Replacing a Kowa TSN2 (1 Viewer)

[Sharp Shin]

My old and trusted Kowa TSN2 scope (straight) took a sad tumble off its tripod last weekend and broke (the lens housing breaking open). It's irreparable, but it was insured. My question is this: what current Kowa scope most closely fits the bill as a replacement (that the insurance company would be happy with)? Thanks - Stewart

 

[RJM]

The 77x series Prominar is a great compact and lightweight scope for its aperture size. You will need a new eyepiece though.

 

[normjackson]

Not sure you could claim the 77x Prominar is in the same league, but maybe worth a try I'd have thought the Kowa TSN 661 is the only thing anywhere near; would also take your eyepiece (not sure how far the "backward compatibility" with appropriate adaptor goes in the Kowa family). The TSN 661 is more compact, lightweight and waterproof but guess doesn't have the same reputation for ruggedness. Also the substantially reduced aperture ought to make it cheaper.

As a guide for actual replacement cost with a S/H item (possibly not too relevant) LCE have "average condition" TSN-2 and TSN-3 on their books at the moment (the latter looks much the better deal). Ace Optics have an excellent condition TSN 3 and In Focus have two TSN 4s at hugely different prices which presumably reflects their condition. If you were happy with the TSN2, a really good condition TSN4 would be a nice replacement.

Sorry, insurance just puzzles me :h?:

 

[Sharp Shin]

Thanks for this advice. The TSN2 was a 80mm objective lens and I think I'd like a replacement of similar size. I've just spoken to Ace Cameras and they reckon the TSN 882 would be the nearest equivalent. (My previous scope wasn't a Prominar, so I couldn't really claim to replace it with that!) Any helpful comments on quality/weight/usability of the TSN 882 would be grarefully received. Also, am I correct in assuming that my old 30x wide-angle eyepiece wouldn't fit the TSN 882?

Stewart

 

[dipped]

Hi sorry to hear about the mishap - a similar thing happened to me.

A Kowa 82SV would be the nearest equivalent in current production and your eyepiece would fit except it is angled. It has an 82mm non fluorite objective and takes current Kowa eyepieces from the smaller Kowa scopes.

By the way the TSN2 is a 77mm objective.

 

[normjackson]

Oops, sorry. Looks like dipped is more up to date. Didn't even know about the 82SV. Is that effectively 821 optics in a new shell?

Seems as though Kowa have discontinued the non Prominar versions of the 77s and 88s as well (though I see Ace Cameras still have an 882).

 

[dipped]

I see it as an 821 with a revised eyepiece mount.

 

[Sharp Shin]

Thanks again 'normjackson' and 'dipped' for the information. You are correct that the TSN2 was a 77mm objective lens and not '80mm'. OK, so futher revisions: if I'm to ask for a like-for-like replacement (as near as I can), then it would be the 77 series - the straight, non-Prominar version (771? 772?) Norm Jackson suggests that this may have been discontinued - but, if I read their website correctly, Kay Opticals appear to have one. Is this likely, then, to be a 'bin end' for this particular type of Kowa scope. Hey, this isn't proving as easy as I thought it would!

Stewart

 

[Paul Jarvis]

I think you need to speak to your insurance and find out what they will replae it with, as it might be like for like cost wise or scope. If it is price you may well be better taking the money and look second hand for a TSN 3/4 or simililar. Not sure what eye piece you have but I my dad wants to sell his 20/60 zoom that is for the TSN1/2/3/4.

 

[johnf3f]

I have compared my Kowa TSN4 Prominar to a TSN2 and the TSN4 is is significantly better IMO. You can pick up a TSN4 fairly cheap these days, if your insurance company will allow you to. Note a number of the Opticron eye pieces will fit these Kowas - I am currently using the Opticron SDL V2 (with a 5mm thick O ring acting as a spacer) - this combination works very well for the price I paid. No it's not up to the top scopes but it is surprisingly close.

 

[Jaff]

Stewart the price of a 771/2 eyepiece on it's own is the same value as your old setup combined without even considering the price of a 772 body. I'd be surprised if the insurance pays out for one of them but you can always try and see. An interesting thing to note is that the eyepieces that fit into the 82SV were designed for the smaller obj. scopes and so on the 82SV you'd get an increased magnification. I use a 20-60x one on my TSN824 (with adapter) and sometimes that little boost that gets you 70x (roughly) instead of 60x can be surprisingly useful, in other words the 20-60x zoom that is supplied with an 82SV is more like a 25-70x. Similarly your existing 30x would fit onto the likes of the TSN600/660 scopes but you would get a reduced magnification and if you stick with your 30x on the 82SV you might get a small boost in mag. My recommendation would be to inform the insurance company that your old eyepiece doesn't work with any of the new Kowa scopes though and get yourself a nice new zoom eyepiece for whichever one you choose. They wouldn't know would they.

 

[normjackson]

Similarly your existing 30x would fit onto the likes of the TSN600/660 scopes but you would get a reduced magnification

Are you sure Jaff? I'm pretty sure the TSN1/2/3/4 give the same magnification as the TS611/2/3/4 with the same eyepieces and had always assumed the TSN600/660 were matched to those models (but I've already been wrong once this thread).
Makes sense that the 82SV would give a different magnification if is just an adapted 821 (thanks dipped).

 

[Jaff]

Truthfully I'm not sure myself but read henry link's post here http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=163110 which is what I based my post.

 

[normjackson]

I don't think Henry's post is inconsistent with the idea that the TSN 1/2/3/4, 61x, 60x, and 66x series all achieve the same magnification with the eyepieces intended for them (and there have been several generations of those). Think I recall, at least, that the 61x series managed to match the earlier bigger scopes by the addition of some sort of Barlow lens.

I guess becomes an issue when use an adaptor with a different series eyepiece (or indeed one from Opticron which fits). The 82SV confuses the issue by having 82 optics but adapted for use directly with the eyepieces intended for the earlier generation. Not sure, though, whether the shift from say 25x to 27x would amount to a great deal in practice?

Must say now's a bad time to lose your scope ||

 

[Sharp Shin]

Thanks for all the advice guys. It's not proving straightforward is it? The company appear to have agreed to a 'new' for 'old' replacement - and the same price inflation over the intervening years would apply to lots of goods. (And, heavens, the premium I've paid them over all the intervening years would even have bought me a top-of-the range Swarovski!). So, my intention is to try for a 772 (with new 30x eyepiece). If the retailer is asked 'is this a contemporary equivalent?' they could answer 'yes' honestly. (And I want to be honest too.) The only issue is that this non-Prominar scope appears to be very difficult to get hold of - and I have a couple of retailers 'on search'. (Norm Jackson said this earlier in the thread.) Will let you know the outcome.

Thanks again everyone - Stewart

 

[philwegener]

Found this thread because I lost my eyepiece off of my trusty old TSN2. Anyone still know of eyepieces available that would cost less than the new 600 series eyepieces from Kowa, Ebay, etc?

 

[SteveClifton]

Found this thread because I lost my eyepiece off of my trusty old TSN2. Anyone still know of eyepieces available that would cost less than the new 600 series eyepieces from Kowa, Ebay, etc?

Try here:

http://www.at-infocus.co.uk/usedequipment.html

They have a 27x for £59 at their Titchwell shop. It's not one of the larger TSN eyepieces, but one of the smaller ones for the older 60mm TS range of scopes, however, I think it has the same bayonet fit so should work.

You could try calling them to ask. Note that the cheaper Kowa eyepieces advertised are an even older screw-fit so wouldn't work.

Also try ebay, and the websites of Cley Spy, Kay Optical & Ace Optics. They all get in used eyepieces from time to time, even if not listed on their websites.

Also, as I remember one of the Opticron zooms fits onto the outside screw threads on the Kowa TSN eyepiece mount. The Denby Dale store have a used zoom for £119, but not sure if it's the correct one. Think it was the SDL (see post #10 above)

 

[johnf3f]

Found this thread because I lost my eyepiece off of my trusty old TSN2. Anyone still know of eyepieces available that would cost less than the new 600 series eyepieces from Kowa, Ebay, etc?

I can confirm that the Opticron SDL V2 works well in my TSN4. There are quite a number of the Opticron eyepieces that work on these scopes, note some of them will need a spacer (placed inside the threaded collar) to function properly - a Neoprene O ring works great.
Find a friendly optic shop and give them a try.

 

[Sharp Shin]

Found this thread because I lost my eyepiece off of my trusty old TSN2. Anyone still know of eyepieces available that would cost less than the new 600 series eyepieces from Kowa, Ebay, etc?

Well, I started this thread way back in Sept 2011. Though the body of my TSN2 was broken, the eyepieces (30xWA & 20xWA) were fine and I traded them in when I got my new scope from Cley Spy. So, they should have those still in stock if you want to contact them. Shouldn't cost you much at all.

By the way, the end of my story was that Cley Spy wrote a convincing letter to my insurance company, stating that the only contemporary equivalent to a TSN was a Kowa scope in the 750 series, and these only come in the Prominar version. Technically, this is true: the range of Kowa scopes in the UK has narrowed and non-Prominar scopes don't appear to be available. Anyway, I got a very fat cheque indeed (though, of course, no more that all the payments I've made to the company) and the sum wasn't far short of the cost of a 80mm Swaroski with 20-60 zoom lens. So that it what I now have. A happy ending!!

 

[Jaff]

Well lucky you!!! Perhaps my 824 should meet with an accident, I might then get an 884! :-O