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Looking for interesting big binocular (1 Viewer)

M

MBS

Well-known member
Hi,

A question dealing with big binoculars (ie: diameter above 60 mm and power above x 20).

Are there good models (that is: not too costly but with sufficient performances), between low end Chinese binoculars (with interesting prices but optical results not really pleasant in daylight, although acceptable for night astronomical observations), and high end German (Zeiss) or Japanese (Fujinon) binoculars (all with exceptional viewing quality and also exceptional prices)?

In fewer words, I am looking for middle range (in term of price AND optical results) big binoculars, to use for timid and/or distant animal observation.

I already own 20 x 60 mm ex-USSR binocular, and now I am planning to get through something better without "ruinning myself".

Many thanks in advance for your suggestions and opinions.

Best Regards.
 
Hi,

How about Pentax 20X60 PCF WP II?
It's a Waterproof & Fogproof Porro Prism Binocular but Angle of View is just 2.2° ,Field-of-View (@ 1000 Yds) 114' (38 m at 1000 m) and Minimum Focus Distance is 26.2' (8.0 m)
They cost $229 at B&H.

I tried them with tripod for 5 minutes at bird festival in Japan, it's O.K. The view is a bit tube like though.

There is a review at C.N./binocular section,I guess. It seems astronomer favored them.

Regards,Katsu
 
katsunori said:
Hi,

How about Pentax 20X60 PCF WP II?
It's a Waterproof & Fogproof Porro Prism Binocular but Angle of View is just 2.2° ,Field-of-View (@ 1000 Yds) 114' (38 m at 1000 m) and Minimum Focus Distance is 26.2' (8.0 m)
They cost $229 at B&H.

I tried them with tripod for 5 minutes at bird festival in Japan, it's O.K. The view is a bit tube like though.

There is a review at C.N./binocular section,I guess. It seems astronomer favored them.

Regards,Katsu
Click to expand...


Hi Katsunori, and thank you for your message.

Indeed, the price is very affordable.

To all readers:

Are there other models of big-binoculars interesting for dual use (astro/nature) ?

How about Fujinon 16 x 70 mm, for instance ?

Though the price is a little bit in the high end zone !

Best Regards.
 
The problem with binoculars is that they get dim as you go to 20x. My cheap scope is already an 80mm scope, thus I get pretty good views at 25x to 45x.

We have very few members here who know these. Here are some models:
http://www.opticsplanet.net/binastro.html
You can see they tend to be 15x to 20x. An astronomy forum might be of more help to pin down a model for you.
 
Check out your British Astronomy magazine, "Astronomy Now," and the Ads by Orion Telescopes in it. You should find some 15 x 70's or similar that will meet your specifications. Some may even have Center focus.
Bob
 
MBS said:
How about Fujinon 16 x 70 mm, for instance ?
Click to expand...
I looked at these before buying a scope. They are robust, optically excellent (see the Cloudy Nights reviews) and quite reasonably priced considering the quality. However, the close focus is not very good, individual focussing is awkwardly slow for birding and I decided I really wanted a bit more magnification.

John
 
there's a whole range of observation bins on the warehouse express site.
try looking at the Opticron range
20x70 (£170) through to much more expensive than you want
 
andrew_s said:
there's a whole range of observation bins on the warehouse express site.
try looking at the Opticron range
20x70 (£170) through to much more expensive than you want
Click to expand...

Well,

After a quick look at the Opticron site, I reply to all of you.

First, the binocular models at Opticron are chinese models, sold under many different brand name, but being made in a handfull of factory.

Second, I seems that to find good big binoculars (x 20 up to x 40 magnification, and 60 mm to 90 mm diameter), beeing better than the low end chinese binoculars sold around 200 euros up to 500 euros (about 240 $US up to 600 US$), and without having to put more than 500 to 1000 euros on the counter, is not an easy task.

There is a real gap between low optical results chinese binoculars (poor chromatic aberration correction) and high end Zeiss or Fujinon models (those with 80 to 100 mm diameter, and costing thousands of euros or US$).

For the record I was looking for models usable as well as an astronomical binocular than a dailight instrument (nature, birds, marine).

I precise that my choice of x 20 to x 40 for the magnifying power and 60 mm to 90 mm, is guided by the following facts:

Magnification above x 40 is nearly useless for observation made at groud level of distant items themselves located far away and at ground level (due to turbulence and eat waves, in daylight).

And, for these magnifications, 60 mm to 90 mm diameters are essential (due to the need of a sufficient luminosity).

Why not go above 90 mm? Because in such a case, weight and cost begin to rocket.

A last word about chinese binocular, just to say I know them from experience, as the ex-owner of a 20 x 80 mm, fitted with triplet objectives. In spite of this triplet of lenses, chromatic aberration was negligible on faint star fields, bearable for Jupiter or Moon viewing, and very unpleasant for dailight use. And chromatic aberration was not the only problem, there was also distorsion, etc.

Thank you for you help, everybody.
 
Last edited:
Hi,

There is a very interesting article dealing with the chromatic aberration phenomenon of big binoculars, in the "clooudynight" Web site.

In few words, the longer the focal lenght of the objectives, the lower the chromatic aberration, for the same kind of objective combination: doublet or triplet lenses; crown and flint or special ED glasses...

There is a chart with objectif diameters versus focal lenghts (in other words f/d aperture) according to levels of chromatic aberration.

It seems that f/D in the 10 to 20 value range are the good choice to minimize chromatic aberration, the same values than for refractors, and this is logical...

The problem is: where to find such binoculars with these focal lenghts?

But to buy and use two good refractors put side by side.

And, is this case, the luminosity will be very low, in fact (f/d = 10 to 20!).

This is a kind of "square circle" problem, except with the use of ED and other special glasses, with the fitting price...

Best Regards.
 
Last edited:
MBS said:
In fewer words, I am looking for middle range (in term of price AND optical results) big binoculars, to use for timid and/or distant animal observation.
Click to expand...

I went on such a search as yours not too long ago.

If you really want to use them for birding be aware that most big binos are NOT suited to birding because the near focus is too distant-usually 60 feet or more.

Anyway I ended up getting a pair of Orion Mini Giant 15x63s.
They have a close focus of 20 feet-much closer than most other big binos.
They are a little pricey at $220. However they are made in Japan and the overall fit and finish is definitly a cut above most in this size that I have seen.

The on axis performance is tack sharp and bright with a nice wide 3.7 degree FOV.

Overall, for birding, I couldn't find anything else even close in a big bin that was as well suited to birding as these.

At least take a look at them:

http://www.telescope.com/shopping/p...=PRODUCT&iMainCat=5&iSubCat=18&iProductID=319

SF

Nikon Action non EX 7x35
Zeiss "Classic" 7x42
Bushnell Excursion 8x28
Leica BA 8x32
Nikon Action non EX 10x50
Pentax 12x50
Orion Mini Giant 15x63
Pentax 80mm ED spotter
Pentax 100mm ED spotter
 
Last edited:
Sout Fork said:
I went on such a search as yours not too long ago.

If you really want to use them for birding be aware that most big binos are NOT suited to birding because the near focus is too distant-usually 60 feet or more.

Anyway I ended up getting a pair of Orion Mini Giant 15x63s.
They have a close focus of 20 feet-much closer than most other big binos.
They are a little pricey at $220. However they are made in Japan and the overall fit and finish is definitly a cut above most in this size that I have seen.

The on axis performance is tack sharp and bright with a nice wide 3.7 degree FOV.

Overall, for birding, I couldn't find anything else even close in a big bin that was as well suited to birding as these.

At least take a look at them:

http://www.telescope.com/shopping/p...=PRODUCT&iMainCat=5&iSubCat=18&iProductID=319

SF

Nikon Action non EX 7x35
Zeiss "Classic" 7x42
Bushnell Excursion 8x28
Leica BA 8x32
Nikon Action non EX 10x50
Pentax 12x50
Orion Mini Giant 15x63
Pentax 80mm ED spotter
Pentax 100mm ED spotter
Click to expand...


Hi,

Thank you for the info and the URL, I am trying to find if there are dealers somewhere in Europa.

Best Regards
 
Birding / Astro binocs

You might be interested in the Vixen Giant Ark 80mm series. They're big enough for astro but waterproof for birding. They come in four fixed powers from 12x to 30x. They remaining stock is available from Vixen North America direct and on sale at wholesale prices.




MBS said:
Hi Katsunori, and thank you for your message.

Indeed, the price is very affordable.

To all readers:

Are there other models of big-binoculars interesting for dual use (astro/nature) ?

How about Fujinon 16 x 70 mm, for instance ?

Though the price is a little bit in the high end zone !

Best Regards.
Click to expand...
 
MBS said:
How about Fujinon 16 x 70 mm, for instance ?

Though the price is a little bit in the high end zone !

Best Regards.
Click to expand...

There is a new Chinese made "Fujinon clone". Telescope Service in Germany sell them as TS Marine binoculars. In USA they are sold under the name of Garrett Signature Series. Possibly under other brands also.

I have the TS 15x70 Marine. Excellent quality, moderate price.

Marko
 
Marko_ said:
There is a new Chinese made "Fujinon clone". Telescope Service in Germany sell them as TS Marine binoculars. In USA they are sold under the name of Garrett Signature Series. Possibly under other brands also.

I have the TS 15x70 Marine. Excellent quality, moderate price.

Marko
Click to expand...

Hi Marko,

Thank you for the information.

Best Regards
 
Hi,

If you are the owner of big binocular models in the 56 mm to 70 mm range, I am interested in your opinion about them, in daylight and twilight or dawn contexts : résidual chromatic aberration, field curvature, color neutrality, contrast handling, etc.

For instance:

Nikon 10 x 70mm IF; Zeiss Victory 10 x 56mm and 8 x 56mm, Others models of known brands (9 x 63 mm, etc.).

If you are a night time (including twilight and dawn) naturalist observer, Thank you in advance for sharing your experience .

By,
 
Last edited:
MBS...

I have three binoculars that I consider big binoculars:

Nikon SE 12x50
Fujinon FMT-SX 16x70
Garrett Signature 22x85

For daytime birdwatching the Nikon SE 12x50 binocular is exceptional, Fujinon FMT-SX 16x70 is good, and the Garrett Signature 22x85 is fair due to a milky aberration and weight of 10 lbs. requiring a 13-pound tripod/mount (23 lbs. total). At night, I use all three, favoring the Fujinon 16x70. During the day even the 12x50 and 16x70 require a tripod/mount. However, some report they can hold the 12x50 with minimal tremor (shake).

While many night sky observers go for much bigger apertures and magnification (we call these giant binoculars), I think a better option would be a good refractor telescope with binoviewer and twin eyepiece sets. Of course we are talking about a much bigger investment than $200--more like $3,000 and above (U.S.).

Giant binoculars (larger than 16x and 70mm) are heavy, individual focused, and produce an inferior resolution when compared to a quality refractor telescope and binoviewer setup. However, the refractor setup may not deliver as much light and the images may be darker than a giant binocular of comparable objective size. With giant binoculars 100% of each objective is going to each eye, while with a telescope and binoviewer the light collected through a single objective is split between two eyes (50% to each eye). EdZ has many excellent reports in the CN archives (both binocular and binoviewer forums) about the comparisons.

Bottom line, if you want to get into giant binoculars, prepare to spend a minimum of $1200 for the binocular and tripod/mount setup (and that is the minimum). Anything less may prove to be a disappointment.

Bob
Kentucky, USA
 
Last edited:
I use a Fujinon FMT-SX 16x70. In daytime use, it certainly will show more detail than any typical handheld binocular, but if you are accustomed to the luxury image and viewing ease of fine small binoculars, it is a disappointment, at least to me.

While it is very good for astronomy, by day it shows enough color error, lack of contrast, and slight image softness, that I wouldn't recommend it as is to an experienced observer. These errors can be brought under control by stopping down the objectives to about 55mm, restricting the light path to the central sweet spot of the optics. The smaller exit pupil that results is a little harder to view, but not bad.

I haven't used it much in twilight conditions. There, the errors should be less noticeable, and full aperture use probably satisfactory.
Ron
 
the Canon 18x50 IS binoculars might be another option for you. They perform very well optically and the IS allows hand held operations.
However, at about $1300 from Amazon, they may not fit the budget you had suggested.
 
Have a look at first light optics based in Exeter.
They have a range of astro bins, the Helios Quantum range is one.
Trouble is large optics don't come cheap and bins have 2 sets of optics, a scope only has 1.
Others are pulsar optical.
 
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