New FG to Birds of Madagascar (1 Viewer)

NHBS lists the new FG as in stock: http://www.nhbs.com/title/204526/birds-of-madagascar-and-the-indian-ocean-islands

I must admit that I'm not sure yet whether it is an improvement over the already excellent book by Sinclair and Langrand: http://www.nhbs.com/title/65220/birds-of-the-indian-ocean-islands

The new book is twice as expensive. And looking at the sample pictures, the illustrations may well be too flashy? Anyway, I am looking forward to the first - hopefully somewhat comparative - reviews.

I have just returned from a 26 day birding trip to Madagascar where the "old" book served us very well.

Thanks for that Robert, just ordered it.

Cheaper here and with free delivery in the UK

https://wordery.com/birds-of-madagascar-and-the-indian-ocean-islands-roger-safford-9781472924094


Andy

andyadcock said:

Thanks for that Robert, just ordered it.

Cheaper here and with free delivery in the UK

https://wordery.com/birds-of-madagascar-and-the-indian-ocean-islands-roger-safford-9781472924094


Andy

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Thanks Andy, if you also have the 2013 edition of the "older" book, I'd appreciate a comparative comment once you have the new book. As for me, I first need to be convinced that I need the new book. It's highly unlikely that I will ever get a second chance to visit this fine country.

I also already own volume 8 of the "Birds of Africa" handbook series, that was later added and deals exclusively with the Malagasy region.

I have the much older photographic guide by Morris and Hawkins and the even older Langrand book from 1990.

I don't like photographic guides so this will be an improvement on what I have. I think the only other valid comparison will be as you say with the Birds of the Indian Ocean Islnds by Sinclair and Langrand of which I have the 2003 version.

Andy

andyadcock said:

I have the much older photographic guide by Morris and Hawkins and the even older Langrand book from 1990.

I don't like photographic guides so this will be an improvement on what I have. I think the only other valid comparison will be as you say with the Birds of the Indian Ocean Islnds by Sinclair and Langrand of which I have the 2003 version.

Andy

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The 2013 edition had been completely redone, I first had the 2003 one too, but gave it away after I got the 2013 one. Essentially that was a new book, I felt.

I agree regarding photographic guides. Our first tour guide had possibly the one you have, I don't recall the authors, and the book had lost its cover. He used it quite often to show us the species, but he was more than happy when he realized I had a spare copy of the Sinclair/Langrand book that I was going to give him. I had planned to take along two extra copies to give away to somebody. Only one copy arrived in time, unfortunately.

Anyway, I think every serious birder who books an expensive tour should be able to afford a book or two and make sure he brings it along. For the local guides, these books constitute a luxury they can't afford. Thus, the book should not be given as a substitute for a cash tip. Rather as an addition. I started to make this a policy of mine after realizing in 2012 that the Ghana FG was hardly present among the park personnel. Yet the desire for the book existed.

Swissboy said:

The 2013 edition had been completely redone, I first had the 2003 one too, but gave it away after I got the 2013 one. Essentially that was a new book, I felt.

I agree regarding photographic guides. Our first tour guide had possibly the one you have, I don't recall the authors, and the book had lost its cover. He used it quite often to show us the species, but he was more than happy when he realized I had a spare copy of the Sinclair/Langrand book that I was going to give him. I had planned to take along two extra copies to give away to somebody. Only one copy arrived in time, unfortunately.

Anyway, I think every serious birder who books an expensive tour should be able to afford a book or two and make sure he brings it along. For the local guides, these books constitute a luxury they can't afford. Thus, the book should not be given as a substitute for a cash tip. Rather as an addition. I started to make this a policy of mine after realizing in 2012 that the Ghana FG was hardly present among the park personnel. Yet the desire for the book existed.

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A good Idea especially if you can't afford to gift a pairs of 'bins'. I did it in Laos with my old Robson guide.


Andy

This was published on Thursday. Should now be available in all good bookshops.

Jim

I now have the book.
The only other comparable title is 'Birds of the Indian Ocean Islands' with which it compares favourably. Plates are good qulity and the page layout is identical.

Part 1
Deals with non-passerines.

Part 2
deals with passerines and 'near' passerines and species are grouped by Island, each having it's own color coded page header. Many will favour this arrangement I think as it prevents having to eliminate each possible species on range.

The Seychelles, birds are even further organised as Coralline or Granitic.

Part 3
Is entirely devoted to the large number of vagrants which have occured accross the regiuon.

Taxonomy follows HBW and there are further notes within the text assisiting the reader to identify potential splits.

Definitely worth having.


Andy

Variable availability?

I just noticed that the German Amazon has a publication date of 17 MAY 2016. Strange world, it's the same Helm FG.

US Amazon also lists a publication date of 17 May 2016, and it's also for the Helm book, no US edition.

postage variation, again

Looking at BookFinder, I find this book listed at a bit under 34 Swiss Francs , international Economy postage to Switzerland included. And I could really get it at this price shipped to my son in the US. However, as soon as I enter my Swiss shipping address, postage goes up by about 3 GBP. And it's Economy all the same, and shipped from a UK company. This time, it's not Book Depository, but Wordery, that seems to "screw" me. :C

Swissboy said:

Looking at BookFinder, I find this book listed at a bit under 34 Swiss Francs , international Economy postage to Switzerland included. And I could really get it at this price shipped to my son in the US. However, as soon as I enter my Swiss shipping address, postage goes up by about 3 GBP. And it's Economy all the same, and shipped from a UK company. This time, it's not Book Depository, but Wordery, that seems to "screw" me. :C

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Join the EU Robert! :t:

Seriously, I do wonder if there is a tax explanation or maybe Swiss postage is simply more expensive internally?

Andy

andyadcock said:

Join the EU Robert! :t:

Seriously, I do wonder if there is a tax explanation or maybe Swiss postage is simply more expensive internally?

Andy

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That might all be, but then BookFinder should not specifically quote a lower price to Switzerland. Well, I finally ordered via Amazon.uk from UKPaperbackshop, and the price quoted is even lower than the one found via BookFinder. But I'll only rejoice once the book is reported as having been shipped. I've had sudden "no longer available" notifications before.

Swissboy said:

...........But I'll only rejoice once the book is reported as having been shipped. I've had sudden "no longer available" notifications before.

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The book has been on its way according to the notes I got. Shipped on 25 December!? Do they work on Christmas Day? Well, still up to ten days till it's supposed to arrive. But then, 5 January is tomorrow, and that's the first possible day. 8-P

Comparison of the new and old FG

Swissboy said:

The book has been on its way according to the notes I got. Shipped on 25 December!? Do they work on Christmas Day? Well, still up to ten days till it's supposed to arrive. But then, 5 January is tomorrow, and that's the first possible day. 8-P

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Oh well, it took a bit longer, but the book arrived today. Needless to say that my curiosity led me to almost immediately examine the book. And comparing the new FG with the earlier one by Sinclair and Langrand makes me wonder whether this was the most urgently needed duplication. The two books have a lot in common. They have almost the same format (deviating by just a few millimeters one way or the other). And while the Helm book has about 70 more pages, it actually weighs about 15 grams less and is even a bit thinner. Thus, my initial fears of a heavier book were unfounded. But the big difference in price remains. Though it may come down once all the libraries and those who can't wait - like myself - have bought their copy.

Both books have very good plates, but the printing in the new one shows dull reds and yellows as the samples with the Asities and Fodies show. The Helm book has colored horizontal bars on top and at the bottom. So proper assignments on the pictures should be no problem where I switched the books for easier comparison. Usually, the new Helm FG is at the bottom. Another printing issue is the fact that whites are more light grays. I find this irritating in the white herons/egrets as well as in the vangas (see next post).

Here is the rest of the pictures. I should mention that I had used the earlier book on a recent trip to Madagascar. That explains the various hand written parts or the yellow markings of the endemics.

Pointers on the plates are missing in both books, unfortunately. One can tell that the Helm book is less intended for natives as it misses the French names. That's an opportunity lost! Range maps in the Helm book differentiate considerably more than what one finds in the older one, using different colors as well as hatching. On the other hand, for the islands around Madagascar it is somewhat of a pain trying to discern the minute arrows that point to the appropriate islands. The "not to scale" approach in the older book is much preferable with clear red markings. And for Madagascar Plover, one already needs to know for the new book where the species's limited range is. Here a pointer would be helpful!

Some species names differ, obviously depending on the preferred systematics. Thus, Yellow-billed Kite primarily runs as Black Kite (with a minute remark at the end of the text that this can be seen differently). Similarly, Dimorphic and Little Egret are mixed. But essentially, the species runs as Little Egret in the new book, whereas there is no mention of that name in the older book. Rather, it is separately listed as a vagrant species to the Seychelles. Gygis alba runs under Common White Tern in the older book, but under Fairy Tern in the new one. With White Tern as alternate name mentioned at the end.

In the Helm book, the authors try an approach that is supposed to help weeding out "non-interesting" species. Thus, there is a section common to all the area covered. And then, there is a section specific for each group of islands. Thus visitors to the Seychelles need not to go through the Madagascar-only species, etc. Also, vagrants are concentrated in a section in the back. This may all help in most cases. But if I want to compare say Sacred Ibis species, it becomes a pain. The approach assumes that each species remains where it "belongs" and that vagrants are only to be discovered by those who already suspect them.

Each book also has its plus and minus points. Each has its more crowded plates than the other one. I personally prefer having all the Vanga species together. In the Helm book, some other species like Cuckoo-shrike and Bulbul are mixed in. The older book has not a single picture of a standing Madagascar Pratincole. The text in the newer book is somewhat more elaborate. But its smaller print and grayish color are a mistake that reminds one of the second edition Sibley! Do these publishers not learn from one another?

It looks good. The illustrations seem to be of a high quality, even though the colour reproduction isn't! Not sure I hold with the "eradication" of dimorphic egret. Do the authors say that they follow a specific taxonomy?
Surely it would be best to stick with IOC or Clements.
With that in mind, what do they do for rock thrushes and Madagascar stonechat?

Rob

edenwatcher said:

It looks good. The illustrations seem to be of a high quality, even though the colour reproduction isn't! Not sure I hold with the "eradication" of dimorphic egret. Do the authors say that they follow a specific taxonomy?
Surely it would be best to stick with IOC or Clements.
With that in mind, what do they do for rock thrushes and Madagascar stonechat?

Rob

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They say on page 11 that they follow BoA 8 which is based on the original HBW volumes (not the Illustrated Checklist that covers non-passerines only, so far).

The Stonechat for Madagascar runs under African (S. torquatus), with two subspecies shown and the remarks that they seem to be genetically distinct from African races.

Rock Thrush has Littoral and Forest as species. And within the latter the races erythronotus (Amber Mountain) and sharpei with three populations (Benson's SW inland, E forest, Bemaraha). They also mention that some may still be considered separate species. Four different males and three different females are illustrated for Forest Rock Thrush.

I received my copy of the Helm field guide a few days ago and I must say that I prefer it over the Sinclair & Langrand book, because I feel that the illustrations are better, especially because the S&L book has still some pretty old and quite ugly ones (e.g. raptors). And they also illustrate more of the existing variation. The idea of splitting the book up into sections per island and then vagrants also apart is something I like. Though it is a bit confusing not to have e.g. the raptors also divided over the different island sections. Whether is justifies the way higher price, I do not know and I would have preferred a helm guide for an region not yet covered by a proper field guide (e.g. Zambia, Angola, Malawi & Northern Mozambique).

T.O. said:

........... I would have preferred a helm guide for an region not yet covered by a proper field guide (e.g. Zambia, Angola, Malawi & Northern Mozambique).

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As I have since found out, this FG is an offshoot of the the work that had been done for the large volume Birds of the Malagasy Region that had been attached to the Birds of Africa series as BoA vol. 8. So, much of the detail work had already been done, and the publisher felt it could be used for a FG as well. This is explained right at the beginning of the acknowledgements on p. 7.

So, that makes sense.

Niels