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ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

Ivory-billed Woodpecker (formerly updates) (3 Viewers)

I've read some pretty paranoid stuff from the skeptics, and I didn't advance any kind of conspiracy theory. But people (especially "experts") with entrenched views don't like to be proven wrong or have their intellectual territory encroached upon, and people who report ivory-bills have been pretty consistently trashed for decades.

olivacea said:
Before any discussion careens further off in this direction, please allow me time to locate my tin-foil hat, and make sure it is firmly attached.

Thanks.
Olivacea
 
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This is more than a little ironic, coming from a man who, just a few days ago, was citing worldtwitch and insinuating that people who are making reports have venal motives.

Tim Allwood said:
you guys just love the mystery

if it were 'found' you'd have nothing to do

the thrill really is the search isn't it?

Tim
 
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MMinNY said:
This is more than a little ironic, coming from a man who, just a few days ago, was citing worldtwitch and insinuating that people who are making reports have venal motives.

yep, there's a bit of that too

I obviously can't write a separate post for everyone's motives though

Tim
 
I actually think the motives and actions of all the players in the Agey/Heinzman affair are well worth examining. To suggest that the entire story was a hoax requires one to take a very conspiratorial view. There's a much simpler explanation.

As for the irony, I meant the unintended variety.

Tim Allwood said:
yep, there's a bit of that too

I obviously can't write a separate post for everyone's motives though

Tim
 
choupique1 said:
considering all the people that claim to have seen IBWOs... the people I believe most...

1. A certain Navy Lt. Cdr.
2 A certain Navy 1st Class Petty Officer.
3. David Luneau.
4. Fielding Lewis
5. Mike Collins
6. Another La. Duck Hunter.... (his dad is a former LSU QB)

FWIW.... Steve Sheridan.. although I have not talked to him.. I believe him



Now granted... I have talked with 67 people that claimed to have seen an IBWO



........


Olie...... and MMinNY......there is a common denominator here.... IT is right before your eyes.


ALL of these people have seen or heard the bird in areas that were previously considered...not prime IBWO habitat..... not by the exact location mind you.....Now.. take what we knew about whitetailed deer in the 1940s,,,, the experts of the time thought they needed...... large expanses of woodlands..... to thrive... quite the contraty today.... there are 30 that live in a SMALL patch of woods behind my house......... could the experts of the 1940s and before... have mis-read what the IBWO really needed simply because of where they found it?

take Canadian geese.....on the eastern seaboard.... the used to live in marshes....... now... the stick to grain fields... animals adapt....... do we?
 
There is no question but that Tanner focused on areas of large, relatively unaltered forest and dismissed many areas out of hand. Let me quote him: "Good guides were exceptional, and the best service that most of them could perform was understanding from my descriptions the type of forest I wanted to investigate and then leading me to the best territory."

It is true that reports of ivory-bills decreased dramatically in each part of its range as the virgin forests there were cut. Tanner's assumption, clearly, was that the birds did long survive the cutting.

If I may use the pine snake example again - Pine snakes were often reported in the virgin longleaf forests of western Louisiana. As these forests were ruthlessly mowed down, reports of pine snakes dropped sharply and herpetologists feared they were going extinct. The assumption, seemingly supported by the trend, was that they needed these forests to survive. Today the La. pine snake is the most difficult to find large snake in North America. Even in parts of Kisatchie N.F. that have fairly mature, frequently burned, second-growth longleaf they have never recovered and are extremely rare. I have never seen one dead or alive despite many thousands of hours in those forests. But in fact, there is one area that produces them regularly. It does not have mature longleaf, in fact there is very little longleaf there. If you looked at the area you would not give it a second look. It is "crappy" second-growth paper company land.

How was this population of pine snakes discovered? By making a connection to local people. The local people didn't read the books saying where pine snakes were supposed to be and where they weren't. Neither did the pine snakes. Similarly, local people can help us find ivory-bills. But we have to be willing to listen.
 
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choupique1 said:
ALL of these people have seen or heard the bird in areas that were previously considered...not prime IBWO habitat..... not by the exact location mind you.....Now.. take what we knew about whitetailed deer in the 1940s,,,, the experts of the time thought they needed...... large expanses of woodlands..... to thrive... quite the contraty today.... there are 30 that live in a SMALL patch of woods behind my house......... could the experts of the 1940s and before... have mis-read what the IBWO really needed simply because of where they found it?

I also heard of something similar happening with Wild Turkeys. According to what I was told, till the early 1970's the conventional wisdom among wildlife managers was that the Wild Turkey's preferred habitat, the habitat where they thrived best, were large expanses of forest, the older the forest the better. Eventually it was found that certain native prairie habitats found in Iowa and Kansas actually support much higher densities of Wild Turkeys than any forested habitat. Apparently the preference of Wild Turkeys for forested habitats in other parts of its range was due to the elimination of the more open habitats by farming and other human activities.

Dalcio
 
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Has anyone heard about the recent Ocala National Forest sightings? If so has anybody seen the footage or the stills taken of it?

Cheers,

Russ
 
Can you source this or give any information at all? It's news to me.



Russ Jones said:
Has anyone heard about the recent Ocala National Forest sightings? If so has anybody seen the footage or the stills taken of it?

Cheers,

Russ
 
Russ Jones said:
Has anyone heard about the recent Ocala National Forest sightings? If so has anybody seen the footage or the stills taken of it?

Cheers,

Russ


I don't believe it is in the Ocala NF....... but you are close.... so.. Russ. what have you heard?
 
dacol said:
I also heard of something similar happening with Wild Turkeys. According to what I was told, till the early 1970's the conventional wisdom among wildlife managers was that the Wild Turkeys preferred habitat, the habitat where they thrived best, were large expanses of forest, the older the forest the better. Eventually it was found that certain native prairie habitats found in Iowa and Kansas actually support much higher densities of Wild Turkeys than any forested habitat. Apparently the preference of Wild Turkeys for forested habitats in other parts of its range was due to the elimination of the more open habitats by farming and other human activities.

Dalcio

In Southern California, where Wild Turkeys are introduced, I've seen them in open live oak woodland with sagebrush (Artemisia tridentata) in the understory. The species account in the San Diego County Bird Atlas suggests that this is typical. The habitat is quite arid most of the year. Rain and occasional snow occur mainly from December through March, with a slight chance of thunderstorms late summer. I don't know where they get water -- maybe from livestock troughs. The turkeys seem to be doing quite well in such places.
 
steveholz said:

Steve--
Thanks for the links--interesting that the first sighting is a bird coming up from the base of the tree, similar to the sightings of others more recently.

Todd
 
MMinNY said:
Can you source this or give any information at all? It's news to me.

Somebody from one of the Audubon Societies down that way contacted me for permission to use one of my drawings.... they told me about it. Anybody else have any details on it?

Russ
 
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