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Habicht with sticky rubber (2 Viewers)

Also I bought it in 2016. What year is it made based on the serial no.? Since not many or only a few encountered a degrading and melting leatherette. Is it possible by chance I got a fake Habicht 8x30W? I used it at Louisiana with temperature of 92.2 Fahrenheit. What is the average temperature of your place. I wonder if it just melts the leatherette.
According to the serial number, your binoculars are from 2016

"ENVIRONMENT & CONDITIONS
-25 to +55 °C
Functional temperature
-30 to +70 °C
Storage temperature
13 ft / 4 m water depth (inert gas filling)
Submersion tightness"

92.2F =33.4C So you are in the theoretical graph with the temperature. But practically it is another story. The problem is still from the design of Swarovski! The chemical formula of rubber has changed for some years to one prone to degradation. Very disappointing from Swarovski
 
What exactly is the leatherette made of? Does all leatherette have rubber on it? Is it the rubber part that deteriorates or other parts of the leatherette? Anyone got some idea of the chemistry involved so we can know what kind of covering to look for and avoid in the future?
 
We don't know exactly, but we know that they are made to be more environmentally friendly than the old armor. These questions were addressed to Swarovki by other forum colleagues, and Swarovki replied that they are working on a solution for this armor issue. Until then, we are worried!
 
If you’re worried about alcohol getting inside then use sterile “injection swabs”, little bits of cloth impregnated with isopropyl alcohol. I got through a small pile when I was destickying my canon image stabilised bins. Took a while. Seems in your case that cutting the coating off and then removing any residue with alcohol wipes might be the answer. Then put a new coating on. As the binos are within warranty (2016… 10?yr) I’d contact swaro and get them to fix it. They’d likely package them well and insure the shipping. They seem to have a good reputation for fixing issues.

Peter
 
In my 2nd to last message. I described just doing that, cleaning the bare body sample with cotton bud soaked with isopropyl alcohol. But the black residue wouldn't come off. This is because it's like the entire leatherette just melted and fused with the bare body. Removing them with more corrosive liquid may not be worth as it may contaminate and damage the lens. The body is not important anyway, but the optics.

dorubird, they are not environmentally friendly. It's as if the leatherette just melted into the main body. I didn't use it for 2 years because busy with other things and just stored it in the original black pouch put inside cabinet in my room.

I can't return it to Swavorski because I already damaged the leatherette. And shipping back and forth could be huge. Also I'm curious about something. I bought it in 2016 for about $750. Now it's about $1250. Back then let's say the price was $1100. How could an online store sell them for $750 back then. You mean the margin for binoculars are so huge that they got them from Swavorski for only like $500? Do bino dealers have so huge profit margin for these, almost twice the amount? I'm also asking this because if it was not possible to get the Habicht for $750 in 2016 then I might have gotten factory rejects. This may explain why only me or a few encountered this leatherette just melting into the main body.
 
Wherever you live. Shipping internationally to Austria in Europe and back is expensive. It's not like via UPS to New York for $7 but more than $200. My packing tape will arrive tomorrow. Today I'm asking some chemistry folks if the degraded leatherette can give off fumes in the next 50 years I'll use the Habicht. If there is any chance it would give off fumes and endanger my home. I have to remove the entire leatherette but the problem is the sticky black thing will be left at the bare metal. Isoprophyl alcohol can't remove it. What solution must I use if I'll have to take it off? Acid is out of the question. Also are there eyecups that can protect the objective lens while cleaning the main body?

I'd go birdwatching now because I'm interested in the Cuckoos. They are amazing creatures and like Trojan horses and seems to prove Darwinian evolution rule.
 
habicht leatherette breakdown.jpg


habicht taped.jpg


In the first image you can see the leatherette breaking down or flaking off on its own. I didn't cut it. In the second image I was able finally to fix it by taping the leatherette with transparent packing tape. It works! I can finally hold it again.

For more serious birdwatching. I'll put the silver duct tape for even more superior finish.

I just hope the lens multicoating will stay for the next 50 years. How long before lens multicoating break down? I hope it won't prematurely do that, would it?
 
You’ll be long gone before modern coatings degrade, many WWII era binos with early coatings still have them intact. The stickiness might cause the tape to slide about a bit, which could be annoying. My preferred tape for this sort of thing is gorilla tape, seems to have better adhesive and last longer. Good to see these are back in action, as they’re a very well thought of model.
There are other solvents you could use that would take pretty much any stickiness off, but you’d want to use them sparingly and outside as they’re not the best for you.

Peter
 
Oh. So Gorilla tape is much stronger than a Duct Tape. But the problem is they are not black. And if you use a binocular that can shine in the forests, wild animals like a Gorilla can spot you easier.

So the clear tape may still be best. Yes it can slip a bit because of the sticky residue in the leatherette. If I remove the leatherette. What solvents exactly can remove the black residue in the bare body? Remember if any solvent (or baby oil, would this work?) touches the lens and you wipe it with cloth (even cleaning cloth). It can degrade the coating because any wiping can almost affect the coating.
 
I like camo gorilla tape that has a matt surface. The reflection off the glass and any non-camouflaged bits of you are likely to be much more of an issue.

Baby oil is not a solvent and will likely just cause a mess that is hard to get off.
If you use light contact with a soft material then modern coatings will be fine, but there is no reason that any glue cleaner should get in contact with the paint/optical surfaces if done properly.
I’d look for specific “glue remover” products that should be less toxic/flammable than many potent industrial solvents. One potential issue with solvents is that they can also remove paint, which could run when dissolved and potentially contaminate the optical surfaces and then be hard to remove. Plenty of rubbing with isopropyl alcohol impregnated wipes would be the thing I would try first, only changing if the residue didn’t respond.

Peter
 
I can't fathom how a few area of leatherette on a high end bino can degrade like that. Didn't they know it would occur? What kind of leatherette did they use? and how does it compare to the ones used in other brands? The devils is in the details. Let's get to the details of the composition of the leatherette used in different models and brands.
 
I can't fathom how a few area of leatherette on a high end bino can degrade like that. Didn't they know it would occur? What kind of leatherette did they use? and how does it compare to the ones used in other brands? The devils is in the details. Let's get to the details of the composition of the leatherette used in different models and brands.
I cannot for the life of me think why you did not contact Swarovski regarding 'your' problems and get them to sort it out. Your bino's would appear to be still within the warranty period yet you chose to remove the leatherette and apply 3M tape. Unbelievable.

You are concerned that they would get damaged in transit either within CONUS or to Austria. How did you think they got there in the first place?

You have lost me and frankly I couldn't care less what composition each manufacturer uses to manufacture its covering.

I have an 8 year old pair of Habichts that I bought off EBay and gave to one of my sons. They are perfect but were they to develop a fault I know that Swarovski in Austria would put them right.
Today I'm asking some chemistry folks if the degraded leatherette can give off fumes in the next 50 years I'll use the Habicht. If there is any chance it would give off fumes and endanger my home. I have to remove the entire leatherette but the problem is the sticky black thing will be left at the bare metal. Isoprophyl alcohol can't remove it. What solution must I use if I'll have to take it off? Acid is out of the question. Also are there eyecups that can protect the objective lens while cleaning the main body?

I'd go birdwatching now because I'm interested in the Cuckoos. They are amazing creatures and like Trojan horses and seems to prove Darwinian evolution rule.
Now I really do believe that you are taking the michael which is the polite British equivalent of jerking around.
 
I just put the transparent tape over the leatherette. I couldn't remove the leatherette because the stickiness was also in the bare body. I guess the purpose of the leatherette is to make it softer to touch than the bare body, right? Or are leatherette in binos for decoration only? Has anyone compared holding a bino with leatherette than bare metal? Does it strain your fingers to hold bare metal in bird watching?

I was on assignment outside the United States for many years now. The country I stayed has huge import tax (about 50% for items above $200). So I had to get the Habicht when I dropped by Hong Kong which was in 2016. So I can't ship the Habicht out in the country now because I didn't have original import tax payment so I have to pay 50% if I would receive it back from Swarovski factory in Austria at present.

I used Habicht originally for structural engineering work where I examined wall joints for faults outside the building. But now I'm interested in bird watching because I watched many videos of the cuckoos' babies pushing all the eggs and baby birds out from nest just 12 hours after being born. It's their instinct and they are not exactly called evil, right? What is so striking is the mother bird can feed the grown up cuckoos which are over twice its size. Why can't the mother realize it? Everyone has a starting point or goal when they go birdwatching. This is my goal, to watch the cuckoos behavior. And when I get tired of it, maybe regular birdwatching like you guys. No one tried to watch cuckoos here?
 
In the picture, you can notice the leatherette stickiness in the black photo shade which can transfer to your fingers or cloth. Almost the entire surface of it is sticky. Can I just use a swiss knife scissors to cut the leatherette and remove it. Is the leatherette glued to the main body or not? Can someone share a photo of a bare body without the leatherette?

View attachment 1551068
Do not remove it yourself, the Swarovski service dept. in Rhode Island is very good. Send it to them
and they will fix it. Go to their website for instructions.
Good luck, very odd to see this happened.
Jerry
 
Somewhat to my surprise my 2015 Habicht have succumbed to the same problem over this weekend. The armour is breaking up and getting sticky. So off to Swarovski they are going. Which slightly hacks me off because my Curios are also en route to Swarovski because the armour has become discoloured and may be getting loose as well (with hindsight, I should have bought the anthracite and not the burnt orange).

So without 2 sets of binos for some time (current forecast is 8 weeks) and a distinct nervousness about the future of my NL Pure 12x42. I had thought the Habicht would be immune to some of the other armour problems reported but clearly not.

I am sure Swarovski will repair them well but how long will that last? Having thought that the reported problems were fairly isolated, I am now not so sure.

Confidence severely dented.
 
PW42. Is your Habicht in the dark often? Mine was more often in the dark because I seldom used it. Darkness may have something to do with the deterioration (see the theories below by a chemist which we can support or debunk in the case of the Habicht leatherette).

Btw.. I was assigned to Africa for a few years in the company. I didn't have import tax for the Habicht so can't ship it anywhere for repair because I'd be charged $500 if it shipped back to me. I'd return to the US in a few years. Does Swarovski Habicht have international warrantee in the US? Or do I have to pay for any repair, and how much usually? Hope someone can call them and ask.

For days I'm thinking of the theories how the leatherette can degrade. I was thinking of radiation exposure, humidity, etc. Then I read the following that it could be related to the dark.


Someone asked there:

"I'm developing real concerns about the black "rubberised" finishes on my 17R3.

I've been having a bit of a clean out at home, and almost all of the devices that I have with similar coatings, have all deteriorated into a weeping sticky mess - really unpleasant to handle. Just today I've seen this on a cordless screwdriver, a USB memory stick, an HP TabletPC battery pack (definitely not a budget item!) and a USB TV receiver.

There is a similar deterioration for some clear plastics - for example some USB cables from a few years ago had a clear coating to show the braided shielding; most of mine have been thrown out because they are so unpleasant to handle. A pair of Philips headphones had a plastic headband, that started sweating and becoming sticky, before disintegrating into pieces of plastic."

He went on to share the views from a chemist:

"
The problem is inherent in the structure of some materials. As a friend of mine (who is an industrial chemist) put it:

These rubbers are a combination of a SBS block copolymer with a low tg and a hard plastic (usually styrene) with a high tg (look it up). The various components of the mix are not completely compatible and will migrate (usually the oil plasticiser) to the surface and become sticky. Place it in full sunlight and the tack will disappear, the surface will "dry off" (oxidise) but will never go back to it's former glory. The oxidised surface marks and scratches easily. You can surface wash the parts using white spirits but the tacky soon returns. Horrible cheap injection moulded rubber. Mitigation = none - change the formula, toxicity = nil. "Real rubber" (SBR, Natural) uses different oils which are quite toxic but very compatible and rarely migrate. These compounds can't be injection moulded and are therefore (more) expensive. e.g car tyres. The reason it's normally black parts that suffer is because the formulation contains heaps of filler and re-work and without black pigment would be an unpleasant dirty greyish greeny brown. So the clever chemists add a splash of black pigment and it comes out jet black. Bootiful.

He then goes on to say: it does seem to develop in the dark ; maybe when it's exposed to the sun the surface oxidises faster and it feels less tacky. This stuff doesn't have to plasticise by migration. If the formula is balanced and good quality materials are used it remains ok. It's so easily tested for problems it's inexcusable for it to go sticky. "

In other brands of binos. Have you experienced any that are kept in the dark too but never deteriorated like the Habicht? If yes, is Swarovski using the more superior material now? Or do you have to send it to them for replacement every 5 years?
 

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