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ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

Bins and scopes-myths and reality (1 Viewer)

StrikingSlug said:
Third, and last before I shut up, I find the same problem with wine. For sure a £50 bottle tastes better than a £5 bottle, but is it 10 times better? I don't think so, but I do know that if you drink the £50 bottle first the second one tastes pretty revolting in comparison!

Mind you, the hangover is the same whichever one you choose to quaff! B :)

Richard
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Can I go off on a total tangent here? (I think we´ve debated the "amount spent on bins" in the past, and flogged it to death). I find that a 6 euro bottle of wine gives me a hell of a hangover, but a 30 euro bottle doesn´t. Not that I drink much wine, mind....but is this normal?;)B :)
 
Sancho said:
Can I go off on a total tangent here?
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No you can't ;)



As for binoculars, get the best you can afford and be happy with it ...each additional pound or euro brings a relatively smaller improvement, but each small improvement makes the whole viewing experience more pleasureable, so if you've got it, splash it.
 
Well thanks to all for the responses-the purpose of the post was not as one poster puts it to sow discord-I realise on rereading my OP that it can come across as inflammatory. It could have been worded better so apologies for that.

And I have learnt some things ie that some folk buy the best optics they can to enhance and optimise their birding experience, something I had not really thought of. And I didn't realise that optics in themselves can be a hobby.

I guess I'll never understand the agonizing over tiny differences in different bins and why some own several different sets. But then some would think some of my hobbies are daft so each to his own....
 
Sancho said:
Can I go off on a total tangent here? (I think we´ve debated the "amount spent on bins" in the past, and flogged it to death). I find that a 6 euro bottle of wine gives me a hell of a hangover, but a 30 euro bottle doesn´t. Not that I drink much wine, mind....but is this normal?;)B :)
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Not sure but the worst migraine I ever had was brought on by a bar of Asda bargain basement dark chocolate. More expensive stuff was fine. :eat:


On the original topic - expensive optics will only make a difference in extreme circumstances... how often you find yourself in that situation only you can determine. If you were at huge reservoirs or seawatching a lot then I can imagine it might well be the case. For smaller reserves probably less so.
 
Fozzybear said:
On the original topic - expensive optics will only make a difference in extreme circumstances... how often you find yourself in that situation only you can determine. If you were at huge reservoirs or seawatching a lot then I can imagine it might well be the case. For smaller reserves probably less so.
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Not extreme just outside the limits of the cheaper bin: down the local park with a bit of woodland. A strange song. You find the bird is 20 meters away up a tree 20 degrees off from the setting sun behind him. You might get the shot with bins that control stray light well. For cheaper bins you might get a view if you walk around the tree. Then again he might fly off.

An "extreme circumstance" perhaps. But location has little to do with it.

These differences are also only going to be found if you spend some time with the bins an test them out (the sort of thing us optics nuts do so that you not-so-nutty-about-optics folks can make better buying decisions).

Back to a previous comment I had about stray light. I wasn't saying it couldn't be measured. I've done QA and measured all sort of stuff a normal user would never measure to make sure the stuff works right. I'm saying it's not reported in any standard way except by reviewers. Same goes for a range of other features that don't appear on spec sheets: brightness/transmission, saturation, contrast (all related), sharpness, astigmatism, field curvature, flatness, veiling glare, flaring (loss of contrast) from on axis light, etc, etc. All areas were better designed (and often more expensive bins) excell but that are difficult for a "normal" user to determine epecially without using the bins for a day or two.

That said, I agree fully with the Bushnell Excursion (perhaps a notch below a PC Monarch) user that that first time with a modern "decent" bin is often a eye-opening experience. And they're cheaper than ever before. Imagine taking a set of Bushnell Excursion

For example, I have a pair of 8x32 roofs with on-axis flares (mediocre multilayer coatings), different aberrations in each tube (kwality!) and no PC (not as bright or sharp as they could be). They cost me $40 secondhand. But they have a OK 7.5 degree FOV and good eye relief. I gave them to my wife to use to show here a Coopers Hawk family I'd been watching. She has always had a terrible time with using bins: can't find the target. After a couple of minute of hints and a little proactise she could find birds without a problem. The bigger FOV made these the most usable bins she'd ever used. The sort that means she can find a bird easily.
 
markgrubb;1311827I guess I'll never understand the agonizing over tiny differences in different bins and why some own several different sets. But then some would think some of my hobbies are daft so each to his own....[/QUOTE said:
LOL! Yeah, I suppose if we all had exactly the same hobbies the world would be a less interesting place....and I must admit, despite my defence of "big spend" on top-class optics, the amount of "agonising over tiny differences in different bins" that I indulge in is in inverse proportion to the amount of time I spend actually birding.;) Have a good weekend, Mark!
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Sancho said:
Can I go off on a total tangent here? (I think we´ve debated the "amount spent on bins" in the past, and flogged it to death). I find that a 6 euro bottle of wine gives me a hell of a hangover, but a 30 euro bottle doesn´t. Not that I drink much wine, mind....but is this normal?;)B :)
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Sancho,

I don't know but a little single malt has never given me a hangover. I cannot afford enough of that to bring on a hangover.


Happy bird watching,
Arthur
 
normjackson said:
I think I read somewhere here that cheapies contain rare earth metals, aluminium and nitrogen and are not readily biodegradeable (o)<
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:eek!:Right, that´s it.....only Ultra-pure German beers or Pinewood´s Single Malts from now on.....and no more alpha-bins (seeing as how Swaro and Nikon seem to be in some difficulty anyway with their new releases;))
 
Pinewood said:
Sancho,

I don't know but a little single malt has never given me a hangover. I cannot afford enough of that to bring on a hangover.


Happy bird watching,
Arthur
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As a drinker what is a hangover,cheap wines you quaff class wines you savour,but if you drink more that a single malt enjoyment is just around the corner.

POP
 
POP said:
As a drinker what is a hangover,cheap wines you quaff class wines you savour,but if you drink more that a single malt enjoyment is just around the corner.

POP
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Have you been at the cooking-sherry again, Old Bean? Translate that post into English for me when you sober up, there´s a Good Chap....;)
 
?

POP said:
As a drinker what is a hangover,cheap wines you quaff class wines you savour,but if you drink more that a single malt enjoyment is just around the corner.

POP
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This is one reason I don't drink! Anymore.

To the original post and topic, IMO sports optics are no different than any other bit of sporting or hobby equipment in that there is a fairly well defined point of diminishing return. To get that last few percent, it's going to cost you.

As a hobby one can enjoy for their entire life, it's easier to make a case for top flight gear as the additional cost amortized over the many years of use is insignificant. I make the case that the only issue that counts is "Does it make your birding experience more enjoyable?" Then it's worth it. ;)
 
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As we seem to have a parallel in the past few posts between a love of alky-hol and a love of bins.

The trick is to restrict yourself only to buying better bins or signle malts (you get to define better!). Eventually you run out of bins to buy and so you have to be happy with that Swaro EL 42mm. Well, that an the 32mm.

Really. I'm not a binocuholic. I can stop whenever I want!
 
Kevin Purcell said:
As we seem to have a parallel in the past few posts between a love of alky-hol and a love of bins.

The trick is to restrict yourself only to buying better bins or signle malts (you get to define better!). Eventually you run out of bins to buy and so you have to be happy with that Swaro EL 42mm. Well, that an the 32mm.

Really. I'm not a binocuholic. I can stop whenever I want!
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I find with field glasses Leica are rather good and Bruilladich malt rather delightful.

POP
 
Sancho said:
Kevin Purcell said:
Eventually you run out of bins to buy and so you have to be happy with that Swaro EL 42mm. Well, that an the 32mm.
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And a pair of compacts. And a pair of "Hawkes" just ´cos they´re intriguing. And something Image-Stabilised for when the DT´s get too much....;);)
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Spoken like a true binocuholic, Sancho. ;)

So what is on the Eagle Optics Hot Deals today ...

Curiously I got the Hawke (from Frank) and a closeout Bushnell Elite (very nice ergonomics but a view just a notch below the Hawke) in the past few days and I actually feel almost satiated.

The end is nigh without going Alpha. And I can't see that happening right now.
 
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Kevin Purcell said:
The end is nigh without going Alpha. And I can't see that happening right now.
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I can totally relate to that. I was lurking on the ebay for a pair of 2nd hand Leica Ultravid 8x42. With economy this down, I don't see that happening any time soon without getting a divorce paper served.;) The review about those Chinese EDs from Frank and Steve have been encouraging. How do you think your Elite vs Frontier?
 
Kevin Purcell said:
Spoken like a true binocuholic, Sancho. ;)

So what is on the Eagle Optics Hot Deals today ...

Curiously I got the Hawke (from Frank) and a closeout Bushnell Elite (very nice ergonomics but a view just a notch below the Hawke) in the past few days and I actually feel almost satiated.

The end is nigh without going Alpha. And I can't see that happening right now.
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Kevin

As being the original stirrer of the whole thread can I ask you what drives you to do this? I just can't understand. Is it a collecting thing? An admiration for good workmanship? Being able to compare and contrast?

Hope it still allows you time to get out birding;)
 
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