Bird Rescue. Does it Help? (1 Viewer)

Hi everyone. :hi:

Sorry but I'm thinking this may be a long post. Hope it makes sense by the end. ((Kinda creepy to be the only one here too as it is very early in the AM for most of you.))

So here it goes.... :scribe:

There are several groups here, as well as individuals, who will care for and rehabilitate wild birds and set them free when they can fend for themselves. I have been doing this for decades, particularly hand raising chicks and then release them. This is a true joy of my existence!

I know that following Hurricanes Katrina and Rita last year several people rescued birds and other animals. Most were injured but many were able to recover and be released back to their home.
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Then there is the other side. The Dark Side...... I went to a weekend seminar that was for wildlife rehabilitators. For some reason which still escapes me, an invited speaker was someone from the Ohio Department of Natural Resources (ODNR). He spoke frankly about their role in wildlife "management." One of the animal species they manage are the starlings.

They will roost by the hundreds in areas and are considered a pest and nuisance. The ODNR will fly over roosting flocks at night and spray them with water during the winter or late fall. The birds, soaked, succumb to hypothermia and fall from the trees and die. Someone actually has the job of counting the dead. :-C

The fellow from the ODNR said specifically that the impact of rehabilitators is insignificant for the well being of any given population. I suppose in other words it was a waste of time to try to save and then release a blue jay or a mourning dove.

I generally am someone who respects the views of other people, even when they are not the same as my own views. Everyone is entitles to their opinion ... however .. I became enraged with this man as he kept on and on ... I walked out on him! And I would do it again!
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I cannot help but to wonder how many other non-starlings were accidentally frozen to death by the control misting of the area where the starlings were roosting? The man never did answer the question about a collateral damage count.

Had people not stepped in the California Condor would be extinct. Maybe if there was an intervention / rehabbers, we'd still have Passenger Pigeons and others?
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So at the end of this rambling I pose a question: what do you think about the role of wildlife / bird rehabilitators? Do you think they do impact a given species population or are they just entertaining themselves for a personal 'feel good' moment?

What say ye?

Lydia

Mornig Lydia, It's still early here, but the clocks have changed and I've been laying in bed trying to work out what time it actually is. I am now just ever so slightly confused. A true tog! I don't know if you've ever heard of Terry Wogan but anyway I digress.
Speaking personally, I think anyone who can rescue and rehabilitate anything is a wonder. You keep on doing it. Starlings are my least favourite bird, they line up like the zulus in that film, then eat their way through everything. I would not like to hear of any harm coming to anything and what those people do to those poor birds is horrific.
best wishes
Rose.

Hi Lydia,
Just you carry on as you are doing, I think the attitude of the ODNR is a disgraceful one, and that your protest was in order. As you say an indiscriminate, like that is bound to effect other birds in the same area.
Best Wishes
George

Hi Lydia I like you think the culling of any creature is unacceptable, you are right the lord knows how many other species died from this action, who trains these people and puts these ideas in their sad minds? Good for you walking out on him, seems to me a few well aimed bad eggs would have been his just reward.
Dont stop your work in conserving the birds, they need all the help they can get in this world, you doing a great job, keep up the good work. :clap:
Good Birding PeterK

Hi Lydia,
I agree with what others have said, Infact, a friends brother-in-law is also a rehabilitator, working mainly with raptors.

Hi Lydia,
How appalling!! that is my reaction, as well as horror and disgust, I'm shaking so much with anger at what that man said they do I can barely type,and what they do in the name of "management"!! Horrible!!
You carry on your good work, and if there was more like you then maybe, just maybe, we could redress the damage,that the species called man does everywhere he goes. I hate the thought of any creature being hurt let alone killed, and this is such indiscriminate murder!
All the best to you Lydia and please don't ever stop your rescuing and saving injured and orphaned creatures, "more power to your elbow" that's what I say,
Judo.

What a stupid way of dealing with the starlings. Now, I agree with moving out species that are invasive and causing problems as a result - though they is always more uproar against some more than others - but pouring water over an area? The number of utterly stupid ideas that are coming out from the USA of late are making me wonder what drugs the people coming up with them are taking!

Rehabiliating wildlife is actually doing SOMETHING. Okay, it isn't going to give an overall massive boost to the population, but one more survivor is one additional animal to the population (unless the population is less than around 500 individuals in which case each survivor really does count). Every difference helps I know I would take on an injured bird if I found one (will actually have a good rescued bit enclosure soon come to think of it).

I think the role of Wildlife/bird rehabilitators is to be applauded, anyone surely with a love for nature would try and rescue and recuperate and hopefully return to freedom any creature that was in need of mankinds intervention.

Well done for walking out Lydia and showing your contempt for the person from the ODNR, I hope many others followed your example.

You are such a compassionate person Lydia, keep up the good work that you do and as Judo said "more power to your elbow"

I also think Starlings are characters , I know they can be considered a pest but they are only doing what comes naturally to them when they congregate in such numbers.
Such a pity they are hounded as being a nuisance!!!

Hello Lydia. Starlings are like humans.They do a great deal of good in the right place and a lot of damage in the wrong place .Why not just move them on as we do with human vandals?If dictators wipe out humans they are war criminals with a very cruel solution.
As for rehabilitation,what if health organisations took the attitude that"why bother saving this man/ woman/childs life ,there are plenty more around?"

A very angry maurice. Carry on Lydia

Hi again everyone. :flowers:

Someone has to be at the bottom of the favourite bird list, now don't they? Personally I cringe when I see the arrival of the Common Grackles (Quiscalus quiscula) here in spring. They raid nests, steal eggs, steal chicks or sometimes just peck chicks or adult ____________ (fill in the blank) birds just seemingly because they can! :eek!: But they too need to make a living and that is their way, ehh? I don't care for their techniques but I would NEVER shoot or trap or otherwise "manage" them because they destroyed a finch or sparrow nest in my garden.

I believe I have hand raised 3 grackle chicks and released them to do what they feel they need to do. I have also kept 3 adults that were injured and/or sick until they could be released. I know they'll raid someone's nest but that is Nature's way. Somehow things stay in balance as long as people don't interfere on a grand scale.

Here, if I were to take a starling or house sparrow chick to a rehabber, they would either be destroyed or fed to a raptor in the facility. NO WAY would that ever happen to my sweet sweet Kramer. (Starling.)

I believe about 25% to 50% of those in attendance at the talk walked out in disgust while the ODNR guy was talking! I have never in my life before, or since, walked out on a speaker but I could no longer stay there. (I'm 47 years old.) It was like listening to a serial killer boast about his deeds. :-C

I mostly hand raise chicks but have cared for many adults. Some of them include: chicks: house wren, house sparrow,red finch, house finch, screech owl, chickadee, killdeer, mallard duck, robin, blue jay, grackle, crow, common flicker woodpecker, bobolink, mourning dove, chipping sparrow, starling. The injured or ill birds include: ring billed gull, blue heron, grackle, starling, robin, red finch, house finch, crow, pheasant, Canada goose, woodcock, junco.

There's probably more individuals but you get the idea. I can't help but think that when I raised some robins and released them in the summer they went off and had their own chicks in future seasons. I'm not with the ODNR but I would think that does have an impact on the survival of a population. Dontchathink?

Your UK starlings and house sparrow populations are in decline, I believe, due to decreased habitat? A very good friend of mine from this forum sends me lovely photographs and your sparrow looks a little different from our house sparrow. Are they the same species? Would they breed with one another?

Thanks for all the replies and interest.

One day I will bore you with tales of Kramer, my amazing starling.

Lydia :bounce:

Hi Lydia,

I just want to add my voice to those who've already posted. I am shocked at an organisation taking such steps to reduce numbers, but being so daft about it, as you say, who knows what other creatures may have been affected. I was under the assumption that such efforts were meant to be humane anyway, which that certainly is not!!! I'm very angry about the idea that it's OK to cover wildlife in water during very cold weather just to cut down numbers. What a shame we couldn't give them a taste of their own treatment and see how they like it!!!!

Like you Lydia, I couldn't not help an injured bird/animal just because it's 'common as muck'. I bought a book some time ago about how to care for wildlife that was injured. In one chapter it talked about not helping mice if they were caught by a cat as they were pests. I have to say that if I can save a mouse from a cat's clutches I do, in fact there have been a number of mice, birds and shrews that have survived being caught by our cats, because we bothered to care.

It makes me sick to think that there are those who can be so cavalier with life which in my opinion, is precious, and who are we to make those kind of judgements!

(I'll get off my soapbox now!)

Well done, and keep caring.

:clap: :flyaway:

Hi Cathy and may I add a thanks to you for your comments about this. Everyone here seems to be of a like reasoning on this topic.

:-O Funny you should mention mice. Two years ago a neighbour called me frantic that there was "something" in her garage and could I come help? I went over to see what was causing so much distress only to find a baby mouse.

She was ~~just~~ starting to grow some hair. I don't member if her eyes were open yet but she was on the floor, near lifeless and very dehydrated and cold. The neighbours had mouse problems and had put out poison in their home to rid themselves of the mice.

Apparently one of the poisoned was the Mama of this wee baby and she crawled from her nest to find her Mom. What could I do?!?! I took her home, warmed her up, gave her a warm comfortable bed, enclosed by a heating pad, to nestle in made of a small bunched up towel and started feeding her warm milk. Her name was Hyacinth. 3

A few hours later the neighbour called again. Another baby! So now we had Hyacinth and Tommy living in the livingroom on the couch in a heated aquarium. The next day a third call. Rose came to live with her siblings. She was much smaller and weaker. She died three days later but her brother and sister went on to thrive and grow.

I thought that since they were hand raised they would be tame. WRONG! One day they just seemed to know they should not come in contact with people and were wild. We spent about 2 hours trying to recapture an escaped Hyacinth from the living room / dining room area without the help of any of our 6 cats!

Then, after they were eating seeds, cereal, apples, grapes, biscuits on their own we needed to have a long spell of good weather so they would not get rained on shortly after release. We released them to a safe area, with a generous supply of seeds and fruits (fresh and dried). As far as we knew there were no resident cats in the area and plenty of woods, hollow trees and hollows in which to hide and set up house keeping.

... Mike, my husband could only laugh about the whole thing. Who else but me would go through such lengths to save a wild mouse? No one he knows. ~~But he still puts up with me so I guess it's OK. LOL!~~

Lydia

Hi Lydia As to your querie about British and American Sparrows, they are quite different I do know that much, as to their interbreeding I have no idea. Some info though there is a large population of British Sparrows in New York, they have been causing some concern of late as they are taking over the place and driving out the original residents. Unfortunately the report did not state if there was any mating activity involved between them, just that the Brits were more agresive!
Yours Peter

PeterK said:

Hi Lydia As to your querie about British and American Sparrows, they are quite different I do know that much, as to their interbreeding I have no idea. Some info though there is a large population of British Sparrows in New York, they have been causing some concern of late as they are taking over the place and driving out the original residents. Unfortunately the report did not state if there was any mating activity involved between them, just that the Brits were more agresive!
Yours Peter

Click to expand...

Hi Peter / Lydia

When my brother lived in New Jersey, the British sparrows were a real pest, they used to attack the bluebirds and their nests, they were one of the things they brother wasn't bothered about missing whilst he was over there.

andy

Hi Lydia,

What a wonderful story, I could just picture you looking after your new adopted family. It's just as well that your husband could laugh! LOL

Cheers, :t: :flyaway:

Hi Peter and Andy.

Thank you for your replies and information. :brains: I did not know that the UK sparrows were aggressive, although I know the House Sparrows here (another import) apparently raid the bluebird nests too. ~~SIGH~~ Seems like lots of things raid not only the bluebirds but the nests of other birds.

I believe that everyone needs to make a living if we humans like it or not. As far as being labeled as "aggressive" ... we all have our moments now don't we? :'D
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Hi Cathy.

Hand raising baby mice was a first for me. With me being a veterinarian, my husband is already aware that there is no predicting what I may come home with. Mike too loves animals and has done his share of bringing home animals! (Do we really NEED hermit crabs? Apparently Mike does but say he got them for our children. Uh huh! We all believe that one don't we?)
:-O

Did you happen to read "The Who Diary" that I posted at the BBC Messageboards before they switched things around? Mike was VERY concerned about the sick Mourning Dove and did quite a lot of the tube feeding needed. Since this is just between the two of us I'll let you know that my Mike wrote 99% of that series of posts.

Kindest regards to one and all!

Lydia

Hi Lydia,

On the subject of Sparrows, our native 'Sparrows' are of a different Family to your 'American Sparrows' . Passer domesticus (House Sparrow) and Passer montanus (Tree Sparrow) are Weaver Finches of the Family Ploceidae, whereas your birds are closely related to our Buntings, family Emberizidae. So interbreeding would be extremely unlikely, I don't think that there has been any accepted case of Weaver Finch/Bunting hybrids.

Going back to the business of indiscriminately watering an area to 'control' Starlings (or any other species) one can only marvel at the crass stupidity of these people. How on earth could they imagine that their actions wouldn't have a deleterious effect on ALL animal life in the area; the mind boggles.

I think that people like yourself are to be heartily congratulated on your efforts to help distressed birds/animals; one can argue for hours over which species should be singled out for saving and which not but in the limit the choice must always be with the person on whom the task devolves. Keep up the good work!

Bill.

Hi Lydia, Pass this on to Mike B for keeping those of us who followed 'Whos diary' updated, and for being as caring as you are. Come to think of it have one yourself aswell, I am sure you played a small part in it all B .

Happy Birding

Hi Lydia,

Sorry, I've only just read this and was utterly appalled at it! It was the day that Terry & I had been watching as a Starling was mooching about the lawn collecting old grass etc for nesting....and GOOD for her too!

How any real human being do such a wicked thing defies belief and I'm delighted to see you walked out on him (...it). To be honest, he's fortunate someone didn't thump him! :-C

I think we'll always see people interfere with Nature when perhaps it would have been best to leave well alone, but we each have to do what we deem is best at the time. Often that time is only a matter of seconds in which to make up our minds and no one that wasn't there at time time can truly say whether the actions were right or wrong. However, the action of THAT chap were deplorable and the same should be done to him and all those involved on a bitterly cold day at the crack of dawn.....might bring his brain back to a better train of thought!!! :storm:

Good to see you again Lydia.

Sue

Hi there Bill, Pam and Sue.

Thanks Bill for setting me straight on the UK and US sparrow / finch species. Hmmmmmm........... For some reason I was under the impression that the US house sparrows were imported and released from the UK many moons ago and I thought that they may still be able to breed with each other.

Apparently in our Gulf coast states the practice of using a wetting agent plus water sprayed on flocks of roosting starlings is also employed to control the darling starlings. :-C Someone from another bird forum stated the following concerning starlings:

"Also, I found out why they're not a problem in Europe (as one poster mentioned). THEY EAT THEM, THERE. They have canneries in France, Spain, and the Netherlands, where they can and eat millions of them. They're also sold in duty free shops at their airports........"

:eek!: :eek!: :eek!: Is that true?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
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The rescue and care for the various species will vary with people's personal likes or dislikes as well as their ability to care for a given species. To feed robins or gulls is much more expensive and time consuming than feeding a dove or other seed eater.

I personally don't check the "politics" of anyone that comes to me in need. Some people do and they have the right to their opinion and allocation of time needed for the care of species 'X' in comparison to species 'Y'. I'll hand raise a sparrow and a blue jay and a screech owl at the same time. The real trick is to not let the other birds see that I am feeding the young of someone who will grow up and may eat them! It is very easy to cause a panic!
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When we caught Who, the Mourning Dove, my husband was hobbling around on crutches because he had re-injured his knee earlier. It was difficult for him to go to work so he stayed home most of those Who days and did what needed to be done for the dove. When I came home Mike started telling me this looooooooong story about what the dove did and what he was thinking about captivity. Mike's narration was very funny and I suggested he start writing down the tales of Who.

Once he wrote down Who's story of the day I thought we needed to share my beloved husband's insanity with other innocent unsuspecting souls.... The BBC Messageboard people. :-O I don't remember which diary entry I wrote. I think it was Day 3 of Captivity and about 50% of Who's last entry in the diary.

I'm very pleased that you liked the Diary! I'm also very pleased that things here are back to the normal amount of controlled chaos and I can join the bird forum chat again.

Kindest regards always!

Lydia