Magnesium or Polycarbonate? (2 Viewers)

[Barbican1987]

Modern binoculars invariably seem to have the body made of Magnesium alloys or plastic, i .e. Polycarbonate.

Magnesium alloy bodies always tend to be heavier than polycarbonate, which is an advantage if you are viewing something for a long period. So why aren't all binoculars made from polycarbonate, is it something to do with the thermal expansion and contraction and/or the durability of the body and the stability of the prisms and lenses.
I am sure there is someone is highly knowledgeable about this aspect who could enlighten me please.

 

[Hermann]

Well, Zeiss used re-enforced polycarbonate in their original Victory binoculars and in the FL series. These were IMO among the toughest binoculars on the market. They switched back to metal because some ill-informed (but very vocal!) users didn't like "plastic binoculars".

In other words: A well-designed and well-made body made from re-enforced polycarbonate is IMO tougher than any body made from aluminium or magnesium alloy.

Hermann

 

[pat mitchel]

Polycarbonate or Magnesium?

Any preferences for either polycarbonate or magnesium binos?

www.birdforum.net

https://www.cloudynights.com/topic/101432-magnesium-vs-polycarbonate-vs-carbonfiber-which/

 

[Pinewood]

Well, Zeiss used re-enforced polycarbonate in their original Victory binoculars and in the FL series. These were IMO among the toughest binoculars on the market. They switched back to metal because some ill-informed (but very vocal!) users didn't like "plastic binoculars".

In other words: A well-designed and well-made body made from re-enforced polycarbonate is IMO tougher than any body made from aluminium or magnesium alloy.

Hermann

Hello Hermann,

I surely enjoyed my 8x32FL with its reenforced polycarbonate body for seventeen years. When it comes to durability
this video is surely impressive.

Happy bird watching,
Arthur

 

[wllmspd]

Polymers are normally injection molded and note so easy to machine to give fine features and threads etc. obviously zeiss have nailed the recipe. The conquest is hard as nails, but I think it’s a metal body(?), covered with decent rubber armour.

Peter

 

[PYRTLE]

I left my early 8 x 32 FLs on the roof of my car, they came off after c.7 miles and when I was travelling around 60 mph..... bouncing a few times in my rear view mirror. Retrieved them - some light scuffing on the rubber armouring but that was all. No regassing, collimation or loose elements needed and still going strong.
My SFs also feel just as strong

 

[Scott98]

Speaking for myself, I've never liked the feel of plastic in my hands. It might be durable but it doesn't feel that way. I'll take metal over plastic any day. Zeiss SFL's are light, I doubt there is any polymer-body binocular lighter than them in the 30mm and 40mm sizes.

 

[Conndomat]

Speaking for myself, I've never liked the feel of plastic in my hands.

I've never had the feeling that I have "plastic" in my hands when I use the Zeiss FL 10x56.

On the contrary, the material feels very high quality to me and the many positive user experiences over many years confirm this!

I would prefer an NL/EL in the housing of an FL ten times as it would save me the unspeakable discussion about rubber falling off.

It's a shame that Zeiss was influenced by ignorant user opinions, a comeback would be welcome.

Andreas

 

[MiddleRiver]

It's not a deal-breaker but the benefits of poly in very cold wx are notable and significant (for me).

 

[PYRTLE]

Speaking for myself, I've never liked the feel of plastic in my hands.

 

[dries1]

Endurance test of 8x42 binoculars - Introduction - AllBinos.com

The best binocular tests on the net. The comprehensive database of binoculars with their parameters and users opinions. Interesting articles and comparisons.

www.allbinos.com

 

[Patudo]

There's plastic and then there's plastic. The material used in Zeiss FLs was IIRC fibre (glass) reinforced polyamide (nylon). This, if what I remember from various comments here is correct, had to be machined, or metal parts fitted in order for the kind of precision fit needed for optics (particularly roof prism binoculars) - which could not be achieved by casting or other types of forming. If I remember rightly, the need for machining, and the very small amount of weight savings achieved by the use of plastic - as a lot of weight in binoculars comes from glass - were additional reasons for Zeiss to go back to a metal body besides what seems to have been negative perception of "plastic" binoculars by the consumer.

I think the FL series had armouring too - it wasn't one piece. See this (ahem) memorable thread: Zeiss Victory 10x42 T* FL Rubber Armouring

Polycarbonate is the stuff used in plastic lenses for spectacles/glasses and various other applications. I think this is the stuff used by Steiner (Makrolon). I don't know much about its properties or how good (or otherwise) it is in binoculars - maybe someone else will weigh in. One would think that the right formulation of polycarbonate, used in the right design, would be fine.

 

[wllmspd]

I’ve seen several pairs of Swarovski bounce off hide floors before with no effect. It’s nice to know that with some models you don’t need to panic if you do drop them, but it’s not something I ever try to risk.

Peter

 

[PW42]

I once drove over my Leica 8x20 BC on a gravel surface. Apart from a small dent in the bridge caused by the gravel otherwise undamaged and perfectly usable. Not only that but Leica repaired the dent by replacing the bridge foc although they were told the circumstances. Impressive on two counts!

 

[Scott98]

I've never had the feeling that I have "plastic" in my hands when I use the Zeiss FL 10x56.

On the contrary, the material feels very high quality to me and the many positive user experiences over many years confirm this!

I would prefer an NL/EL in the housing of an FL ten times as it would save me the unspeakable discussion about rubber falling off.

It's a shame that Zeiss was influenced by ignorant user opinions, a comeback would be welcome.

Andreas

It's just a personal preference for the feel of metal and glass in everything instead of plastic. I've tried the FL's and also owned a couple different pairs of Steiners w/ polymer body. I didn't care for them but others do. Zeiss made the longer-body SF's for only 25 grams heavier than the FL's so it's light enough for me.

Some optics today even have plastic lenses.

 

[Binastro]

Plastic lenses have been around for decades.

The ones for photocopiers have very strange bright coating colours.

Following on from the glass solid Cat 600m f/8 lens designed in the 1960s by the designer from Argentina (Reyes?) who worked for Perkin Elmer and the lenses later made by Vivitar, a 450mm f/4.5 plastic solid Cat was made.
But few exist as the quality could not be maintained.

Nowadays there is a vast array of high quality plastic lenses, but glass is preferred for the consumer market.

There are cheap toy telescopes and Galilean binoculars made with plastic lenses, but usually rather poor quality, although some are reasonably good.
Some of the telescopes have single element objectives with a very small mask hole just behind the objective.
25mm scopes are actually 10mm aperture.

Regards,
B.

 

[Patudo]

How many of us could actually tell the FLs were plastic if Zeiss hadn't told us so?

 

[Prestdj]

meostars are aluminum which makes them heavy, nearly a kilo but feel robust

 

[wllmspd]

… maybe zeiss needs to make some more “extreme abuse” videos of other models, to show that the lighter models are still perfectly robust.

Peter

 

[Hermann]

Polycarbonate is the stuff used in plastic lenses for spectacles/glasses and various other applications. I think this is the stuff used by Steiner (Makrolon). I don't know much about its properties or how good (or otherwise) it is in binoculars - maybe someone else will weigh in. One would think that the right formulation of polycarbonate, used in the right design, would be fine.

This is from memory and may not be quite correct: Many years ago Steiner won a government contract to supply new binoculars to the then West Germany army. Makrolon. A few years later they were phased out because they proved too unreliable for the military and virtually impossible to repair. They were replaced by the Hensoldt Fero-D series. The Fero-D are tough as nails.

Hermann