noticeably a little brighter and cleaner. After sunset its slightly larger exit pupil, and I also suspect better corrected exit pupil geometry, eliminates the eye pupil/exit pupil interactions that I experience with the 10x50, when eye position and direction of view in the field must be closely disciplined for a clear view. The view in the 10x56 is simple, and my eyes can wander without darkening/brightening effect, and so I would call the view relaxing.

On the stars, it really packs a stronger punch, a combination of aperture and transmission. Not only are stars in the middle of the view intense and tight, but I became immediately aware of the darkening edge of the Leica's field, which I only notice at night and had mostly learned to ignore. The big FL is bright all over, very pleasing for starwatching. The sharp, and overall bright view is so friendly that it may even replace the 12x50 BN that I use a lot for stargazing, but that's another story. The old principle is reaffirmed, that one can become accustomed to the weaknesses in something, which which then suddenly become obvious when something better comes along.

The question is not so much if the view in the 10x56 is better, but whether it is better enough to put up with the extra weight (44 vs 35 ounces) and bulk. I am impressed anew at what Leica can pack into the slim and delightful Ultravid, which is much nicer to handle and not heavy for a quality for 10x50. But in this comparison the compromises that go into the Leica become evident. I would still recommend the Leica over the Zeiss for a birdwatcher who wants the long range and low light capabilities of 10x50 but doesn't want to suffer unduly for it. The 56mm FL better fits the profile of the optically obsessed nature lover/stargazer, than the practical birder. With my pupils which will still open to about 6mm in the dark, it is probably about all the binocular that I can use to good advantage without some kind of support. I have had enjoyable experiences with big binoculars in the past though, and I am happily "strapping it on".

As to personal bias, consider that my honest striving for the truth may be affected by a need to rationalize an expensive purchase by overstating its wonders, and the ironically conflicting desire to not deflate too badly the reputation of a binocular that I will go right out and try to sell! All in all, it keeps me on the middle ground. Seriously, the 10x50 BR is a very good binocular, if you can find an excellent one for a good price. The 10x50 SV is no doubt better, but the BRs can be had for bargains that will cost the buyer well over $1000 less. And, you actually might soon be able to find such a gem more easily than you ever thought possible, very close by as a matter of fact.

Ron
 
Enjoyable read, Ron.

I have a 10x56 Night Owl coming this week, for me to try. I will give you my impression of these monsters at some point and maybe we can compare notes - the last of the great Zeiss ''leaded glass'' wonders vs. lighter, more modern and thinner lens / body in the FL.
 
Enjoyable read, Ron.

I have a 10x56 Night Owl coming this week, for me to try. I will give you my impression of these monsters at some point and maybe we can compare notes - the last of the great Zeiss ''leaded glass'' wonders vs. lighter, more modern and thinner lens / body in the FL.

James:

Good for you, I am thinking you will enjoy them. Heavy but worth it.
I had mine for a couple of years, and now another member here has
the experience.

I have not had the chance to try the big FL, but I am sure they are very good
also. Big objectives have some very nice advantages.

Jerry
 
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Ron,

Glad to see that the 10x56 FL is working out for you. I would certainly have chosen it over the 8x56 if astronomy were my first use. Doesn't it seem odd that Zeiss didn't adopt HT glass for the 56mm models first? Even with the old dingy glass the 56mm FL's will still beat the 42mm HT's in low light from aperture alone. Surely it won't be too long before before some 56mm HT's will be coming along.

Henry
 
Ron, nice synopsis.

Surely you must be close to leading the pack, in the race for the title of "Most Hairy-Chested Birder on BF"!

I even find myself increasingly perusing 10/12 x 50/56 specs, and deals!
Whether or not I'm seriously toying with the idea - even I don't know!

While you still have both bins in hand, I'll ask if you see any difference between the two with the following:
1. Is there any difference real? or detectable, between the magnification of the two? (image size as viewed). I'm thinking here that the slightly splayed objectives of the Zeiss FL would ever so slightly reduce image size ..... which leads to the next question .....
2. Is there any noticeable advantage (one way or the other) to the 1050 Leica v's the 1056 Zeiss, in terms of dof, and 3-D effect?
3. Finally, are you still the same height as you were before starting to use the 1056 FL's?! |8(| |^| |:d|


Chosun :gh:
 
Chosun,
I grasp the general idea that when viewing near objects wider spaced objectives require the eyes to converge more, fooling the brain into thinking the image is closer and in turn smaller looking. I have not looked for this effect however, nor noticed it. FWIW, my IPD setting is 67mm, at which the objective spacing on the FL is 81mm. The acid test may have been yesterday, when I was fortunate to spy a brown creeper about 10 ft away. It looked bigger than necessary if anything. Yikes, get it AWAY!!

On a related note, and somewhat inconsistent with my first answer, I do actually think I might see a slight exaggeration of 3D perspective at close range with the big FL, compared to my straight through Leica. Again, I have not sought such an effect. It is certainly nowhere near the extreme of, say, a very wide 7x50 Porro in which is the effect is quite obvious. It's pretty much a non issue for me. I think exaggerated 3d is kind of faky looking to tell the truth. Magnification screws depth perspective up anyhow; why confuse the issue even more?

I haven't actually measured my height since starting to use the FL. But quantifying the chest hair effect should be very easy, as previously, there were three. Four would be a large percentage increase, and I am not optimistic. Much worse challenges have not helped.

Fact is, since getting this binocular, I haven't had the long boring afternoons alone necessary to do such tests. Those will come with winter. At such times, I hope to contemplate my navel with it, although not directly, but with the aid of a mirror a few feet away. But so far, life with the 10x56 has just been an intense program of normal use, day and night. Without doubt, I am so unobservant and insensitive that many of the fine particulars of such an instrument are wasted on me. ( I will volunteer, for example, that I cannot tell if the color skewing is "too blue" or "too yellow-green" either of which is correct. Just plain looks good to me, duh...) But in some fundamental dirt level way that even I can see, the 10x56 FL kicks major butt, no lie. (Gee, that has the sound of macho swagger doesn't it? Maybe it's working.)
Ron
 
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Thanks Ron :t: I always enjoy your wry deliberations, and practical fair-dinkumness.

Let us all know how the 1056 FL "marriage" pans out, after the "honeymoon glow" subsides (and after you get rid of the "mistress" too!) |:d|


Chosun :gh:
 
Compared to the 10x50 BR, the obvious in house competition, the view is noticeably a little brighter and cleaner. After sunset its slightly larger exit pupil, and I also suspect better corrected exit pupil geometry, eliminates the eye pupil/exit pupil interactions that I experience with the 10x50, when eye position and direction of view in the field must be closely disciplined for a clear view. The view in the 10x56 is simple, and my eyes can wander without darkening/brightening effect, and so I would call the view relaxing.

Nice review, Ron. The text quoted here above intrigued me. Most of your description matches what I experienced with a 7x50 I had some time ago. My conclusion at the time was that I should avoid binoculars that have the same size exit pupil as my eye pupil. Do you think that a "better corrected exit pupil geometry" involves more than avoiding matching pupil sizes?
 
Excellent review, Ron. I've only once ever looked through a 10x56FL, and that was about two years ago, but the experience lingers in my memory as one of the more memorable in an otherwise mundane existence. They belonged to a neighbour who is both German and big (I have no knowledge of the hirsuteness of his pecs, but I doubt anyone has ever dared kick sand in his face). As I'm beginning to find the weight of even my SV 42mm a strain, I doubt I'll ever opt for the 56mm, at least in what remains to me of this 32mm-restricted lifetime. But the view was frankly a bino-revelation, and all that Henry Link reported was as always on the money.
 
Mark,
Unlike with a 5mm to 7mm jump, the small increase in exit pupil size from 10x50 to 10x56, by itself, could hardly be responsible for the improvement in the eye/image interactions that I experience with the big FL. 5.6 mm is actually closer to my eye than 5.0. So I believe that something else must be going on, and suspect that the Zeiss must suffer less from "spherical aberration of the exit pupil", which, as you probably know, means a difference in eye relief for different directions within the field of view.

Since it's you, I will add that I am stunned at the sharpness of the star images in the 10x56. I thought that even 5mm was too big for me, and had mostly retreated to the safety of 4mm! Don't be so hesitant to blame your binocular, I seem to learning with difficulty, and at considerable cost.
Ron

Sancho,
Thank you. Your reaction to the 10x56 FL was one of my influences. In my experience, everything about a big heavy binocular is better, except....the size and weight! Time alone will tell whether ("how long" would be a more accurate term) I survive my "view uber alles" period.
Ron
 
Hi Ron

Sorry I'm late; an HT got in the way.

Loved your down-to-earth review and follow-up remarks. Keep us posted on further developments.

Lee
 
Enjoyable read, Ron.

I have a 10x56 Night Owl coming this week, for me to try. I will give you my impression of these monsters at some point and maybe we can compare notes - the last of the great Zeiss ''leaded glass'' wonders vs. lighter, more modern and thinner lens / body in the FL.

Hi James

I wish you luck coming to grips with one of these mythical beasts. Do let us know how you get on.

I remember it got some criticism from some quarters for a bit too much CA. Looking back at pics of the Night Owls it makes me wonder how easy/difficult focussing might be with what appears to be quite a small diameter focussing wheel powering a not insubstantial lump of leaded glass.

Lee
 
Nice review! I still vividly remember my brief comparison that I had with the 10x56FL and the 10x50EL.
In my experience, everything about a big heavy binocular is better, except....the size and weight! Time alone will tell whether ("how long" would be a more accurate term) I survive my "view uber alles" period. Ron
Now that you have had more time with the big Zeiss, is this still your impression?
 
Gonzo max. It's like riding in a big luxury car. Good light, bad light, low light, NO light...Viewing "issues" are a thing of the past. It's certainly the best I've had.
Ron
 
Ron, I've lost track of the binoculars you have or have tried, but I know you're a man of great taste.
Did you by chance ever do a comparison with the Swarovision 10x50? I had a brief time with one the other day, and it was just a massive WOW - impressed me much more than the 42mm SV's.
 
Mark,
That's a nice way of putting it, but my experience is really limited, acquired in only the last 5 years. Some of our members have owned way more than me but are quite types who don't do a big review every time they buy something, and some are among the world's foremost binocular reviewers and professionals: Gijs, Jan, Kimmo, Holger, Garymh, sorry I know I must be leaving somebody out! But hey, "we're all doin what we ca...a.a.an".

I tried a SV 12x50 outside in brilliant daylight, and thought it was very fine indeed. The image was obviously clearer and cleaner than in my old 12x50 Trinovid. I don't see how the 10x50 SV could possibly miss, but I haven't tried one.

I wouldn't be surprised if you found the 10x50 SV better than the 10x42. For reasons that get tossed around here from time to time, I believe that at a given magnification, all-conditions image quality and viewing ease improve as exit pupil increases, up to 7mm or so. That is one thing that attracted me to the 10x56. Another was the FL series is not exactly new and fascinating anymore, and even in the unique 10x56 size, demos can be had about $1000 cheaper than a new 10x50 SV.

And, without actually doing the 50mm SV vs 56mm FL comparison I would strongly suspect, given my careful comparisons of the FL and SV in the 42 mm sizes, and quick trials of several other FLs and SVs, that the FL would be brighter, smoother focusing, and although rather blurry at the edge of the field, pincushioned enough to pan smoothly, which is my preference over the SV's razor sharp but "undistorted" edge.

So my preference is part demonstrable, part dream world, part monetary rationalizing. The 9 oz. lighter weight and trim profile of the SV would sure be nice though!
Ron
 
Interesting point, Ron. I found the 10x50 SV noticeably sharper and brighter than the 12x50 SV, which would fit in with your exit-pupil related theory. I don't do much panning so that's not a factor for me, but I did find that virtually all of the Swarovski models on dispaly, about 8 or so, had a very poor quality focussing wheel.

I did in the past look through and handle the FL 42mm models and found I much disliked their "feel".
 
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