Real life print colours? (1 Viewer)

[GJW]

Printing fom 40D delivered to Lightroom 1.4 and then to Photoshop 6. Brand new Canon Pro9000 printer. I have used ICC and all the default programs but none of the colours are anything like the screen [which I know needs calibrating] and are dull and insipid. Same when printing from Lightroom. Red Knot in breeding plumage very dull orange. Where am I going wrong please?! :C

 

[geedub]

Hi GJW

It could depend on the type of material you're printing onto - bog-standard 80gsm paper will soak up the ink like a sponge and give a dull end product. For initial proofs I use WH Smith's 120gsm premium coated paper as a starting point then progress to either semi-matt or hi-gloss papers for final prints depending on what finish will look best for the subject in the photo.

 

[Mono]

The world of colour, monitors and printing is a mighty kettle of fish.

Your printer can print colours that you cannot see on your monitor and your monitor can show colours that cannot be printed by your printer!

You do need to calibrate your monitor, you need to make sure that the colour management of your work flow is correct, you don't want to be converting the image back and fourth between colourspaces. In Photoshop you can preview the image in CMYK (Print) colours, go to View Proof Colors, and set Proof Set Up to CMYK.

It is a minefield and more art than science.

Best of luck

 

[Saphire]

I have brilliant results if I only print using canons own printer software Canon easy photo print I have never had any luck using third party software.
With every make of printer I have ever owned I haven't had any good results from using lightroom, CS or elements but using there own software I have brilliant results.

 

[K-Lex]

Printing is a total minefield and it's really annoying and time consuming to get the prints to match the screen. Try these few things to see if they have any difference:

1. Calibrate the monitor
2. Check your printer settings in LR - check the 'best quality' options are all ticked - you'll need to check this every time you print. Turn off any 'high speed' or 'draft' modes.
3. Turn OFF colour management in the printer - there's probably an option in the LR printer settings that says 'no ICM adjustment' or something like that
4. Use the correct ICC profiles for the paper
5. Select 'perceptual' just below where you select the ICC profile in LR
6. Try different papers - I use Hahnemuhle Photo Rag 308 and it's not even in the same league as the cheaper stuff. Although, at £50 for a box of 50, it's not cheap

You'll likely spend hours and hours trying to get it right and then one moment it'll just click and you'll be thrilled with the results - don't give up though - keep persevering and it'll come good eventually.

 

[GJW]

Thanks for the advice everyone - was definitely better using Easy print, Christine, and of course a lot easier! I can see a lot of experimentation coming up, possibly my use of cheaper, but heavyweight [240g plus] papers does not help?
Anyone like to suggest what they think is the best colour calibrating system for the monitor - at a reasonable price!

Graham

 

[K-Lex]

I use an old Spyder 2 PRO. Spyder 3's can be picked up now quite cheaply.

What I've found with expensive paper, is that once you've used it, you'll never ever touch the cheap stuff again. It's just worlds apart

 

[GJW]

Did as you suggested K-Lex and got quite a good likeness - perceptual seems better than relative.
Can't find the 'view proof colours' and set to CYMK not very good at this high tech stuff!] although I do see the preview before printing which seems to be far brighter than the original!
Spyder3 seems to be averaging 100 quid everywhere.

Graham

 

[mjmw]

Its worth spedning the money on the calibration tool - you'll save it in paper and ink!

In Photoshop the proof options are under the view menu. The default should be view as CMYK which will give a reasonable preview of how it will print. The keyboard shortcut is CTRL+Y to toggle between proof and normal views.

Also, make sure you review the print in good light (like a bright window) - a monitor transmits light to show an image but a print reflects available light (hence the print preview looking brighter on the monitor).

 

[pe'rigin]

Graham,

As Keith and Mark suggested already, but let photoshop determine colour when printing.

You will probably find that you need two different images setting, one image that you send to the printer, the other kept as a master. On all the pro Canon printers, the colours need boosting a fraction from what you are seeing on screen. On this machine the results should be near perfect.

 

[GJW]

Still hit and miss! Did get some really good ones using the combined advice - thanks everyone - and printing through Lightroom. I can see the colours need boosting a little from the final print but my preview in Lightroom is so boosted [correct profiles inputted] that I can't believe it's the same picture on my, now calibrated, screen or on the final print.
Also does anyone know whether magenta runs out quickly on the Pro9000 - mines nearly gone after 30 prints while all the others are okay.

Thanks to all those who know what they're doing! :t:

Graham

 

[pe'rigin]

Graham.

I think that you have a difficult decision, you have bought a pro printer, and this model is perfectly capable of bashing out prints that are 95% acceptable to one and all. It’s not cheap to run and does require adjustment.

But it is also very capable of giving outstanding results with a bit of care and detail. You need to persevere with it and adopt a technique that suits you and that gets you into the 5%.

 

[mjmw]

Graham, I am not sure if this will be any more help. I use Epson printers and don't print from Lightroom, but this is what I would do in Lightroom print module (its very similar to printing in CS3):

1. Print Job section (righthand panel): uncheck Print Sharpening (I would apply this in develop myself)

2. Print Job section (righthand panel): Color Management->Profile - select the correct profile for the printer and paper I am using

3. Print Job section (righthand panel): Color Management->Rendering Intent - select Perceptual

4. Click "Print Settings" button (bottom of righthand panel): Select correct printer, paper size. Click the Properties button.

5. In advanced options I switch off Color Management (usually refered to as ICM), ensure that quality and paper are correct (high quality, not high speed, correct paper for the profile I selected above) - note that this is printer specific, I am not familiar with the Canon terms.

6. Click OK on the two open dialogs

7. Press the Print... button and hit Properties to check everything before clicking OK!

BTW, what operating system are you using? If it is Windows, then a little application needs to load the monitor calibration at startup. Normally this app is installed when you install the calibration software.

However, if you already had Adobe Gamma or similar installed, this can 'fight' with the new software and lead to colour casts on your images (Magenta for example...).

You can check by looking in Start->All Programs->Startup where you will see Adobe Gamma (if it is present). Easiest fix is to uninstall it using the Add/Remove programs dialog in Control Panel and reboot.

If you are on a Mac, I haven't a clue

 

[GJW]

Thanks Mark - good to be guided through it so clearly. Have printed a few good ones now - allowing for my standard of photography! Haven't been unchecking sharpening leaving it on low usually, or even medium as I thought further sharpening would be a 'good thing'!!. New Windows Vista set up altogether so no Gamma [did check]. Now doing pretty much as you recommend but still can't get my head round why the preview colours are so different to the screen and print. I've switched it off rather than look at it! Monitor is Spyder3 checked.

Graham