Larus michahellis OR argentatus OR cachinnans (FRANCE-Lyon) (1 Viewer)

[William69002]

Hello everyone,

I am facing a problem that many birders must know: the identification of non-adult gulls.

I made this observation on 19/12/22 in France on the Rhône river in Lyon (inland far from the coast)!

It is clearly a 3rd year gull (in my opinion), and since we are in Lyon it should be a Larus michahellis as the other species are rare (or accidental).

However two/three details bother me: The colour of the legs, the proportion of black on the beak and the almost absent red on the beak.

And the stripes are for me important for a Larus michahellis.

To me these characteristics are more consistent with a argentatus (or maybe another but big doubt given the location).

The photo is from December, so I think it's also late in its moult.

If someone is more specialized in Larids, to explain me this identification.

I look forward to hearing from you.

 

[SteveClifton]

I think your bird is a Yellow-legged Gull, rather than one of the other two species you mentioned.

They tend to mature more quickly than Herring Gulls so rather than a 3rd winter bird, I think yours is likely to be a more advanced second calendar year (2nd winter), soon to become a 3cy.

Yellow colour in the legs, red spot on the bill etc are signs of approaching adulthood, so your bird has a way to go yet. All features look very typical for an immature Yellow-legged Gull in my opinion. A very similar bird here in the following link, photographed in January so just a little older than yours. Gull Research Organisation

 

[rollingthunder]

YLG for me too. The bill is brutish and proportions for head/bill are right as is the slightly 'Blue' tone to the mantle.

I still find them a minefield but you have to accept you can't ID everything in a 50 Shades of Grey scenario.

Good birding -

Laurie -