Camera advice. dilemma! (1 Viewer)

Camera advice please. dilemma!

Hello all. I'm totally new to digiscoping and haven't splashed out on any extra equipment as yet. If you can take the time to read, here's the deal:
I've used scopes for birding for years, I've used cameras for years (digital, slr's and dslr's), but never both combined for digiscoping.
So far, I've practised in the garden with scope/camera combinations, just to see if i think, 'yes, it's woth having a go at' or 'nah, i won't bother'. I have no adapters or brackets as yet, as I'm still not satisfied in what direction to go. What I have done so far is use two types of digital camera, just by holding to the scope eyepiece and seeing the results. Obviously the images taken were absolute rubbish, but i did see that digiscoping is possible, and that acceptable images could be obtained with more finesse, adapters, etc.
I used two different cameras, 1. a bog standard cheapo kodak 3x optical zoom compact, and 2. a panasonic fz8 and I shot a couple of hundred pics with each. With the cheapo compact, setting and aligning scope and camera was eazy peazy, and composition and zooming out the vignette was an easy operation to. The image quality was OK, but not good, only due to the inadequacy of the cheapo camera.
The panasonic fz8 was an absolute nightmare to try to align by hand, due to the camera lens being so much bigger in diameter than the scope eye piece, and focusing was very very difficult. That's it, I thought, forget the fz8 and treat yourself to better quality compact, buy the adapter, and take the easy route. As with most things though, there is a but! I fiddled around with the settings on the fz8, and, out of the 200 pics, I found one that was a big 'yes! thats the quality I want'. That was by using the fz8's 'converter' settings and setting to 'macro converter', using a 7mp resolution, AP at f2.8, dropping the ISO to 200, and leaving the vignette. The high res image meant that cropping the vignette and resizing the image retained the quality.
(Yes, I have read an early thread by tusharkroy re: fz8 )

Obviously, just 'digiscoping' by holding camera to scope did not give satisfactory results with either camera, but i did see that the theory of digiscoping works.
Sorry to ramble on a bit, I suppose the question is, do I buy a 30 quid F-Adapter and use the panasonic fz8, or do I buy an 'ebay special' high quality compact for around a hundred quid and an adapter bracket? I suppose the answer is swings and roundabouts, but any comments and/or advice would be very much appreciated.
Cheers

Firstly, what 'scope and eyepiece do you intend to use?
I believe the general preference would be to use a compact camera, and some can be bought for less than £100 new. As an example of a compact camera used by a few Birdforum members, the Canon Powershot A590IS is listed on Pricerunner from £83.98 (incl. P&P) see :-
http://www.pricerunner.co.uk/pl/29-.../Canon-PowerShot-A590-IS-Black-Compare-Prices
Have a look through this forum at other compact cameras that have been used successfully.
(I currently use a Nikon P5100, but these are much more expensive, and also have been superseded by the even more expensive P6000)

Roger

rogerscoth said:

Firstly, what 'scope and eyepiece do you intend to use?
I believe the general preference would be to use a compact camera, and some can be bought for less than £100 new. As an example of a compact camera used by a few Birdforum members, the Canon Powershot A590IS is listed on Pricerunner from £83.98 (incl. P&P) see :-
http://www.pricerunner.co.uk/pl/29-.../Canon-PowerShot-A590-IS-Black-Compare-Prices
Have a look through this forum at other compact cameras that have been used successfully.
(I currently use a Nikon P5100, but these are much more expensive, and also have been superseded by the even more expensive P6000)

Roger

Click to expand...

The scope I have is a cheapy 'camlink' CSP80, only cost me a hundred quid, but, though cheap, i found the image quality pretty peachy. Not sure how it will hold up to the knocks and bangs of birding, time will tell. Eyepiece is a 20-60 zoom, 38mm diameter. I know I can get a 'digiscope' adapter that will fit the scope, either a 52mm thread 'camera end' one for the panasonic fz8, or a generic one so suit a compact. I'm not fussed about being able to use the zoom while 'digiscoping' and I would rather not anyway. My personal preference, if I go down the 'compact camera' route, is flexibility in the camera functions. ie the ability to set shutter speed, f values, ISO, etc etc
as necessary.

I'm new to this forum, and new to the idea of "digiscoping". Only last week did I even realise that a digital camera could be used with a 'scope! I have been a bird-watcher for years - but only with bins, never having a 'scope or a decent camera. I am still researching the ins and outs and trying myself to decide what to buy, but I think from my brief period of research so far I have decided that holding a camera manually to the lens of the 'scope is not a line I want to go down... and that I don't want large, cumbersome, awkward, ugly brackets either. A neat little arrangement which holds the camera firmly in place over the 'scope is preferable, I think, and so I'm looking at buying a combination which is made to go together. I don't know whether any of this helps you!

derekhollis said:

I'm new to this forum, and new to the idea of "digiscoping". Only last week did I even realise that a digital camera could be used with a 'scope! I have been a bird-watcher for years - but only with bins, never having a 'scope or a decent camera. I am still researching the ins and outs and trying myself to decide what to buy, but I think from my brief period of research so far I have decided that holding a camera manually to the lens of the 'scope is not a line I want to go down... and that I don't want large, cumbersome, awkward, ugly brackets either. A neat little arrangement which holds the camera firmly in place over the 'scope is preferable, I think, and so I'm looking at buying a combination which is made to go together. I don't know whether any of this helps you!

Click to expand...

Watch this space! I've just had an eBay result that's left me with enough profit to be able to splash out on a decent tripod, a cable release bracket, and all the fittings to fit my panasonic fz8 to my scope. I'm chuffed because it hasn't cost me anything so I can give it a go, and if i find the camera and/or scope is not up to the job, I can put the 'extra's' I just bought back onto ebay and will only lose pennies. I'm not over confident about what results I'll get with the fz8, I've used it with a teleconverter and the results are rubbish.

Don't know about the FZ8, but a Swarovski guy told me, that my FZ18 will not work for digiscoping due the big front lense. I tried anyway, but there is a huge vignetting as expected (and even that only on a very small range of the camera zoom). The cam is also to big so it cannot mounted on the DCB-A adapter for my ATS 80 HD.
I think this is also valid for the FZ8 and the newer FZ28.

bughunter said:

Don't know about the FZ8, but a Swarovski guy told me, that my FZ18 will not work for digiscoping due the big front lense. I tried anyway, but there is a huge vignetting as expected (and even that only on a very small range of the camera zoom). The cam is also to big so it cannot mounted on the DCB-A adapter for my ATS 80 HD.
I think this is also valid for the FZ8 and the newer FZ28.

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My thoughts too bughunter. like I said, it is not , theoreticly, going to cost me anything to find out, so I should get all my bits by the weekend and I'll be able to post a yes or no on the viabilties. Might then save other people time as well as myself.

cheersm8 said:

My thoughts too bughunter. like I said, it is not , theoreticly, going to cost me anything to find out, so I should get all my bits by the weekend and I'll be able to post a yes or no on the viabilties. Might then save other people time as well as myself.

Click to expand...

Well, tried the scope/panasonic fz8 combo on a little birding trip and? Well, It is very very hard work with an fz8 ( thats an understatement ). The result is that I found digiscoping a whole load of fun and I'm hooked, so I'm now giving myself a real headache trying to find the camera that suits, within my budget, and that will make the discoping thing just a little easier for me.
Now I have started looking around, camera choice, on a budget, is a nightmare. The features I need are 3x zoom minimum, 7mp resolution minimum, burst mode, AP mode with option to reduce f value to f2.8, ISO options, metering options, and shutter speed options, rechargable battery, and SDHC storage. It was not until I started looking that I found it easy to find budget cameras with some of my required features, but a struggle to find any with all. The second hand market is my best options with view to the redundant nikon and/or panasonic lumix models. I'm fairly confident that I'll pick a suitable camera up for £100 max in the next month or so, via ebay and car boots.

My scope/fz8 results can be seen here:

my gallery http://www.birdforum.net/gallery/showgallery.php/ppuser/77625/cat/500

cheersm8 said:

Well, tried the scope/panasonic fz8 combo on a little birding trip and? Well, It is very very hard work with an fz8 ( thats an understatement ). The result is that I found digiscoping a whole load of fun and I'm hooked, so I'm now giving myself a real headache trying to find the camera that suits, within my budget, and that will make the discoping thing just a little easier for me.
Now I have started looking around, camera choice, on a budget, is a nightmare. The features I need are 3x zoom minimum, 7mp resolution minimum, burst mode, AP mode with option to reduce f value to f2.8, ISO options, metering options, and shutter speed options, rechargable battery, and SDHC storage. It was not until I started looking that I found it easy to find budget cameras with some of my required features, but a struggle to find any with all. The second hand market is my best options with view to the redundant nikon and/or panasonic lumix models. I'm fairly confident that I'll pick a suitable camera up for £100 max in the next month or so, via ebay and car boots.

My scope/fz8 results can be seen here:

my gallery http://www.birdforum.net/gallery/showgallery.php/ppuser/77625/cat/500

Click to expand...

Hi,
I tried to reply earlier,and had a problem,so I will upload photo first.

I use a Canon A590IS bought new here in Australia a couple of months ago for A$128.00,
I am sure that is only around 50 British pounds.

Looking at the photo,you will see a white ring around the eyepiece(Skywatcher ED80),this is simply a piece of plastic tube that fits neatly over the eyepiece,and is a guide for the Canon A590 lens.

I only ever shoot handheld.
The young Butcherbird was taken at 30 metres,and it was a very dull day.


Hope this is of some help to you.
John

johnno said:

Hi,
I tried to reply earlier,and had a problem,so I will upload photo first.

I use a Canon A590IS bought new here in Australia a couple of months ago for A$128.00,
I am sure that is only around 50 British pounds.

Looking at the photo,you will see a white ring around the eyepiece(Skywatcher ED80),this is simply a piece of plastic tube that fits neatly over the eyepiece,and is a guide for the Canon A590 lens.

I only ever shoot handheld.
The young Butcherbird was taken at 30 metres,and it was a very dull day.


Hope this is of some help to you.
John

Click to expand...

John,
I love your setup. What's the DSLR on the top of the scope?
I'd love to catch up next time I come down. I normally head for Shortland and Ash Island when get back.
Neil.

Neil said:

John,
I love your setup. What's the DSLR on the top of the scope?
I'd love to catch up next time I come down. I normally head for Shortland and Ash Island when get back.
Neil.

Click to expand...

Hi Neil,

The camera on top of the scope is a Panasonic FZ28,I have it lined up with the scopes eyepiece,gives me the best of both worlds.

Sometimes the birds land on the close feeder about 3 metres from my bedroom window waay to close for the ED80 to focus,hence the FZ28 on top of the scope.

Shortland is about an hours drive from my place,I haven't been there,my Disabilities sometimes prevent me from travelling.

I would love to catch up with you next time you are in the Hunter Area,just send me a pm,and if I am able to,we can catch up.

Cheers.
John

The best of the first pictures

derekhollis said:

I'm new to this forum, and new to the idea of "digiscoping". Only last week did I even realise that a digital camera could be used with a 'scope! I have been a bird-watcher for years - but only with bins, never having a 'scope or a decent camera. I am still researching the ins and outs and trying myself to decide what to buy, but I think from my brief period of research so far I have decided that holding a camera manually to the lens of the 'scope is not a line I want to go down... and that I don't want large, cumbersome, awkward, ugly brackets either. A neat little arrangement which holds the camera firmly in place over the 'scope is preferable, I think, and so I'm looking at buying a combination which is made to go together. I don't know whether any of this helps you!

Click to expand...

The best of the first digiscoping pictures are on my Facebook page in the photo album "X peri ments".... for those of you who have Facebook -you may need to send a "Friend Request" to access them... just ask (and say you're on BirdForum) Derek Hollis

Well, since starting the thread I've moved away from the panasonic fz8 and now use a canon SD790, not everyones choice, as there is no AP setting, but, I've found that by using it in manual mode and changing ISO to suit, coupled with upping or lowering EV to get a desired shutter speed, it works a dream and the lens diameter is ideal for my scope. I made a mistake of buying a 'digiscope adapter' and, OK it's good, but I tell you what, the 'push on' adapter I have now made for £1.17 pence out of two pieces of nylon plumbing fittings is ten times better than the £30's worth of clamps and thumbscrews. I found one size of pipe that fitted exactly over my scope eye piece and another bit of pipe that fitted snuggly over the camera lens, then super glued one into the other and the little home-made gadget fits a dream over the scope and holds the camera perfectly, with no fiddling about centering and lining up. If I pushed it on blind folded it would still be perfectly centred.