birders lacking spirit of adventure? (1 Viewer)

[wildtracks]

We've been hosting 18 to 24 yr old Gap year conservation volunteers in Belize for the last nine years (over 350 of them, last time we counted, not including numerous expeditions like Trekforce and Raleigh), and there really is a difference in the ones we get now compared with those eight to ten years ago.

Then, they were hard to keep out of the forest, and would walk miles to see birds, camping out overnight if necessary. Now all the focus is on meeting up with the other volunteers for the next weekend's drinking activities...at night it is hard to motivate them to move from their card games to see a puma, even if it within 100 feet of the fieldbase. I don't think we've had a volunteer arrive in Belize with a pair of binoculars and a field guide for at least two years....hence why we've just finished with this programme. Very saddening. What happened to the spirit of adventure?....Wildtracks

 

[mountain man]

Is the world really so dangerous in comparison to the 70s/80s?

I would have thought that there were just as many terrorist/guerilla groups, uprisings, violent civil rights demonstrations, the fear of the evil commies etc...

...infact thinking about it, the world was a hell of a lot more dangerous back then!

The answer to this thread has already been answered...

...the spirit of adventure is still alive and kicking in young birders, there just aren't very many.

By the way Tim, I was just reading your trip report on Birdtours on the Manu Road - Sarah and I are off there in Sept 2005... expect a few emails... quite a few emails!

 

[Edward woodwood]

Hi Tom
good news indeed!
you will love it to death.....sword-billed hummer at the top is unreal. And plenty of Coca Tea!

I may even be that way myself as school summer hols only really lend themselves to South America.....

As an aside Peru was very dangerous in early 90s and two brits got muredered there by the Sendero Luminoso - all very sad as they were great guys and very popular in the birding circles then....just a bit TOO adventurous. Peru is now very safe and Manu Road is no exception. The Bus journey will make you fill your pants though Tom! I also have a Peru expert for a mate so emails will be no problem

 

[mountain man]

And plenty of Coca Tea!

What's that? Anything like Hash-Cakes? :eat: :hippy: :eek!:

The Bus journey will make you fill your pants though Tom!

Come on! Surely no worse than going past the Cat & Fiddle near Buxton...?

And besides, there's no room in my pants

 

[Stevie babe]

Just a spot of optimism. On a birding trip round Chichester harbour (I was part of a group from RSPB East Surrey) it took a 12 / 13 year old to pipe up "hey, there's a bird of prey over there, I think its a pere.., yes a peregrine. He was looking to a point about a mile away."

I started birding at around 14, some 35+ years ago, seen the changes but feel there is still hope, with the likes of that young lad.

Stevie Babe

 

[Edward woodwood]

Tom,
Coca Tea (mate de coca) helps at high altitude....as does chewing the leaves which is also a common practice in rural areas - staves off hunger and prolongs physical effort (helps with a days birding then!)

you're right, Manu Road has nothing on the Cat and Fiddle road on a dark foggy night - and the locals are much less weird in Peru, and there is more than one species of bird in the area.....

 

[edenwatcher]

Tom,
Coca Tea (mate de coca) helps at high altitude....as does chewing the leaves which is also a common practice in rural areas - staves off hunger and prolongs physical effort (helps with a days birding then!)

Tastes pish though ...

Rob

 

[edenwatcher]

Hi Tom
good news indeed!
you will love it to death.....sword-billed hummer at the top is unreal.

You b*gger!

Rob

 

[cliven]

Spirit of Adventure Lacking

All the above mentioned are factors. Especially debt and other financial security issues for young people.

More insidious and pervasive though is the "commodification of adventure" which as a society we have created. Granted, more young people today have experience of kayaking, climbing and other "extreme sports" (which, by the way, never used to be called that) and many more now take these up in later life but their experience is often in the context of a guided group following well developed itineraries. Many young people have been led to believe, through our risk-avoidance and litigation culture, that they must have (and pay for) a leader or have some form of qualification themselves to venture to the more edgy environments of the world.

A youngster asked me the other day how he could get a certificate to climb on a crag local to me. In order to foster interest in a walk down a river bed (wildlife and beauty abounding) it is necessary to call it a "beck scramble" and approach it as an obstacle course with "death drops" and "loony leaps" into pools. Turn it into an "extreme sport". Ideally gratification should be immediate and involve a limited amount of preparation. In our outdoor activities programme at the college where I work youngsters often ask if they can do rollerblading, bungee jumping, snow-boarding, BMX and parcour. "Extreme sports" again, as opposed to "outdoor activities" - it's the adrenaline rush aspect which appeals. Another youngster asked me "Do we have to learn all that harness stuff?" before a rock climbing session recently. "How else are you going to protect yourself?" I answered.

I don't wish to demean those who enjoy these sorts of activities. I'm impressed by the skill and nerve of BMXers and the like, but our youth and education culture no longer seems to be developing the sort of curious adventurers it once did.

I realise that this collective lack of self-confidence and feeling that environments and the activities in them should be "branded" as "extreme" to be interesting for young people is not ubiquitous. However it seems to be a rarer youngster today that is happy to develop the slow burning satisfaction which comes from learning skills which yield lasting reward, self-knowledge, self-reliance and understanding of others and the environment. Much more common it seems is the "bungee jump then down the bar for tequila slammers" mentality.

It's a shame and it's probably our fault.

 

[Silvershark]

I'm hoping to start working in Conservation...unfortunately there is a little problem in that I can't DRIVE yet! I may also need to move away from where I currently live, in fact it is looking increasingly likely that I'll have to move either further North or South which of course requires money to set up accommodation, food, all those other things that are needed, council tax...

The wages don't put me off at all though, it is something that I want to do. I would wonder if student loans would inhibit students from taking a course relevent to bird conservation, the most popular conservation subject lately seems to be Marine Biology which is relevent only to marine birds.

To be honest though, most of the people I studied with at uni weren't into birding, or any kind of wildlife watching and most had no interest in working in a wildlife-related career.

I don't think the trouble is a fear of travelling as others have already mentioned, it's just that travelling to see birds isn't high on most peoples agenda.

 

[Bluetail]

In order to foster interest in a walk down a river bed (wildlife and beauty abounding) it is necessary to call it a "beck scramble" and approach it as an obstacle course with "death drops" and "loony leaps" into pools. Turn it into an "extreme sport". Ideally gratification should be immediate and involve a limited amount of preparation.

Isn't this just symptomatic of our society? We live in the culture of the soundbite. It certainly isn't just the young that expect instant gratification. In our leisure activities at least, we have learnt to expect the rewards without first putting in the effort. (Cue for a rant about popular music, but I shall resist... )

 

[Silvershark]

We've been hosting 18 to 24 yr old Gap year conservation volunteers in Belize for the last nine years (over 350 of them, last time we counted, not including numerous expeditions like Trekforce and Raleigh), and there really is a difference in the ones we get now compared with those eight to ten years ago.

Then, they were hard to keep out of the forest, and would walk miles to see birds, camping out overnight if necessary. Now all the focus is on meeting up with the other volunteers for the next weekend's drinking activities...at night it is hard to motivate them to move from their card games to see a puma, even if it within 100 feet of the fieldbase. I don't think we've had a volunteer arrive in Belize with a pair of binoculars and a field guide for at least two years....hence why we've just finished with this programme. Very saddening. What happened to the spirit of adventure?....Wildtracks

Sounds like the field trip I went on...only one student had a pair of binoculars with them...me! I didn't have a field guide though, couldn't afford the field guide for the area so most of the wildlife I saw went unidentified, but to be honest identifying wasn't as important to me as enjoying watching the wildlife. It didn't really matter to me what the birds name was, in the end I was just happy to be able to watch the bird without thinking about identification. Most students were highly interested in seeking out the not-very-elusive bottle of tequila though!

 

[jurek]

One thing is that there are lots of known bird hotspots. So people go to one or another well known destination like Bharatpur or Thailand and don't bother with adventure.

Another is that RSPB for years was orinted towards older peeople with this bird-feeding in a garden etc.

And yes, student loans and competitive job market kills hobby.

 

[Dimitris]

A very interesting thread this is. :clap:

As for me I'm 19 years old and I've birded in Greece and Oz.I'd love to be an ornithologist and I'm going to chase that dream till the end...

I've been in swamps and jungles and I've found snakes and I've been bitten by leeches all for the sake of birding.I love it!It's so much better then sitting at home.But sadly I can do this only in Oz.In Athens unfortunately I don't have the space and people don't really aprove of beeing interested in nature.Sometime I'm going to travel to the Amazon...

Well that's me but sadly by fellow uni students and friends aren't that interested.The closest is hunting...Boys are interested in cars,football,PC and girls.Girls about fashion,Gossip,shopping and boys.I've found another birder his 21 years old and is a midfiled general he knows many things including entomology,herpetology etc.But we 2 are the exception.When we tell them the stories of our adventures and show them pictures of what we've seen and done theyr jaws drop.As for acception there's no problem with beeing a birder but when you ask them if they would try it they say no.As for the Greenhouse effect,pollution,biodeversity they don't give a sh1t or they'r simply not interested or unimformed.Or as some of them say:"God created evrything for us to enjoy."

I'm often asked what I'm going to do with the degree I'm going to get in ecology/ornithology etc as there are not many jobs around about things like that.I tell them I'm following my dreams...And they say that I'm right but money is important too.But were there's a will there's a way.But for others,sadly,money forces them to abandon them.When you ask them what they really want to do they usually say something totally diffrent then the thing theyr studying.We have a student that loves football(soccer) he's not good with lessons.I asked him why he isn't out on the stadiums.He said:"What about money?That's to much of a risk to take.".Sad...

As for terorism,diseases etc.No,I don't think that the youth is afraid of these things.For one thing we're young if you don't take risks life's boring and nobody wants that when theyr young.

To sum things up (at least for Greece) I think it's the lack of interest more then anything else.Money yes is a BIG issue,but don't forget the power of dreams.Adventure,you can get it through a PC screen,but sometime you realise the fake world you live in.Dreams,they are dying from money,but then if you don't follow them you'll be sad.

I don't think things are looking good for the next generation.(And I'm speaking as part of it).But please don't give up on us just yet.

Dimitris.

 

[Jos Stratford]

Been chopped up by three guys with machetes in Kenya, hijacked on a bus in El Salvador, hitch-hiked from Norway to South Africa and gone into Afganistan with a mujhadeen group. Was in Sri Lanka when the tsunami hit, had an earthquake (small) in Guatemala and was in Mozambique for a cyclone. Long live adventurous birding! Off to Gujarat in a couple of months ...would well recommend everybody avoid that corner of the world.

PS never had a single day's illness in all the time I've travelled ... but gone down with malaria after returning once

 

[jurek]

Girls about fashion,Gossip,shopping and boys.

I just remember some ringing camp story. There was a girl which looked very disinterested in birds. She was asked "are you interested in birds?" And answered: "Not that much birds, but more birders." :-O

 

[Silvershark]

I just remember some ringing camp story. There was a girl which looked very disinterested in birds. She was asked "are you interested in birds?" And answered: "Not that much birds, but more birders." :-O

Typical, girls pretend to be interested in birds for guys but guys NEVER pretend to be interested in lipstick for girls...

:gh:

 

[jurek]

Typical, girls pretend to be interested in birds for guys but guys NEVER pretend to be interested in lipstick for girls...

:clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[Bluetail]

While I was staying with an old friend this weekend we got onto the subject of how, when we were younger, schools and other organisations often used to arrange all sorts of adventurous activities and trips for youngsters. She was bemoaning the fact that you can't arrange such trips these days without first doing a full risk assessment. Futhermore, the liability that falls to the group leader if anything does go wrong acts as a disincentive to arranging anything at all daring. She reckoned (and she's probably right) that this change in attitude can be traced back to a canoing tragedy in Lyme Bay several years ago, which older members will remember. I wonder: are we perhaps mollycoddling our young too much? Do we still develop a spirit of adventure in them?

 

[Katy Penland]

We're raising a generation of videots. I mean, what's so exciting about fording a stream or shinnying up a tree when you're used to seeing some cyber-dude do triple somersaults in slow-mo and take out 10 bad guys at the same time? A pox on all video games, CGI'd movies and most of television as well. :brains: