IOC 13.1 Updates point towards convergence. (1 Viewer)

[Jon.Bryant]

Differences in when different lists update, or if they are even choosing to have any significant update prior to the WGAC list being published.
A internal proposal system that might be allowing some matters to be voted on again and folks holding off publishing changes until they are certain.
Waiting to hear news from proposals submitted to other regional taxonomic committees, such as NACC. Which in turn operates at its own pace that seems to be much slower than WGAC.
Attempts to minimize instability for certain regions in the short term. IF WGAC (and thus ebird) departs significantly from AOS for example, that is going to have a significant impact on the ABA birding community, who are a hefty chunk of the ebird user base. In such a case they might want to work with that organization and release all of the changes at once, rather than a piecemeal slow release of changes.

Good points. I don't think the first is valid as all lists have now updated post June 2022, when WGAC said they were 50% complete (see list of families above) - I cannot see why it would take in excess of 4 months to transfer agreements to updates (the minimum period between the WGAC progress statement and the earliest subsequent update.

The rest may be good reasons though, and I recollect that there was some mention of incorporating a NACC representative on the WGAC. If this was a late development it could have meant a process of 'starting over'. I note that the WGAC website has not been updated since June 2022, so hard to know where they are at - nearing completion or two steps forward and one step back, as they try to incorporate regional committees?

 

[Mysticete]

Good points. I don't think the first is valid as all lists have now updated post June 2022, when WGAC said they were 50% complete (see list of families above) - I cannot see why it would take in excess of 4 months to transfer agreements to updates (the minimum period between the WGAC progress statement and the earliest subsequent update.

The rest may be good reasons though, and I recollect that there was some mention of incorporating a NACC representative on the WGAC. If this was a late development it could have meant a process of 'starting over'. I note that the WGAC website has not been updated since June 2022, so hard to know where they are at - nearing completion or two steps forward and one step back, as they try to incorporate regional committees?

I believe Pam Rasmussen is on both WGAC and NACC, so that isn't an issue.

As someone who is in academia and on multiple committees, I can absolutely see why it would take longer than 4 months. If something is at all remotely borderline on whether it should or should not be a species, its very possible that decision is tabled for later, they might invite folks with expertise NOT on the checklist to offer an opinion, they may decide to wait for another committee to make a decision first, they may be waiting for a paper that they know is in the pipeline to be published/made available, one person may decide to rewrite a proposal which might involve more research, etc. Our last update is in June and its fully possible that it was written with the assumption that those groups would be "checked" off, only for it to drag out longer than expected. Plus, that doesn't even factor in human error like someone forgetting to tell someone to make a change, since all of these online checklists (especially ebird) have lots of moving pieces.

Keep in mind that the WGAC committee is not a paying job. This is a ton of work that members are doing on top of there normal work responsibilities and all of the unpaid stuff academics are just expected to do (peer review papers, serve on OTHER committees, edit journals). I am honestly shocked that we have gotten any updates and the various checklists are incorporating new changes as they are voted on. I fully expected far less transparency and us not having any clue what was going on until the list appeared in some format or another.

At any rate, unless either IOC, Birdlife, or Ebird/Clements announces they are no longer participating, I wouldn't be all that concerned.

 

[njlarsen]

Good points. I don't think the first is valid as all lists have now updated post June 2022, when WGAC said they were 50% complete (see list of families above) - I cannot see why it would take in excess of 4 months to transfer agreements to updates (the minimum period between the WGAC progress statement and the earliest subsequent update.

What you do not seem to realize is that between the time a taxonomy is "frozen" for new changes and until you see it as published is a period of months spent error checking. In the case of Ebird/Clements, their databases for ebird also need to be updated to reflect the changes before you see the taxonomy published.
Niels

 

[Jon.Bryant]

What you do not seem to realize is that between the time a taxonomy is "frozen" for new changes and until you see it as published is a period of months spent error checking. In the case of Ebird/Clements, their databases for ebird also need to be updated to reflect the changes before you see the taxonomy published.
Niels

Good point regarding EBird. It would be interesting to understand how difficult it is to update EBird - Clements already make a couple of hundred plus changes a year, so presumably the database update it is not an insurmountable problem. From my database and programming experience, I would expect that database update is not the limiting factor on the size/extent of the change. BirdLife probably has a much harder task, as the list has web links to the Data Zone which is a quite informative online repository - new species accounts would therefore need to be drafted, amended or deleted. I am not sure that IOC is so encumbered, so probably could be the most fleet of foot - I know that IOC is used as the basis for BirdTrack and is one of the taxonomies in other databases, but I suspect they make their own changes and then systems that use their list have to update when they can.

I don't really understand the point on error checking. I understand we are talking about resolution of known differences that are tabled to the committee in advance of resolution. If participants in the WGAC are rechecking taxonomic papers after consensus has been reached, I would argue that consensus has is fact not been reached, but just an looser 'agreement in principal'. If a decision has been agreed, then error checking should really just be making and then checking the alteration in the database. For many changes this does not even impact information on Order, Family or even range, as we are often talking about the assignment of a species to a subspecies or a subspecies to a species.

It would be nice is taxonomic decisions could be swifter, after all, in the modern world 12 months can be a long time, and as discussed before, species designation can be paramount for effective protection/conservation.

I have now added families to my mapping and note that

• most of the families where no difference exists are listed as finalised (but strangely not all) - perhaps some local authorities differ in species treatment within these families?,
• some families listed as complete have indeed been updated by the World Authorities in the last 12 months and now match,
• quite a large number of families stated to have been finalised (and where there were differences in the first place) are not aligned in the latest World lists.
• some of the families that are not listed by WGAC as complete or in progress, seem to be the some of the most knotty problems to resolve.

The situation will undoubtedly become clearer with time - it will be interesting how many families listed in the June 2022 WAGC update, will resolve fully in the next World list updates, as this will be >12 months after WGAC finalisation.

 

[Paul Clapham]

I believe Pam Rasmussen is on both WGAC and NACC, so that isn't an issue.

And she also replaced Frank Gill to run the IOC list.

 

[Paul Clapham]

Good point regarding EBird. It would be interesting to understand how difficult it is to update EBird - Clements already make a couple of hundred plus changes a year, so presumably the database update it is not an insurmountable problem.

Updating the database itself might not seem so hard. But eBird's database also has a lot of other things attached to it. There's a billion or so database records of sightings by eBirders, and any of those may get updated. Suppose they split Whimbrel into the European and American forms; they would also find all of the Whimbrel sightings in their database and change them all to "European Whimbrel" and "American Whimbrel" depending on the location of the sighting. That sounds simple but it's inevitably more complicated than that. Suppose they split Red-shafted and Yellow-shafted Flicker. There isn't a neat line dividing the two forms, for a start, and there are other complications which could get in the way.

And then they have a website with descriptions of the species, which has to be updated with new descriptions of split and lumped forums. Even worse, there's the Merlin app which helps you identify birds given a photo or a recording of the bird. That is built by training an AI on many photos and recordings, which is certainly a time-consuming process. It may be all of that which caused them to release v2022 in October rather than August.

 

[Jon.Bryant]

Already today, the Ebird version of the Clements list can show the same species with different names whether you choose British or American English as your base. Therefore, I expect that different names and spellings of the same species will continue.
Niels

For clarity I am not expecting the WGAC to align common names. I was referring only to Latin names, which after all are meant to be unique and universal.

 

[Jon.Bryant]

Suppose they split Whimbrel into the European and American forms; they would also find all of the Whimbrel sightings in their database and change them all to "European Whimbrel" and "American Whimbrel" depending on the location of the sighting.

Point taken. As I say, only time will tell whether WGAC work fully filters through to world taxonomies, so let’s see what 2023, 2024 and 2025 updates and beyond bring.

I will continue to update my mapping, and it will be interesting if convergence continues (although in my current point of view quite slowly).

From the number of alignments brought about by the last year of updates, it will take more than 11 years to clear the remainder, but perhaps there are major updates in the offing, just waiting for the background processes to be aligned.

 

[Jon.Bryant]

They have directly stated that the new checklist will include subspecies.

Forgot to mention the WGAC website states ‘of the 455 implemented proposals, we have implemented treatment of 625 taxa at the species level or above’. I don’t fully follow the meaning of the sentence (too many uses of the term ‘implemented’?) , but possibly subspecies are not included at the moment. As you say they are all volunteers and resolving all differences down to subspecies level would be a monumental endeavour.

 

[Mysticete]

Updating the database itself might not seem so hard. But eBird's database also has a lot of other things attached to it. There's a billion or so database records of sightings by eBirders, and any of those may get updated. Suppose they split Whimbrel into the European and American forms; they would also find all of the Whimbrel sightings in their database and change them all to "European Whimbrel" and "American Whimbrel" depending on the location of the sighting. That sounds simple but it's inevitably more complicated than that. Suppose they split Red-shafted and Yellow-shafted Flicker. There isn't a neat line dividing the two forms, for a start, and there are other complications which could get in the way.

And then they have a website with descriptions of the species, which has to be updated with new descriptions of split and lumped forums. Even worse, there's the Merlin app which helps you identify birds given a photo or a recording of the bird. That is built by training an AI on many photos and recordings, which is certainly a time-consuming process. It may be all of that which caused them to release v2022 in October rather than August.

They have stated that future updates would all take place in October from now on, although yes, I think it's for the reason you state. No longer is it just ebird, but it's also BoW and Merlin, and they have more pressure on ebird and getting it right since the user base has expanded considerably over the last decade.

 

[Jon.Bryant]

Over the top I know, but looking at my mapping of finalised families the "remaining" (or perhaps in progress) differences are listed below. Looks like there could be some big updates at some time in the future!

Rheidae

• Dromaius novaehollandiae, Dromaius minor and Dromaius baudinianus (Common, King Island and Kangaroo Island Emu).

Anatidae

• Anser serrirostris and Anser fabalis (Taiga and Tundra Bean Goose).
• Anas diazi and Anas fulvigula diazi (Mottled and Mexican Duck).
• Anas carolinensis and Anas crecca (Common and Green-winged Teal).

Cracidae

• Ortalis ruficeps and Ortalis motmot (Little Chachalaca and Chestnut-headed Chachalaca).
• Penelope bridgesi and Penelope obscura (Dusky-legged and Yungas Guan).
• Crax fasciolata and Crax pinima (Bare-faced Curassow and Balem Curassow).

Odontophoridae

• Colinus leucopogon and Colinus cristatus (Crested Bobwhite and Spot-bellied Bobwhite).
• Cyrtonyx montezumae and Cyrtonyx sallei (Montezuma and Spot-breasted Quail).
• Canachites canadensis and Canachites franklinii (Spruce and Franklin’s Grouse).

Phasianidae

• Pternistis castaneicollis and Pternistis atrifrons (Chestnut-naped and Black-fronted Francolin).
• Xenoperdix obscuratus and Xenoperdix udzungwensis (Udzungwa and Rubeho Partridge).
• Arborophila diversa and Arborophila cambodiana (Chestnut-headed and Siamese Partridge).
• Tropicoperdix chloropus and Tropicoperdix tonkinensis (Green-legged and Tonkin Partridge).

Trochilidae

• Phaethornis griseogularis and Phaethornis porcullae (Grey-chinned and Poculla Hermit).
• Phaethornis bourcieri and Phaethornis major (Straight-billed and Ash-bellied Hermit).
• Phaethornis longirostris and Phaethornis baroni (Long-billed and Ecuadorian Hermit).
• Colibri cyanotus and Colibri thalassinus (Mexican and Green Violetear).
• Oreonympha nobilis and Oreonympha albolimbata (Eastern and Western Bearded Mountaineer).
• Eriocnemis luciani and Eriocnemis sapphiropygia (Sapphire-vented and Coppery-naped Puffleg).
• Coeligena torquata and Coeligena eisenmanni (Collared and Vilcabamba Inca).
• Coeligena violifer, Coeligena dichroura, Coeligena albicaudata and Coeligena osculans (Huanco, Apurimac, Cuzco and Violet-throated Starfrontlet).
• Ocreatus peruanus, Ocreatus underwoodii and Ocreatus addae (Peruvian, Rufous-booted and Booted Racket-tail).
• Heliodoxa schreibersii and Heliodoxa whitelyana (Black-throated and Black-breasted Brilliant).
• Lampornis cinereicauda and Lampornis castaneoventris (White-throated and Gray-tailed Mountain-gem).
• Riccordia elegans (Brace’s Emerald).
• Chlorostilbon melanorhynchus and Chlorostilbon mellisugus (Blue-tailed Emerald and Western Blue-tailed Emerald).
• Pampa pampa and Pampa curvipennis (Wedge-tailed and Curve-winged Sabrewing).
• Leucolia viridifrons and Leucolia wagneri (Green-fronted and Cinnamon-sided Hummingbird).
• Saucerottia hoffmanni and Saucerottia saucerottei (Steely-vented and Blue-vented Hummingbird).
• Chionomesa lactea and Chionomesa bartletti (Sapphire-spangled and Spot-vented Emerald).

Columbidae

• Patagioenas maculosa and Patagioenas albipennis (Spot-winged and White-winged Pigeon).
• Patagioenas fasciata and Patagioenas albilinea (Southern and Northern Band-tailed Pigeon).
• Spilopelia chinensis and Spilopelia suratensis (Eastern and Western Spotted Dove).
• Macropygia doreya and Macropygia amboinensis (Slender-billed and Sultan’s Cuckoo-dove).
• Macropygia emiliana, Macropygia cinnamomea and Macropygia modiglianii (Ruddy, Enggano and Barusan Cuckoo-dove).
• Leptotila battyi and Leptotila plumbeiceps (Gray-headed Dove and Azuero Dove).
• Pampusana beccarii and Pampusana johannae (Eastern and Western Bronze Ground Dove).
• Otidiphaps nobilis, Otidiphaps aruensis, Otidiphaps cervicalis and Otidiphaps insularis (White-naped, Green-naped, Grey-naped and Black-naped Pheasant Pigeon).
• Phapitreron leucotis, Phapitreron nigrorum and Phapitreron brevirostris (Buff-eared, White-eared Pigeon and Short-billed Pigeon).
• Phapitreron amethystinus, Phapitreron maculipectus and Phapitreron frontalis (Amethyst Brown, Grey-breasted and Cebu Dove).
• Treron calvus and Treron delalandii (African and Grey-breasted Green Pigeon).
• Treron permagnus and Treron formosae (Ryukyu and Taiwan Whistling Green-Pigeon).
• Ptilinopus fischeri and Ramphiculus meridionalis (Red-eared and Lompobattang Fruit Dove).
• Ptilinopus ornatus and Ptilinopus gestroi (Western and Eastern Ornate Fruit Dove).
• Ptilinopus superbus and Ptilinopus temminckii (Western and Eastern Superb Fruit Dove).
• Ptilinopus porphyraceus and Ptilinopus fasciatus (Tongan and Samoan Crimson-crowned Fruit Dove).
• Ducula basilica and Ducula obiensis (Cinnamon-bellied and Rusty Imperial Pigeon).
• Ducula pinon and Ducula salvadorii (Pinon's and Louisiade Imperial Pigeon).

Podicipedidae

• Tachybaptus tricolor and Tachybaptus ruficollis (Little Grebe and Tricolored Grebe).
• Podiceps occipitalis and Podiceps juninensis (Northern and Southern Silvery Grebe).

Oceanitidae

• Fregetta lineata (New Caledonian Storm Petrel).

Accipitridae

• Nisaetus kelaarti and Nisaetus nipalensis (Legge’s and Mountain Hawk-eagle).
• Accipiter hiogaster and Accipiter sylvestris (Variable and Lesser Sundas Goshawk).
• Accipiter striatus, Accipiter chionogaster, Accipiter ventralis and Accipiter erythronemius (Sharp-shinned, White-breasted, Plain-breasted and Rufous-thighed Hawk).
• Accipiter chilensis and Accipiter bicolor (Bicolored and Chilean Hawk).
• Milvus aegyptius and Milvus migrans (Black and Yellow-billed Kite).
• Buteo bannermani and Buteo buteo (Cape Verde and Common Buzzard).

Tytonidae

• Tyto tenebricosa and Tyto multipunctata (Greater and Lesser Sooty Owl).
• Tyto sororcula and Tyto almae (Seram and Moluccan Masked Owl).
• Tyto manusi and Tyto novaehollandiae (Australian and Manus Maked Owl).
• Tyto furcate, Tyto alba, Tyto glaucopsm Tyto javanica and Tyto deroepstorffi (American, Western, Ashy-faced, Eastern and Adaman Barn Owl).
• Ninox boobook, Ninox rotiensis, Ninox fusca, and Ninox plesseni (Southern Boobook, Rote, Timor, and Alor Boobook),
• Glaucidium capense and Glaucidium castaneum (African and Chestnut Barred Owlet).
• Glaucidium californicum, Glaucidium gnoma, Glaucidium hoskinsii and Glaucidium cobanense (Northern, Mountain, Baja and Guatemalan Pygmy-Owl).
• Otus madagascariensis and Otus rutilus (Torotoraka and Rainforest Madagascar Scops-Owl).
• Otus feae and Otus senegalensis (African and Annobon Scops-owl).
• Megascops vermiculatus, Megascops guatemalae, Megascops centralis and Megascops roraimae (Guatemalan, Vermiculated, Choco and Foothill Screech Owl).
• Megascops ingens and Megascops colombianus (Columbian and Rufescent Screech Owl).
• Strix mauritanica and Strix aluco (Tawny Owl and Maghreb Owl).
• Strix sartorii and Strix varia (Barred and Cinerous Owl).

Upupidae

• Upupa africana and Upupa epops (African and Eurasian Hoopoe).

Phoeniculidae

• Phoeniculus granti and Phoeniculus damarensis (Violet and Grant’s Woodhoopoe).

Alcedinidae

• Actenoides monachus and Actenoides capucinus (Blue-headed and Black-headed ‘Green-backed’ Kingfisher).
• Actenoides princeps and Actenoides regalis (Scaly-breasted and Plain-backed Kingfisher).
• Lacedo pulchella and Lacedo melanops (Banded and Black-faced Kingfisher).
• Todiramphus chloris, Todiramphus sordidus, Todiramphus colonus, Todiramphus albicilla, Todiramphus tristrami, and Todiramphus sacer (Collared, Torresian, Colonist, Mariana, Melanesian, and Pacific Kingfisher).
• Todiramphus venerates and Todiramphus youngi (Tahiti and Moorea “Society” Kingfisher).
• Todiramphus gertrudae and Todiramphus gambieri (Mangareva and Niau “Tuamotu” Kingfisher).
• Corythornis cristatus, Corythornis nais and Corythornis thomensis (Malachite, Principe and Sao Tome Kingfisher).
• Ceyx erithaca and Ceyx rufidorsa (Rufous-backed and Black-backed Oriental Dwarf Kingfisher).
• Ceyx melanurus and Ceyx mindanensis (Northern and Southern Philippine Dwarf Kingfisher).
• Ceyx cyanopectus and Ceyx nigrirostris (Southern and Northern Indigo-banded Kingfisher).

Galbulidae

• Galbula albirostris and Galbula chalcocephala (Cerise-crowned and Yellow-billed Jacamar).

Bucconidae

• Notharchus tectus and Notharchus subtectus (Lesser and Greater Pied Puffbird).
• Nystalus obamai and Nystalus striolatus (Eastern and Western Stiolated Puffbird).
• Nystalus striatipectus and Nystalus maculatus (Caatinga and Chaco “Spot-backed” Puffbird).
• Malacoptila striata and Malacoptila minor (Lesser and Greater Crescent-chested Puffbird).

Capitonidae

• Eubucco richardsoni and Eubucco aurantiicollis (Flame-throated and Lemon-throated Barbet).
• Eubucco versicolor, Eubucco steerii and Eubucco glaucogularis (Blue-cowled, Blue-chinned and Blue-moustached “Versicolored” Barbet).

Pipridae

• Corapipo altera and Corapipo leucorrhoa (White-ruffed and White-bibbed Manakin).
• Lepidothrix velutina and Lepidothrix coronate (Velvety and Blue-crowned Manakin).

Acanthizidae

• Sericornis maculatus and Sericornis frontalis (White-browed and Spotted Scrubwren).
• Sericornis virgatus and Sericornis nouhuysi (Perplexing and Large Scrubwren).

Platysteiridae

• Batis mixta and Batis reichenowi (Forest and Reichenow’s “Short-tailed” Batis).
• Platysteira concreta and Platysteira ansorgei (Rufous-bellied and Yellow-bellied Wattle-eye).
• Laniarius willardi and Laniarius poensis (Willard’s and Mountain Sooty Boubou).
• Laniarius major and Laniarius aethiopicus (Tropical and Ethiopian Boubou).

Laniidae

• Lanius humeralis and Lanius collaris (Northern and Southern Common Fiscal).

Vireonidae

• Vireolanius leucotis and Vireolanius mikettae (Pale-legged and Slaty-capped Shrike-Vireo).
• Vireo approximans and Vireo pallens (Mangrove and Providencia Vireo).
• Hylophilus thoracicus and Hylophilus griseiventris (Lemon-chested and Rio de Janeiro Greenlet).
• Hylophilus flavipes. Hylophilus viridiflavus and Hylophilus insularis (Yellow-green, Scrub and Tobago Greenlet).
• Tunchiornis ochraceiceps and Tunchiornis luteifrons (Rufous-fronted and Tawny-crowned Greenlet).
• Pteruthius intermedius and Pteruthius aenobarbus (Trilling and Clicking “Chestnut-fronted” Shrike-babbler).

Hylocitreidae

• Hylocitrea bonensis and Hylocitrea bonthaina (Northern and Southern Hylocitrea).

Alaudidae

• Chersomanes beesleyi and Chersomanes albofasciata (Beesley’s and Spike-heeled Lark).
• Certhilauda benguelensis and Certhilauda subcoronata (Karoo and Benguela Long-billed Lark).
• Certhilauda brevirostris and Certhilauda curvirostris (Agulhas and Cape Long-billed Lark).
• Calendulauda alopex and Calendulauda africanoides (Foxy and Fawn-coloured Lark).
• Calendulauda barlowi and Calendulauda erythrochlamys (Barlow’s and Dune Lark).
• Mirafra ashi and Mirafra somalica (Ash’s and Somali Lark).
• Galerida macrorhyncha and Galerida cristata (Crested and Maghreb Lark).
• Alaudala athensis and Alaudala somalica (Somali and Athi Short-toed Lark).

Macrosphenidae

• Sylvietta brachyura and Sylvietta leucopsis (Northern and Eastern Crombec).
• Sylvietta leucophrys and Sylvietta chapini (Lendu and White-browed Crombec).

Phylloscopidae

• Phylloscopus collybita and Phylloscopus tristis (Common and Siberian Chiffchaff).
• Phylloscopus grammiceps and Phylloscopus sumatrensis (Sumatran and Javan Sunda Warbler).
• Phylloscopus nigrorum and Phylloscopus trivirgatus (Mountain and Negros Leaf Warbler).
• Phylloscopus presbytes and Phylloscopus floresianus (Flores and Timor Leaf Warbler).
• Phylloscopus makirensis and Phylloscopus poliocephalus (Makira and Island Leaf Warbler).

Acrocephalidae

• Nesillas longicaudata and Nesillas typica (Madagascar and Anjouan Brush-warbler).
• Calamonastides gracilirostris and Calamonastides bensoni (Papyrus and Zambian Yellow Warbler).

Locustellidae

• Locustella idonea and Locustella mandelli (Dalat and Russet Grasshopper-warbler).
• Poodytes punctatus cand Poodytes caudatus (Snare’s and New Zealand Fernbird).

Cisticolidae

• Neomixis striatigula and Neomixis pallidior (Stripe-throated and Subdesert Jery).
• Cisticola emini and Cisticola aberrans (Rock-loving and Huambo Cisticola).
• Cisticola distinctus and Cisticola lais (Lynes’s and Wailing Cisticola).
• Prinia striata and Prinia crinigera (Himalayan and Striated Prinia).
• Prinia cooki, Prinia polychroa and Prinia rocki (Brown, Burmese and Annam Prinia).
• Prinia lepida and Prinia gracilis (Graceful and Delicate Prinia).
• Prinia flaviventris and Prinia sonitans (Chinese and Yellow-bellied Prinia).
• Prinia melanops and Prinia bairdii (Black-faced and Banded Prinia).
• Apalis flavocincta and Apalis flavida (Brown-tailed and Yellow-breasted Apalis).
• Camaroptera brevicaudata and Camaroptera brachyura (Green-backed and Grey-backed Camaroptera).
• Camaroptera chloronota and Camaroptera toroensis (Olive-green and Tawny-breasted Camaroptera).
• Scepomycter rubehoensis and Scepomycter winifredae (Winifred’s and Rubeho Warbler).
• Artisornis moreaui and Artisornis sousae (Long-billed and Mozambique Forest Warbler).
• Eremomela salvadorii and Eremomela icteropygialis (Yellow-bellied and Salvadori’s Eremomela).

Sylviidae

• Curruca minula, Curruca curruca and Curruca althaea (Desert, Lesser and Hume’s Whitethroat).
• Curruca iberiae and Curruca cantillans (Western and Eastern Subalpine Warbler).

Paradoxornithidae

• Sinosuthora brunnea and Suthora ricketti (Brown-winged and Yunnan Parrotbill).

Timaliidae

• Cyanoderma ambiguum and Cyanoderma rufifrons (Buff-chested and Rufous-fronted Babbler).
• Pomatorhinus bornensis and Pomatorhinus montanus (Sunda and Javan “Chestnut-backed” Scimitar-babbler).

Alcippeidae

• Alcippe davidi, Alcippe hueti, Alcippe morrisonia and Alcippe fratercula (Grey-cheeked Fulvetta, David's, Huet’s and Morrison's Fulvetta).

Sturnidae

• Aplonis circumscripta and Aplonis metallica (Metallic and Violet-hooded Starling).
• Streptocitta albicollis and Streptocitta torquate (Northern and Southern “White-necked” Myna).
• Gracula robusta, Gracula enganensis and Gracula religiosa (Common, Nias and Enggano Hill Myna).
• Sturnia blythii and Sturnia malabarica (Chestnut-tailed and Malabar Starling).
• Lamprotornis elisabeth and Lamprotornis chloropterus (Lesser and Miombo Blue-eared Starling).
• Lamprotornis benguelensis, Lamprotornis violacior and Lamprotornis mevesii (Benguela, Cunene and Meves’s Starling).

Muscicapidae

• Copsychus albospecularis and Copsychus pica (Madagascar and Pelzeln’s Magpie-Robin).
• Copsychus stricklandii and Copsychus malabaricus (White-crowned and White-rumped Shama).
• Muscicapa tyrrhenica and Muscicapa striata (Mediterranean and Spotted Flycatcher).
• Muscicapa dauurica, Muscicapa sodhii and Muscicapa williamsoni (Asian Brown, Sulawesi and Brown-streaked Flycatcher).
• Muscicapa itombwensis and Fraseria lendu (Chapin's and Itombwe Flycatcher).
• Cyornis kalaoensis and Cyornis djampeanus (Tanahjampea and Kalao Blue-flycatcher).
• Cyornis ruficrissa, Cyornis ruficauda and Cyornis ocularis (Crocker, Philippine and Sulu “Rufous-tailed” Jungle-Flycatcher).
• Cyornis pelingensis and Cyornis colonus (Henna-tailed and Sula Jungle-flycatcher).
• Eumyias indigo and Eumyias ruficrissa (Rufous-vented and Indigo Flycatcher).
• Cossypha anomala and Cossypha macclounii (Rusty-flanked and Olive-flanked Ground Robin).
• Stiphrornis erythrothorax, Stiphrornis pyrrholaemus and Stiphrornis mabirae (Olive-backed, Orange-breasted and Yellow-breasted Forest Robin).
• Heinrichia calligyna and Heinrichia simplex (Minahasa and Great Shortwing).
• Myiomela leucura and Myiomela cambodiana (White-tailed and Cambodian Robin).
• Enicurus borneensis and Enicurus leschenaulti (Bornean and White-crowned Forktail).
• Ficedula speculigera and Ficedula hypoleuca (Atlas and European Pied Flycatcher).
• Saxicola rubicola, Saxicola maurus, Saxicola stejnegeri and Saxicola torquatus (European, African, Madagascar, Amur and Siberian Stonechat).
• Thamnolaea coronata and Thamnolaea cinnamomeiventris (White-crowned and Mocking Cliff-Chat).
• Myrmecocichla collaris and Myrmecocichla arnotti (Ruaha and Arnot's Chat).
• Oenanthe hispanica and Oenanthe melanoleuca (Western and Eastern Black-eared Wheatear).
• Oenanthe halophila, Oenanthe lugens and Oenanthe warriae (Maghreb, Morning and Basalt Wheatear).

Ploceidae

• Ploceus katangae and Ploceus upembae (Katanga and Upemba Weaver).
• Anaplectes rubriceps and Anaplectes leuconotos (Northern and Southern Red-headed Weaver).
• Foudia eminentissima and Foudia consobrina (Grand Comoro and Red-headed Fody).

 

[Jon.Bryant]

Suppose they split Red-shafted and Yellow-shafted Flicker. There isn't a neat line dividing the two forms, for a start, and there are other complications which could get in the way.

Surely the safe bet would be to change the database to "Red or Yellow-shafted Flicker"and not to even try to second guess. In my own diary I have had begrudgingly loose a tick of two and adopt this approach - i.e. when years ago they split Golden-spectacled Warbler - It is not very satisfactory to tick something on the fact that it was probably a certain species, as it is the commonest species wintering at that location. I would be a bit upset if the Admin at EBird were making this type of decision on my behalf - I presume they may well be, but to be honest I am not a huge EBird user so It is not that important to me.

I suspect the most accurate approach would be to group the species, but let end users amend the records, if they were convinced of the actual ID.

Perhaps a bit more draconian, but you could force referential integrity - so you have to select "Red-Shafted" or "Yellow-Shafted Flicker", but you cannot submit Yellow-shafted Flicker (Unassigned). This won't resolve old records, but at least it would force the proper way going forward. This strict rule could be implemented as soon as the change was recognized (and before it was formally published) - as we have established above, this could easily save a year of so of data headache. If strict input was forced as soon as the split was mooted, then there would be even greater benefit in untangling the database, as probably several year's or data would be 'already sorted'. It would also make Birdwatcher's concentrate a little more on what they were seeing and having to input, so we would get a better view going forward of say "Red-shafted" and "Yellow-shafted Flicker distribution (perhaps enabling someone to disentangle whether they prefer certain habitat, elevation etc. not apparent from the mixed data)

 

[njlarsen]

Where two species overlaps Ebird frequently assigns something similar to "Red or Yellow-shafted Flicker". But someone still has to figure out where geographically this is preferable over assigning one or the other of the new species. If in the US, this assignment often takes place at a county by county basis.
Niels

 

[Mysticete]

also both flicker forms are separate groups, so you can assign them to an appropriate group if you want when you enter. That way when a split does/may happen, they will automatically get put in the right subspecies. I do this for all flickers I get a good look at (same as I do with Yellow-rumped Warblers, Fox Sparrows, and Juncos)

 

[Jon.Bryant]

also both flicker forms are separate groups, so you can assign them to an appropriate group if you want when you enter. That way when a split does/may happen, they will automatically get put in the right subspecies. I do this for all flickers I get a good look at (same as I do with Yellow-rumped Warblers, Fox Sparrows, and Juncos)

Yes. I was just suggesting that people (like me) are sometimes a bit lazy and pick Whimbrel instead of Whimbrel (Eurasian) for example. If the EBird input system made group use the lazy option and non-group entry more time consuming or difficult, it would nudge us all to better record what we see [and this could help with later possible splits]. I think my previous comment about enforcing group use would not work, as there are sometimes when we can only record to the larger species level.

 

[Melanie]

Interesting that the Subantarctic Rayadito does not fulfill the criteria of a full species.

 

[Mysticete]

Interesting that the Subantarctic Rayadito does not fulfill the criteria of a full species.

They are almost certainly waiting for SACC to vote for it. That's usually the case.

 

[Melanie]

They are almost certainly waiting for SACC to vote for it. That's usually the case.

As with the Ibera seadeater this could last rather long.

 

[Paul Clapham]

Surely the safe bet would be to change the database to "Red or Yellow-shafted Flicker"and not to even try to second guess. In my own diary I have had begrudgingly loose a tick of two and adopt this approach - i.e. when years ago they split Golden-spectacled Warbler - It is not very satisfactory to tick something on the fact that it was probably a certain species, as it is the commonest species wintering at that location. I would be a bit upset if the Admin at EBird were making this type of decision on my behalf - I presume they may well be, but to be honest I am not a huge EBird user so It is not that important to me.

I suspect the most accurate approach would be to group the species, but let end users amend the records, if they were convinced of the actual ID.

I have over 700 "Northern Flicker" sightings in eBird so far. The vast majority of them are Red-shafted, since I live in a solidly Red-shafted area. At least I assume they are, since many of them are heard-only. I wouldn't be happy to be invited to go into eBird and amend all of them to be Red-shafted. Or worse, to try and remember which of them I had seen.

Likewise I was happy when eBird fixed all of my South American Snipe records when they split it. When I saw and recorded them I didn't know there was a split being considered. And when I read eBird's notes which said that the two split species are similar-looking and can be confused in migration I would found it difficult to decide whether to choose the split species or not.

But in the end it's eBird's data, not mine. It's used for scientific purposes so I think they would naturally prefer the data to refer to species rather than species groups wherever possible.

 

[Jon.Bryant]

Following dialogue with BirdLife, I understand that the process to update their lists is likely to be slower than Clements and IOC, as they need to update SIS, the data system that sits behind the Red List, and that this update only takes place once a year. In the correspondence it was implied that there could be a long lag between deciding on a change and that change being visible to the world. This is pretty similar to the statement on the WGAC website, which also states that changes to BirdLife's list would be implemented more slowly.

Therefore, my early comment on evidence of convergence towards BirdLife's list is very probably wrong. It would seem simply the case that (some/most?) of the changes 'towards' BirdLife's stance have been implemented relatively quickly by IOC and Clements; whereas changes 'away' from BirdLife's stance will take more time to be implemented by BirdLife.