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Should I have humiliated the twitcher? Have you? (1 Viewer)

G

George London

Well-known member
Yesterday I went and took some photos (record shots, nothing better:-C) of a rare Pallas warbler in Berkshire/Hampshire UK.

Literally just after I had at last managed to get a 'conclusive' picture, a man paced up to me and another guy and said 'have you seen it, has it just come past?'. We both responded by saying yes, but that it was moving very quickly and we only saw it for a brief moment.

His reply - no, that was a goldcrest.

He was so dismissive and sure of himself, yet was totally and utterly wrong, and had absolutely no basis whatsoever for his patronising remark. Additionally, I had the power to completely humiliate him.

I very rarely go on 'twitches' as such, and when I have the crowd has fallen into two distinct groups. Usually the vast majority are very friendly (and helpful if, like me, you need it). Yesterday I had people putting their bins down to get me on the bird which I was hugely appreciative of... How far had they travelled to get it in their bins, only to put them down to help me??:t:

However, there always seems to be those small cliquey groups who are out to exclude and belittle. Is there any hope for them? Have they forgotten that they were once starting out?

I was sorely tempted to give him two barrels in the face (metaphorically speaking:-O) but knowing how all these guys eye you up and down I thought it may not do my long term 'twitching' career any good! Possibly more relevant, when you are not that experienced if someone who 'appears' experienced disagrees with you the confidence is immediately knocked straight out of you if delivered so unhelpfully and it's just a bit unpleasant isn't it!

I'm interested in any other examples of this kind of behaviour and specifically instances where you have had the opportunity and not been able to resist the urge to put these berks back in their box!

Cheers, George
 
It can also work the other way round. Over the years I've gone out of my way many times to help birders see the object of their desire. It's no problem as sharing good birds with others is one of the delights of our hobby. However, a number times I've expended a good deal of time and patience trying to show someone a bird only to have my efforts derided and ignored,
 
Hi John. That must be intensely frustrating and make you wonder why you bother. That is just plain rude, not only are they not showing you any gratitude for their efforts, but they then go on to deride you.

Maybe, John, between the two of us, we have just established that for one reason or another, whenever on a twitch expect to find some utter berks!!
 
I had a workmate who had a collection of old natural history books and who was convinced that the local jackdaws were ravens, nothing would convince him otherwise so in the end I just left him to his beliefs.
 
LOL I had to do the same with a guy who insisted that a female House Sparrow was a female Robin!
 
Returning specifically to George's example - in that case, I would say, no, there's no point in doing anything. Anyone that thick - 'not only do I know what I saw, I can also tell you what you saw' - will not be diverted by from his sense of self-assurance by the presentation of something so mundane as a mere fact (in the form of George's photograph). I would hazard a guess that, if you had showed him, it would have made no real difference - he would have quickly improvised some sort of excuse, and sailed serenely onward.

I meet such people, only occasionally (thanks be to Zarquon!), and I just assume that such behaviour masks someone who is actually very ignorant - if he knew more about birding, he'd be less likely to say such daft things.

Peter C.
 
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Peter C. said:
Anyone that thick - 'not only do I know what I saw, I can also tell you what you saw' - will not be diverted by from his sense of self-assurance by the presentation of something so mundane as a mere fact. I would hazard a guess that, if you had showed him, it would have made no real difference - he would have quickly improvised some sort of excuse, and sailed serenely onward. Peter C.
Click to expand...

Without wishing to go too far off-topic, Peter, your succinct post reminds me all too well of so many recent pronouncements by so many politicians on both sides of the Atlantic, whose disdain for mere facts or abundant evidence clearly has served as a template for George's interloper...:-C
MJB
 
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Arrgh, yes! I don't know about your current Prime Minister, but ours is a very good (that is, bad) example of the type.
Problem: Don't like what your scientists are telling you?
Solution: Cut funding for science...

(Off topic, yes).
 
Hi George,

I'm one of the twitchers that will always take time to show birds to others and take time to speak to the general public when they ask what we are doing.

I think you should have given him both barrels. But then he and his sort probably have already had both barrels from me on the other thread as I'm sure you've realised that you were not my target. :t:

Cheers, Andy.
 
I don't go to many twitches,went to a few last year and plan on doing more this year.
99.9% of those people are kind,friendly,helpful etc but every now and then,there are a few who are just too good,or think they are to bother with us mere birders.But on the whole,everyone is pretty much cool.
You do get one or two idiots who try to get too close to the subject,but I think these are more photographers than hardcore twitchers/birders.
It can feel quite clicky at times but I think that's simply because many of the twitchers see each other so often that it just feels that way,when its nothing more than they have become good aquatances of each other due to their hobby
 
The sniper said:
It can feel quite clicky at times but I think that's simply because many of the twitchers see each other so often that it just feels that way,when its nothing more than they have become good aquatances of each other due to their hobby
Click to expand...

That's a fair point Sniper, I think you're right there... I will try to be a little braver/less wet next time as, like you say, whenever I do speak to people, most are very friendly indeed.

Cheers George
 
When I first started going to the odd twitch it did feel a bit odd but after a while,you realise they just all know each other and if you approach them which can obviously be quite daunting if you are not in the know,they are 99% fine.Of course you will get the odd one or two who don't want to help,think they are better but its very rare to be honest and I know normal birders who are the same.
 
In the interests of balance twitchers aren't the only people who will ask a birder a question and then ignore his answer or tell him he's wrong:
Whilst watching a juvenile bald eagle in Canada a while back someone in the hide asked me what the smaller black bird next to it was.
"I think it's a raven" I replied to which she said "No, we're near water so it must be a heron of some sort".
I was left bewildered as to a) what she thought a heron looked like and b) why she asked the question.
 
Definitely both barrels. We've all met the person who knows better than you what you saw when they weren't there, and short of braining them with a tripod, an unarguable photographic correction is an excellent option.

John
 
Not sure how you are defining Twitchers George. There isn't a race. It sounds like there were a group of people (including you), with binoculars, cameras and telescopes, some no doubt wearing wellies looking at a bird. It always amuses me when this view is adopted.

If I see you next to a Twitcher what are the salient id features?;)
 
Lawts said:
Not sure how you are defining Twitchers George. There isn't a race. It sounds like there were a group of people (including you), with binoculars, cameras and telescopes, some no doubt wearing wellies looking at a bird. It always amuses me when this view is adopted.

If I see you next to a Twitcher what are the salient id features?;)
Click to expand...

My salient ID features of a "Twitcher" as follows:

- Only ever found in the open in front of another rare creature.
- Guaranteed to show well, but may (or may not) depart as fast as they arrived.
- Call very distinctive, and the key ID feature for this animal. For positive ID you will hear the names of other rarities in the area and further afield, seen and to be seen - quite regularly they use a telephone to deliver their call;).
- This species is comfortable squeezing in amongst its own kind, grappling with the difficulty of getting some space without taking up anyone else's. They also move well in and around trees, bodies of water and undergrowth generally.
- Almost all examples are confiding, and their calls often direct others to other rarities.
- There is always a very small contingent that is unpredictable, condescending, patronising and arrogant.

Oh no, I have just realised that, having been twitching only a handful of times (which is why i would think it a little disingenuous to refer to myself as a "Twitcher"), I'm not sure I'm experienced enough to positively ID a Twitcher, sorry!!:-O

PS If 'Obsessive People' are a race, then I believe Twitchers make up part of it! (I should say I believe i fall into that category, but not as a twitcher (yet), so it's not a dig).
PPS Thank you John! I think the tripod would have snapped in two:eek!:
 
George London said:
Hi John. That must be intensely frustrating and make you wonder why you bother. That is just plain rude, not only are they not showing you any gratitude for their efforts, but they then go on to deride you.
Click to expand...

A tad annoying at times, but if that's the worst life throws at you then you've little to complain about. Still, someone telling a good number of your birding pals (and LGRE!) that a Pacific Golden Plover had gone despite what that "idiot" (me) claimed wasn't good. Happily, the bird in question picked the right moment top fly over. Most comic was my attempt to tactfully persuade some birders that a "Goshawk" was in fact a Sparrowhawk. They wouldn't listen and got a bit aggressive about it - I walked away, but my good lady, normally the quietest of people, gave 'em both barrels! I was stranded between astonishment and hilarity! The bottom line, though, is that I've gained far more pleasure from being helpful than not,
 
George London said:
My salient ID features of a "Twitcher" as follows:
Click to expand...

Have you come across Bill Oddie's 'Little Black Bird Book' ??

Some great descriptions of the birdwatching types contained therein. Absolutely required reading. Different angle from your description, which is interesting to note as the outsider looking in perceives from a different perspective ... ;)


It should be noted that the arrogant 'minority' occurs within all hobbies, pastimes and walks of life of course. Some more than others though ... ;)
 
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I remember talking to a well known local twitcher from our parts about the bill oldie little black book,he told me that oldie was a buffoon who didn't know what he was talking about.Couldnt quite understand it as I always liked bill
 
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