JayFeatherPL
Well-known member
How does young eurasian golden oriole sound like? I can't find this song, can someone send it?
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Young eruasian golden oriole (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter JayFeatherPL
- Start date
Sorry, I am not sure what you mean. There a two types of sounds from Golden Oriole; the song and the call.
The song is a fluty whistle, but is not given by young birds.
The call is a jay like - raucous call. (There is probably a begging call from the young but not sure what it is) This is given by all age groups and sexes and I guess this is what you mean?
The Collins Bird app has the call, and there a plenty of examples on www.xeno-canto.org ( Eurasian Golden Oriole (Oriolus oriolus) :: xeno-canto)
JayFeatherPL
Well-known member
I mean sth like this, it's my own recording, but I can't find it on the internet
I think I know what you mean (i.e., not fully crystallised song). Have a look at: Search Tips :: xeno-canto, and check out: Eurasian Golden Oriole (Oriolus oriolus) :: xeno-canto, Eurasian Golden Oriole (Oriolus oriolus) :: xeno-canto and Eurasian Golden Oriole (Oriolus oriolus) :: xeno-canto. I think it's much harder to find in Macaulay Library, but try Eurasian Golden Oriole - Oriolus oriolus - Media Search - Macaulay Library and eBird and maybe even Eurasian Golden Oriole - Oriolus oriolus - Media Search - Macaulay Library and eBird. You will have to manually filter those results, though.
The terminology is varied and still in flux with names such as juvenile song (= Jugendgesang), subsong (= Subsong), autumn(al) song (= Herbstgesang)--from Die Stimmen der Vögel Europas)--or plastic song, used for different or broadly similar phenomena. Plastic song is further divided by some into stages of development: early plastic song, plastic song, late plastic song (Nature's Music). Plastic song should not to be confused with what could be known under different names as whisper song/extended song/warbling song/courtship song: Subsong vs. Whisper Song – Earbirding. Species such as Redwing or Siskin than subsing together could be also searched for using the phrase 'subsong chorus'.
Here's a quick cheat sheet of what seem to be very broadly agreed upon:
Some people said that the type of song adult birds sing in autumn and winter is subsong, but some sources state it's plastic song: Recurrent development of song idiosyncrasy without auditory inputs in the canary, an open-ended vocal learner - Scientific Reports. Then, there are also fully crystallised aberrant songs: Part 7: Magnus Robb and ‘The Blackcaps’ - The Sound Approach. (I think it would be the best to try to visually age the singing bird when possible.)
Some useful links:
I was able to write it up thanks to those who answered in Fieldfare: subsong or plastic song (XC776826) :: topic 54044 :: xeno-canto or answered to my requests for contact via XC's private messages, and--in some cases--a bit of my own research.
EDIT: It's hard (for me) to be sure which type your song would be--have you managed to age the bird more precisely?
The terminology is varied and still in flux with names such as juvenile song (= Jugendgesang), subsong (= Subsong), autumn(al) song (= Herbstgesang)--from Die Stimmen der Vögel Europas)--or plastic song, used for different or broadly similar phenomena. Plastic song is further divided by some into stages of development: early plastic song, plastic song, late plastic song (Nature's Music). Plastic song should not to be confused with what could be known under different names as whisper song/extended song/warbling song/courtship song: Subsong vs. Whisper Song – Earbirding. Species such as Redwing or Siskin than subsing together could be also searched for using the phrase 'subsong chorus'.
Here's a quick cheat sheet of what seem to be very broadly agreed upon:
| Subsong | quiet, continuous, varied sounds and mimicry | juvenile/immature |
| Plastic song | loud, similar to fully developed song | immature |
Some useful links:
Part 5: Hamish taught me all he knows about bird sounds - The Sound Approach
soundapproach.co.uk
6 - Which came first? - The Sound Approach
soundapproach.co.uk
The Development of Birdsong
Songbirds sing intricate songs for mate attraction and territorial defense, which they learn early in life. How do young birds learn how to sing? What controls this complex behavior?
www.nature.com
I was able to write it up thanks to those who answered in Fieldfare: subsong or plastic song (XC776826) :: topic 54044 :: xeno-canto or answered to my requests for contact via XC's private messages, and--in some cases--a bit of my own research.
EDIT: It's hard (for me) to be sure which type your song would be--have you managed to age the bird more precisely?
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I have made this point before and cannot emphasize it strongly enough, viz. that it's always better, and often crucial, to SEE the source of the sound you are recording rather than to guess at what is producing it and to think that you can tell what is producing it from the sound alone.
If your recording above is indeed from a golden oriole which you were watching, you need to give the circumstances including the location, date, and a description of the bird's plumage and how you aged it.
Your recording doesn't sound anything like a golden oriole song, so I assume it's either not a golden oriole or not its song.
If your recording above is indeed from a golden oriole which you were watching, you need to give the circumstances including the location, date, and a description of the bird's plumage and how you aged it.
Your recording doesn't sound anything like a golden oriole song, so I assume it's either not a golden oriole or not its song.
CARERY
Well-known member
The OP call is indeed uttered by Golden Orioles. It always reminds me of Bar-tailed Godwit flight calls. It is more often heard in late summer by family parties but also, though much rarer, in spring. So it seems clear to me that not only 1cy but also adult birds utter it. To me it seems to be some contact call... Compare with:
XC819823 Eurasian Golden Oriole (Oriolus oriolus)
XC819823 Eurasian Golden Oriole (Oriolus oriolus)
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Well, was I lazy; didn't read the whole page. From the same source:
My understanding is that 'independent young' (= 'selbständige Jungvögel') means 'immatures' (either 1cy or 2cy) rather than 'juveniles' (though that should be murky)?
(which is pretty much the same as CARERY's answer above with the exception of the parts in bold)
My understanding is that 'independent young' (= 'selbständige Jungvögel') means 'immatures' (either 1cy or 2cy) rather than 'juveniles' (though that should be murky)?
CARERY
Well-known member
The German 'Jungvögel' is pretty much the same as 'juveniles' in English. How it is used depends on the contex I guess. In smaller birds I would use it for 1cy birds before the first moult. After that they are immatures - if distinguishable from adults at all... But I'm afraid there is no sharp definition, or is there?
Yes:
That's juvenile.
Immature is any plumage that's not adult.
This is really fundamental stuff.
lou salomon
the birdonist
agree, it's the call of a Golden Oriole (not that it's needed anymore since Roland knows his stuff) but you can't tell if a young one or an adult bird from this call.
The way I took it, he meant the German term 'Jungvogel' and the sharpness of its definition, not the distinction between 'juvenile' and 'immature'.
