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British List (1 Viewer)

Andy1979 said:
I keep a British list in line with the BOU. This means I count everything I've seen in England, Scotland, Wales and associated islands (eg Isle of Wight, Scottish Islands etc), but not Isle of Man, Northern Ireland or Channel Islands.

So, I guess when Scotland votes to remain in the Union, nothing will change anyway!

Andy Millar
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Unless of course the BOU ceases to exist in its current form but thats jumping many steps ahead.

Just out of interest when did the British and Irish bodies split?
 
Nutcracker said:
If political UK, then you can add a whole lot from the Falklands, South Georgia, Ascension Island, Gibraltar, etc. :t:
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They aren't part of the 'political' UK ( thankfully, for listing purposes ). I've often wondered how the French get on as Tahiti, French Guiana etc are departments, just like Normandy, Provence and Corsica :eek!: and, therefore, part of the EU as well.
 
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Farnboro John said:
I'm not sure what you mean by "a British List in the true sense". Once you include offshore islands you need reasons to exclude the Isle of Man and the island of Ireland, both of which geographically are offshore islands of Great Britain. If you fall back on political UK, which I agree excludes the Isle of Man, Eire and the Overseas Territories, you are obliged to include Northern Ireland which is unmistakably part of "the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland".

I've nothing against anyone keeping whatever list they want to, but "in the true sense" is a fairly large claim for a non-logical/non-statutory grouping. What is it you actually mean?

John
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The Isle of Man is a difficult one but ireland is no more an offshore island of Britain than sumatra is an offshore island of borneo. For the purposes of a British list Britain = England+wales+scotland plus offshore islands of England+Wales+Scotland same as the bou. Seems quite straightforward to me. Including Ireland in a British list as it's part of the British isles is like including Madagascar in your Indian list as it's in the Indian ocean.
Cheers
James
 
James Lowther said:
Including Ireland in a British list as it's part of the British isles is like including Madagascar in your Indian list as it's in the Indian ocean.
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Don't know about India and Madagascar, but thinking of India, I quite fancy a British Empire list :) Just ignore a minor slip of history and we can chuck them all back on ...just think, the UK 4000 club! *


* may need a little extra colonialism to get the full 4000
 
Jos Stratford said:
Don't know about India and Madagascar, but thinking of India, I quite fancy a British Empire list :) Just ignore a minor slip of history and we can chuck them all back on ...just think, the UK 4000 club! *


* may need a little extra colonialism to get the full 4000
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Does ISIS count as colonialists? Quite a few "Brits" among that lot:-C
 
West End Birder said:
Using that list, who has seen the most and what is the score?
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No one even argues about that one and twitchers can argue about almost anything!

I believe that all of the potential candidates who may have such a claim keep a combined British, Irish and Isle of Man list as a priority. All of those that keep a more limited list as their primary one (be it a British list, British & Isle of Man list - I've seen some 'British only' listers twitching the Isle of Man or United Kingdom list) have seen less in those subsets than the top three or four 'British, Irish & Isle of Man' listers actually have - despite not actively listing those more restricted areas.

My reading suggests Ptarmigan would actually struggle to get accepted onto category B of an English only List as the evidence is pretty unconvincing and anecdotal.

All the best
 
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Andy1979 said:
I keep a British list in line with the BOU. This means I count everything I've seen in England, Scotland, Wales and associated islands (eg Isle of Wight, Scottish Islands etc), but not Isle of Man, Northern Ireland or Channel Islands.

So, I guess when Scotland votes to remain in the Union, nothing will change anyway!

Andy Millar
Click to expand...
I guess that defines what I meant by the original question - without having thought about this angle, I was effectively assuming that the BOU would divide itself in two and each part would take their own list. Of course since they're not a government body they don't actually have to do that.

Jos Stratford said:
* may need a little extra colonialism to get the full 4000
Click to expand...
Surely the UK 4000 club would be even more enthusiastic taxonomists than the 400 club? Enough new splits and we might not need to bribe Colombia to join the Commonwealth.
 
James Lowther said:
The Isle of Man is a difficult one but ireland is no more an offshore island of Britain than sumatra is an offshore island of borneo. For the purposes of a British list Britain = England+wales+scotland plus offshore islands of England+Wales+Scotland same as the bou. Seems quite straightforward to me. Including Ireland in a British list as it's part of the British isles is like including Madagascar in your Indian list as it's in the Indian ocean.
Cheers
James
Click to expand...

1. Great Britain = largest island in the British Isles therefore all smaller islands in British Isles = offshore islands of Great Britain. Simples. If you can show me a respectable world atlas with a different approach I'd be interested. I accept, BTW, that the British Isles are offshore islands of Europe - but they are an archipelago in their own right.

2. Madagascar is an offshore island of Africa, just as Sri Lanka is an offshore island of the Indian sub-continent. Your suggestion makes no geographical sense, which was my point about your original post.

None of which affects your right to follow BOU delimitation: but unless BOU can negotiate itself a position as independent keeper of the scientific Scottish list post-independence (which I doubt, it having already abandoned Northern Ireland despite that being under the sovereign rule of the Westminster government) it will have to become England and Wales only, at which point you will have a decision to make.

My geographically coherent British Isles list avoids the false trappings of nationalism and treachery of politics.

Good birding wherever!

John
 
Farnboro John said:
1. Great Britain = largest island in the British Isles therefore all smaller islands in British Isles = offshore islands of Great Britain. Simples. If you can show me a respectable world atlas with a different approach I'd be interested. I accept, BTW, that the British Isles are offshore islands of Europe - but they are an archipelago in their own right.

2. Madagascar is an offshore island of Africa, just as Sri Lanka is an offshore island of the Indian sub-continent. Your suggestion makes no geographical sense, which was my point about your original post.

None of which affects your right to follow BOU delimitation: but unless BOU can negotiate itself a position as independent keeper of the scientific Scottish list post-independence (which I doubt, it having already abandoned Northern Ireland despite that being under the sovereign rule of the Westminster government) it will have to become England and Wales only, at which point you will have a decision to make.

My geographically coherent British Isles list avoids the false trappings of nationalism and treachery of politics.

Good birding wherever!

John
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Spot on John.

Although my primary reasons for favouring Scottish independence are the Barnet formula http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barnett_formula and the West Lothian question (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Lothian_question) , a secondary reason would be to see the confusion of the English based "political listers" upon separation! ;)

cheers, alan
 
My "British List" includes Short-toed Treecreeper on Jersey; I cannot see any circumstance where I would set out to twitch one at Dungeness, Spurn or anywhere else. As I have no interest in comparing my list with any other list, it matters not one jot or tittle!
 
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