Eagle Owls in Yorkshire?? (6 Viewers)

[Anthony Morton]

Unfortunately after appearing in bbc wildlife programme called "return of the eagle owl " within weeks one of the breeding pair was found dead having been shot.

Tests showed that it's body was full of heavy gunshot gauge.

Not true. If you read the report of the autopsy carried out on the dead bird, details of which are given in a link to an earlier posting* on this thread, you will find that the bird had just TWO lead pellets in its pectorals. These had probably been there for several years and were NOT the cause of death.

I've told you a million times - DON'T exaggerate! :news:


Edit - The first link on Post #711 refers.

 

[Jos Stratford]

Not true. If you read the report of the autopsy carried out on the dead bird, details of which are given in a link to an earlier posting* on this thread, you will find that the bird had just TWO lead pellets in its pectorals. These had probably been there for several years and were NOT the cause of death.

I've told you a million times - DON'T exaggerate! :news:

A couple of points, where in the autopsy does it say the pellets had probably been there for several years and that they were NOT the cause of death? Perhaps I am mistaken, but the initial report regarding the autopsy said the pellets could have been there for several years and cause of death was left undetermined, ie they did not say the shooting was not the cause of death, they said it was not known. What was that about exaggerating?

Second, it is irrelevant whether the body contained two pellets or more, also largely irrelevant whether it was the cause of death or not, the fact is that some person out there was attempting to persecute these birds and that is disgusting, end of story.




Edit. The only relevance of the timing of the shooting was whether it was before or after the TV program, thereby perhaps suggesting if the showing of the programme led in any way to the birds demise or not .

 

[shark attack]

Does it make any difference at all whether the shot was old or not.

There seems to be lots of articles on the net with regards to the incident & I seem to be reading the same Autopsy results the main one being " An autopsy found that the stomach was empty "Causing experts to suggest she may have starved to death after the wound left her unable to hunt for a week.

QUOTE : " The body contained an amount of LARGE GAUGE SHOT OF THE TYPE USED TO KILL FOXES ;this is distinctly different from the smaller shot used to control other pests or for grouse or pheasant shooting.

Now if there is other reasons for the owl being found dead I have not read about them.

At the end of the day someone has shot this owl to deliberately try & kill it at some stage which I find hard to believe.Whether we exaggerate as to how much shot was found is to me irrelevant.

Who would want to shoot one of these ???

Why can't there be a check on people in the area who have shotgun licences to see if they would know anything ???

Are people pointing the finger at anyone ???

Remember this was land owned by the military .

Who is allowed to roam around willy nilly on land owned by the military in this day & age armed ???

IT'S BEYOND ME ..........................

 

[John Dixon]

I see Birdwatch is reporting the presumed demise of another breeding pair, with an implication that the game rearing fraternity could have been involved. It would be nice to see land owners making some strong statements like "I practise responsible land management and would sack anyone breaking the law in the name of my business" so that every gamekeeper who got a conviction would lose his job.

Maybe a case for SOCA? These guys are certainly organised!

As for roaming military land armed, if you have a 4X4 that you drive on public access land then one would require a right of search to check whether it was a mobile arsenal - not a right granted to many. You will remember with some gratitude that our military on duty is subject to the rule of law and therefore at least as restricted in what it can do as Joe Public.

John

 

[Helwith]

I see Birdwatch is reporting the presumed demise of another breeding pair, with an implication that the game rearing fraternity could have been involved. It would be nice to see land owners making some strong statements like "I practise responsible land management and would sack anyone breaking the law in the name of my business" so that every gamekeeper who got a conviction would lose his job.

John

Get real! There is no chance of that happening. Landowners do spout these statements to the general public, but to thier land management teams i.e Gamekeepers etc NOT. There priority is their game estate NOT predators legally protected in law. i.e Birds!

I've noticed any prosecutions in recent years that have been proved against Gamekeepers et al. Does nothing to stop bird persecution because the landed gentry are immune & their underlings take the rap. And DO NOT GET FIRED from their "jobs".

I await the time someone is imprisoned for these offences which is possible but improbable due to the powers that be :-(((

Craven

 

[HarassedDad]

On the subject of where the young have gone: What I find fascinating is how elusive these birds are. Apparently there was an escaped EO around Norwich from November 2005 to January 2006. It was seen within half a mile of my house and I didn't have a clue it was there. The guy telling me about it did so at a meeting of the Norwich branch of the Norfolk Wildlife Trust and not one other person in an audience of 30+ people (all of whom presumably lived locally and were interested in wildlife?) had any idea it was there. It turned up on birdline once (reported calling from Eaton Park next to the University) and then was on the local news when someone found it on their bird table! But three months around a city, in Norfolk, arguably the birdwatching capital of England, and only three reported sightings? These are clearly very good at not being seen.

 

[Jos Stratford]

What I find fascinating is how elusive these birds are. Apparently there was an escaped EO around Norwich from November 2005 to January 2006. . ...But three months around a city, in Norfolk, arguably the birdwatching capital of England, and only three reported sightings? These are clearly very good at not being seen.

I have a breeding pair on my patch, know their territory, even know the approximate nest location, but actually see the birds less than yearly! It does have to be added the habitat is extensive mature pine and finding a roosting owl is none too easy ...but at same time, have located all the small owls this year, but still not bumped into the Eagle Owls!

 

[Steve Elliott]

All are escapes or released birds

There has been an escaped Eagle Owl in the Pocklington area of Yorkshire for at leat 4 months now and maybe over a year. At best all I can say is that it is doing a good job keeping the local rat population down, but on a more worrying note there is a pair of Barn Owls in the vicinity which could be threatened.
As far as I am aware there have been no reports from anywhere in the country of Eagle Owls being seen coming in off the sea at any of our major seawatching points or observatories, so most if not all of the birds in the wild must originate from captive stock. Impressive as they are, this in itself is no reason to welcome them into our avifauna. It only takes one Eagle Owl in an area of myxymatosis, and consequently hungry, to take a few lambs, for the farming commumity to say - enough is enough, it's open season on all birds of prey. Let's not have this happen through misguided enthusiasm for a wonderful but alien species.

 

[nirofo]

There has been an escaped Eagle Owl in the Pocklington area of Yorkshire for at leat 4 months now and maybe over a year. At best all I can say is that it is doing a good job keeping the local rat population down, but on a more worrying note there is a pair of Barn Owls in the vicinity which could be threatened.
As far as I am aware there have been no reports from anywhere in the country of Eagle Owls being seen coming in off the sea at any of our major seawatching points or observatories, so most if not all of the birds in the wild must originate from captive stock. Impressive as they are, this in itself is no reason to welcome them into our avifauna. It only takes one Eagle Owl in an area of myxymatosis, and consequently hungry, to take a few lambs, for the farming commumity to say - enough is enough, it's open season on all birds of prey. Let's not have this happen through misguided enthusiasm for a wonderful but alien species

.[/QUOTE]


I wonder why the farmers with lambs and kids don't seem to have a problem with Eagle Owls in the rest of Europe and Scandinavia, there's plenty of them there where they appear to have made no significant difference to the local birds survival rate. There's very little if any persecution of this bird in these countries, so why all the fuss here? I say regardless of whether they are escapes or not, they are a welcome addition to our declining bird populations.

nirofo.

 

[rokermartin]

The pair of Eagle Owl which nested at Catterick were living beside sheep and they did'nt take any of the lambs there main prey were rabbits.Most Eagle Owls which live around Cities and Towns feed mainly on Rats also sometimes on cats and dogs.I went birding in Sweden a few years ago and talked to a few Swedish birders about there Eagle Owls and they said some Eagle Owls feed on a wide range of birds such as other birds of prey and even Capercaillie.One Swedish birder told me he saw a Eagle Owl take a Osprey off its nest.Also they have been known to take roosting Peregrine off there nests.I heard there could be as many as 42 pairs of Eagle owls breeding in the UK.Eagle Owls are still a rare bird in some parts of Europe.The Sweds must love there Eagle Owls because they are breeding them and releasing more into the wild.There are now several pairs of EagleOwl breeding in Holland the pairs in Holland breed in old and working quarries and they feed mainly on Rats.

 

[wolfbirder]

.....and ther eis a pair also on Water Board owned land at Forest of Bowland in Lancs - didnt know about this pair!

As it says in the latest article of Birdwatch, the land owners have been superb in not persecuting breeding Hen Harriers on this land. I wonder if this could be the location to make arrangements possible to view them, as every other location has remained a secret (outside inner circles of the elite birding world)?

 

[rokermartin]

There are at least 2 pairs breeding in the Midlands area and they are surposed to be pairs breeding in Scotland.Also there are more pairs breeding in Northern England .A male Eagle Owl was around Gouthwaite Reservoir Yorkshire for several weeks last winter.Seen from the Raptor view point it was heard calling a few times.On the subject on where the young Eagle Owls go to they can travel for miles.One of the young Eagle Owls from Catterick was found dead in Shropshire.

 

[cheshirebirder]

There are at least 2 pairs breeding in the Midlands area and they are surposed to be pairs breeding in Scotland.Also there are more pairs breeding in Northern England .A male Eagle Owl was around Gouthwaite Reservoir Yorkshire for several weeks last winter.Seen from the Raptor view point it was heard calling a few times.On the subject on where the young Eagle Owls go to they can travel for miles.One of the young Eagle Owls from Catterick was found dead in Shropshire.

Lads , should we be publicising the whereabouts of these birds on here ? I'm all for an open forum but there are saddo's out there who may use info to harm birds like these.

 

[rokermartin]

Lads , should we be publicising the whereabouts of these birds on here ? I'm all for an open forum but there are saddo's out there who may use info to harm birds like these.

Have 'nt mentioned any breeding sites, the male Eagle Owl was mentioned on Birdline and Bird Guides for Gouthwaite Yorkshire when it was there.The Catterick pair no longer breed because someone shoot the female.IT was shot soon after the programme was on the television about them someone who was watching that programme must have decided to get rid of them.Also the RSPB do not want Eagle Owls breeding in the UK because they think they have'nt bred in this country before.But looking back at the old records Eagle Owls have been seen in the UK hundreds of years ago.

 

[Steve Elliott]

It is interesting to hear people refer to historic records of Eagle Owls in the UK. Where are these records and what credibility do they have? If Eagle Owl were indeed a past member of the British avifauna there surely would be archaeological or cave records. If there are any records where are they published? Had there been any valid sight records or remains found, Eagle Owl would be on category B of the BOU list. It isn't there, so what evidence do you have for it?

 

[rokermartin]

It is interesting to hear people refer to historic records of Eagle Owls in the UK. Where are these records and what credibility do they have? If Eagle Owl were indeed a past member of the British avifauna there surely would be archaeological or cave records. If there are any records where are they published? Had there been any valid sight records or remains found, Eagle Owl would be on category B of the BOU list. It isn't there, so what evidence do you have for it?

According to Rare birds in Britain and Ireland written by JN.Dymond,PA Fraser and S Gantlett there have been 25 records of Eagle Owl in the 18th and 19th centuries .There was a Eagle Owl in Argyllshire in 1883.Another book Firsts for Britain and Ireland by Phil Palmer There was a Eagle Owl on Orkney in 1830 and also Phil Palmer States there are many fossel remains of Eagle Owls been found and he says there is no doubt that the species once ocurred here in a wild state.

 

[deborah4]

.Also the RSPB do not want Eagle Owls breeding in the UK because they think they have'nt bred in this country before.

Not aware the RSPB makes those kinds of emotive value judgments - and not sure they have said they 'do not want Eagle Owls breeding in UK' per se .. They are breeding in UK (numbers unknown?): Issue for this thread was origin vis a vis 'protection status' - The concern for the RSPB, from what I understood, and quite rightly, is the potential impact on indigenous prey species should numbers of wild breeding EOs increase and as such, should be monitored closely. (Whether or not, a bird is breeding in the UK, is perhaps more concern to BOU/BOURC categorisation is it not?)

 

[rokermartin]

Not aware the RSPB makes those kinds of emotive value judgments - and not sure they have said they 'do not want Eagle Owls breeding in UK' per se .. They are breeding in UK (numbers unknown?): Issue for this thread was origin vis a vis 'protection status' - The concern for the RSPB, from what I understood, and quite rightly, is the potential impact on indigenous prey species should numbers of wild breeding EOs increase and as such, should be monitored closely. (Whether or not, a bird is breeding in the UK, is perhaps more concern to BOU/BOURC categorisation is it not?)

YES somebody from the RSPB said on the National news and on the programme that they do not want to see Eagle Owls breeding in the UK.

 

[Jos Stratford]

YES somebody from the RSPB said on the National news and on the programme that they do not want to see Eagle Owls breeding in the UK.

If you're going to quote or report someone's words, try to do it correctly.

 

[deborah4]

YES somebody from the RSPB said on the National news and on the programme that they do not want to see Eagle Owls breeding in the UK.

to which you added 'because they think they don't breed in this country anymore' - a statement that contains two (IMV) erroneous presumptions:

1. The RSPB only want birds here that breed here! (historically is actually irrelevant as there are now wild breeding EOs here). 'Historical' arguments might support 're-introduction' programmes of wild birds, but not applicable in this context I don't think.

2. The EOs that are breeding here, have their origins in wild Continental breeding populations rather than, more realistically,from captive bred birds that have escaped or been deliberately released

What date is the 'programme' and the 'news item' that you quote from? Is before the RSPB provided a fuller explaination of their concerns re: EOs and before all the lengthy and repetive discussions months ago on this thread?