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ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

D300s (1 Viewer)

With Mifsuds selling the D300 at £1000 and the indicated price of the D300s being nearly £1500 I'm not sure that the differences are worth the £500 IMHO. I would either get a D300 and stick the £500 towards a lens or save it or wait for the D400.
£500 for a second memory card slot (SD) and video seems very expensive.
 
don't think I will be running to the camera shop to move up from my D300,, just not that big of a jump and have never tried video so no desire for that,,

the D300 was and is a great camera,, If they had not added the video feature the amount improvements is fairly small for the cost over a E++ pre owned,,

Derry
 
I have no connection to Mifsuds apart from the odd purchase which went very well but they are advertising the last chance to buy a D300 at £1077, if you do fancy one get em before they go up
 
Guys, Nikon are also improving the image quality throughout the range and have been tweaking many cameras. I just tested the D5000, an entry level camera, and the image quality was better than the original D300. So I think that the D300s may offer better noise performance, more on a par with the D3 and D700. Who knows until we see one and I should get one later this week to test out, reviews and thoughts on my BLOG for anyone interested.
 
andyrouse said:
Guys, Nikon are also improving the image quality throughout the range and have been tweaking many cameras. I just tested the D5000, an entry level camera, and the image quality was better than the original D300. So I think that the D300s may offer better noise performance, more on a par with the D3 and D700. Who knows until we see one and I should get one later this week to test out, reviews and thoughts on my BLOG for anyone interested.
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please feel free to add any product review to our reviews section - http://www.birdforum.net/reviews/ I'm sure our members would find them useful.
 
Not wishing to question a professional like Andy Rouse and I know I'm not worthy but.......
The only info that Nikon offer would indicate that the CMOS sensor in the D5000 is slightly different to the D300 and the D300s. The D5000 has 200K less usable pixels than its bigger brothers, so should I assume that the CMOS sensor is a new and improved one? If this was the case would not Nikon have used the newer one in the D300s as well?
I look forward to the reviews but at the moment I can't help but think that the D300s is on paper a buffed up D300.
Hope I'm wrong as it would be wrong for Nikon to increase the price by almost 50% for what is a very similar body.
 
Last edited:
Duke Leto said:
Not wishing to question a professional like Andy Rouse and I know I'm not worthy but.......
The only info that Nikon offer would indicate that the CMOS sensor in the D5000 is slightly different to the D300 and the D300s. The D5000 has 200K less usable pixels than its bigger brothers, so should I assume that the CMOS sensor is a new an improved one? If this was the case would not Nikon have used the newer one in the D300s as well?
I look forward to the reviews but at the moment I can't help but think that the D300s is on paper a buffed up D300.
Hope I'm wrong as it would be wrong for Nikon to increase the price by almost 50% for what is a very similar body.
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I presume Andy is saying something Thom Hogan has referred to. He reports that Jpeg is slightly better in the d90.

Nikon are good at that. The d40x was supposedly marginally better than the d80 ditto d60 over 40x.

the same happened with the 6mp sensor that the d100 had.
 
Not sure what the "not worthy is about"

I think that Nikon do a lot that they don't advertise, I know for a fact that a lot of cameras are tweaked under the covers from model to model. I can also only report what I see and for my money the D5000 image quality was stunning. At this time we have no idea what new image processing or sensor enhancements they have put into the camera, it is all conjecture until we see some results. But knowing Nikon as I do now I would say that the D300s will have image quality improvements. Of course the main reason for it is the HD support, which I for one welcome as I need it. Canon are also concentrating on this area as they know it is a much desired and requested feature. So for my money I give them credit if they have got the HD right in the D300s as they will be the first. Just so you know a few people had the 5D MK2 on my recent Svalbard charter and they were all shooting video and loving it, clearly a popular feature for some but not all.
 
Testing inconclusive as I have such an early model, it did well at Little Owls on friday, images on my BLOG if you want to see. Will try with something a bit closer when it stops raining - I live in South Wales now......
 
Andy Rouse said:
Guys, Nikon are also improving the image quality throughout the range and have been tweaking many cameras. I just tested the D5000, an entry level camera, and the image quality was better than the original D300. So I think that the D300s may offer better noise performance, more on a par with the D3 and D700. Who knows until we see one and I should get one later this week to test out, reviews and thoughts on my BLOG for anyone interested.
Click to expand...

That's really interesting - are you talking noise performance at high ISO? If so then that bodes well as I've always thought the D300 performed really well at high ISO for a DX body, not too well compared to the FX bodies but certainly very good for the type (astonishingly well in comparison to the old 3200 film I used to mess about with!). If Nikon are continuing to improve on that then it really is excellent news. You're right, there does seem to be a lot that goes on in the background that Nikon don't talk much about when new cameras are released, which is a shame as they could make more of some of these improvements.

I won't be upgrading either Derry, some small features like the virtual horizon are great to see in the D300s and the video shooting could be handy (I've turned around my feelings on video in DSLRs, used to abhor the thought but seeing the results from my brother's 5DII has been an eye-opener!). I always thought that unless it was released as a D400 then the changes would be small but if they've improved the image quality and added some toys then it's a pretty reasonable upgrade. Not one that would encourage many existing owners to upgrade but good for new buyers and as much of a change as you can expect given the economic climate. Shame about the price hike though!
 
Andy Rouse said:
Not sure what the "not worthy is about"

I think that Nikon do a lot that they don't advertise, I know for a fact that a lot of cameras are tweaked under the covers from model to model. I can also only report what I see and for my money the D5000 image quality was stunning. At this time we have no idea what new image processing or sensor enhancements they have put into the camera, it is all conjecture until we see some results. But knowing Nikon as I do now I would say that the D300s will have image quality improvements. Of course the main reason for it is the HD support, which I for one welcome as I need it. Canon are also concentrating on this area as they know it is a much desired and requested feature. So for my money I give them credit if they have got the HD right in the D300s as they will be the first. Just so you know a few people had the 5D MK2 on my recent Svalbard charter and they were all shooting video and loving it, clearly a popular feature for some but not all.
Click to expand...

But if the natural evolution of future DSLR's is better and better movie modes that must surely mean less money for the R&D of better sensors, AF systems and so on. Not to mention the lenses which Nikon still need to pull their finger out over, every year people wonder if the 300mm f4 will be blessed with VR.

I'm very wary of the fact that all future DSLR's simply must have a movie capability becuase it's the new trend for them to have that looks good on a spec list and means they can charge a little bit more for them.

Give me a noiseless sensor over a HD movie mode any day.
That's the way a trumped up little fart like me see's it anyway. (No pun intended :-O )
Adam
 
Agreed the D300 led it's class and to some respects still does. The D300s is not intended for D300 users to upgrade, very few will. Instead it is intended for the D80, D90 and lesser market as the next step up and providing HD is a good extra for these photographers. Trust me I am involved with Nikon on this and this is the thinking, which for my opinion is the right one. I think my point is that cameras have come a long way and now give everything that you could ever want, it is the photographer now that has to step up to the creative challenge. When I miss a shot, which I do as much as anyone, I do so because I am a **** and it is my fault. It is not the camera's fault or its lack of technology, it is the photographer's fault.

The continued holy grail of "better sensors" I see all the time and I wonder when it will stop. Right now the D3 / D700 and D3x are what I need, I could use the D300s in my professional life too without ever worrying. The sensors do everything that I ask of them in low and good light, the image quality is astounding (which is why I changed from Canon in the first place) and I really have no complaints. Trust me if I had a complaint Nikon would hear about it immediately and I would not back down. So for my money the quest for bigger sensors is just a pointless one, sure we need a D300 DSLR with a sensor around 20MP but that would be it for me, as for 99.9999999% of photographers having a sensor like this has no practical value.

Anyway I get my production version this morning to test for a few days so we will see, if it ever stops raining I might get out and test as well. The joys of Wales.
 
You're right there, as a bunch we're never happy, but not always for practical reasons. No matter how good the sensor and how jaw-droppingly amazing a camera is on release, within a short while you can guarantee someone will say "if only it was a little bit better".

The ever increasing pixel count is getting a little concerning now, I worry that it will be increased to compete spec. wise, but will lead to a reduction in image quality. 12MP is plenty high enough for a DX sensor and going higher would seem a move too far, there really is no need for a higher pixel count unless you are shooting high quality landscapes... in which case a full-frame camera is a much better choice anyway. As Andy says, if a 20mp D300 with the same noise performance was possible then a pro might find it very useful but the average D300 user? I certainly wouldn't be that keen as the storage requirements for the files would be prohibitive and you would need very fast and expensive cards to shoot at six or seven frames per second. There would be an advantage in record shots of distant birds if the lens was good enough - you could crop right in and see what the bird was, but for real photography by an amateur - no, not needed.

My brother shoots wildlife with a 5D II and a 400mm f/5.6 and the 21mp has helped compensate for the full-frame sensor (and the quality is amazing - noise performance is pretty astonishing even at VERY high ISO), but he's found that he burns through cards and hard drive storage at a phenomenal rate compared to his previous 40D. I think he'd have been as happy if the mkII was 12mp, he just wanted clean images and a full-frame sensor for wide-angle work.

Hope the weather clears up for you Andy, have fun with that D300s!
 
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