Dipped in ink (1 Viewer)

Thoughts on this gull please ladies and gents. Photographed yesterday at RSPB Saltholme

I know virtually nothing about European gulls, but wouldn't it help if you told us which gull you were talking about?

First-winter common gull, if you are referring to gulls with black tips to bills.

cometrider said:

First-winter common gull, if you are referring to gulls with black tips to bills.

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but they look as big as the black back in pictures 3 and 4 which Common gulls certainly arent.

no, it's the 1st year gull in the middle with "dipped in ink"-bill.
such 1cy usually get attention because hybrids HG x GG usually have such bills. however, in this bird (from what i can see) i don't think there has been "interference" by hyperboreus, looks like a normal HG with a slightly aberrant bill. greater coverts look plainish.

lou salomon said:

no, it's the 1st year gull in the middle with "dipped in ink"-bill.
such 1cy usually get attention because hybrids HG x GG usually have such bills. however, in this bird (from what i can see) i don't think there has been "interference" by hyperboreus, looks like a normal HG with a slightly aberrant bill. greater coverts look plainish.

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HG x GG was my first thought for the bird in the middle but there apears to be very similar bird in pics 3 and 4 aswell as that bird.

lou salomon said:

such 1cy usually get attention because hybrids HG x GG usually have such bills. however, in this bird (from what i can see) i don't think there has been "interference" by hyperboreus, looks like a normal HG with a slightly aberrant bill. greater coverts look plainish.

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I agree, no Glauc influence looking at the black primaries. I've seen immature agentatus with similar bill patterns but not usually this early in the winter period.

I'm more interested in the dainty looking, dark backed gull with apparent pink legs in the lower right hand corner of the 3rd & 4th pics. Any more of pics showing this gull?

I'll have a look for you Dave but the photo's were concentrated on the bird in the middle which caught the eye. The bill is clearly marked and not smudged as you would find in a dark tipped 2nd year herring gull. This clean cut tip with pale base would be unusual for a second year bird but caught us by surprise as it's a first year and you would expect a wholly dark bill. The coverts were finely marked and appeared lighter than the heavier and darker coverts of the accompanying standard 1st winter Herring Gulls. The posture in the first picture is also noticeable and helped it stand out in the crowd. Having no experience of hybrids I've no idea what a hyperboreus x argenteus/argentatus would look like. Could I ask you to expand on what you mean by the greater coverts looking plainish please Lou. From the distance the bird was viewed from the plain look to the coverts would seem to indicate fine markings rather than the blotchy coarse markings of a 1st year Herring Gull. Hope you don't think I'm trying to make it in to something it isn't, just found it an interesting bird and not as clean cut as you've both found it. What would you expect to see on a hybrid?

redeyedvideo said:

I agree, no Glauc influence looking at the black primaries. I've seen immature agentatus with similar bill patterns but not usually this early in the winter period.

I'm more interested in the dainty looking, dark backed gull with apparent pink legs in the lower right hand corner of the 3rd & 4th pics. Any more of pics showing this gull?

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Possible Caspian perhaps?

Does't American H Gull have a Glauc like bill?

Jan