New Zeiss Victory SF !!!!!! (23 Viewers)

[Swedpat]

Today I compared Conquest HD 8x42 to Victory HT 8x42. I perceived Victory HT as a tad sharper. But indoors the warehouse I had hard to notice a difference in brightness, if so very slight. Not a surprise Victory HT seemed to be very slightly better(and I needed to compare pretty carefully to notice it): that's the kind of difference you can expect from twice an expensive binocular in the higher grades. I didn't compare them very long time but the edge performance seemed to be pretty similar.

What a difference is to expect between Victory HT and SF? I understand that SF has better edge performance, and that on the expense of light transmission because of a more complex ocular design. But is SF as sharp on-axis as HT? It's common that better edge performance use to come on the expense of the on-axis sharpness, therefore I wonder.

 

[bh46118]

What do you mean, I said detailed. :king:

bh, you will get one from me as soon as I can get my paws on both SF and SV:king: Looks like this will be in January now.

Not sure about the concise bit though. Which do you want? Thorough or concise?

Lee

 

[bh46118]

Will it be an impartial review.:-O

bh, you will get one from me as soon as I can get my paws on both SF and SV:king:
Lee

 

[james holdsworth]

Not exactly on topic but maybe relevant to the discussion...........

I spent the day birding with a friend and swapped back and forth between the HT and his 8.5 SV.

The HT appeared sharper, more contrasty with a more lively / dynamic [transparent] centre-field view, whiter whites and less CA. The SV had sharper edges.

I suspect the SF will be hard-pressed to better the HT in the centre-field. No doubt the field is wider and the edges will be sharper but will the quality of view actually improve?

 

[Swedpat]

Not exactly on topic but maybe relevant to the discussion...........

I spent the day birding with a friend and swapped back and forth between the HT and his 8.5 SV.

The HT appeared sharper, more contrasty with a more lively / dynamic [transparent] centre-field view, whiter whites and less CA. The SV had sharper edges.

I suspect the SF will be hard-pressed to better the HT in the centre-field. No doubt the field is wider and the edges will be sharper but will the quality of view actually improve?

If the image is sharp to the edges may be nice. Mostly I think it's not very important, however. I can enjoy the sharp image of high quality binoculars and if 10-15% of the outer part isn't fully sharp I usually not notice it if I don't look for it.
Therefore the question is justified: is it worth to sacrifice brightness, contrast and sharpness in the center of the field for getting sharp to the edges image?
Maybe for some purposes but I guess not for all.

 

[stereotruckdriver]

Not exactly on topic but maybe relevant to the discussion...........

I spent the day birding with a friend and swapped back and forth between the HT and his 8.5 SV.

The HT appeared sharper, more contrasty with a more lively / dynamic [transparent] centre-field view, whiter whites and less CA. The SV had sharper edges.

I suspect the SF will be hard-pressed to better the HT in the centre-field. No doubt the field is wider and the edges will be sharper but will the quality of view actually improve?

I call BS on this statement.

Though I don't have much time behind the 8.5 sv i do with the 8x32 and 10x50 sv along with direct comparison to 4 ht's.

This doesn't jive and one of the ht's is owned by my neighbor, he would agree this is bs.

Bryce...

 

[NDhunter]

Not exactly on topic but maybe relevant to the discussion...........

I spent the day birding with a friend and swapped back and forth between the HT and his 8.5 SV.

The HT appeared sharper, more contrasty with a more lively / dynamic [transparent] centre-field view, whiter whites and less CA. The SV had sharper edges.

I suspect the SF will be hard-pressed to better the HT in the centre-field. No doubt the field is wider and the edges will be sharper but will the quality of view actually improve?

James:

Your comparison today may be important to you, as the Zeiss SF is a clone of the Swarovision, with similar optics and a view without distortion close to the edge.

I suspect that all of the optics mentioned are very good, and so then it
is left up to the user to choose which they prefer.

I have been using my 8.5x42 Swarovision for well over 3 years, and I
like the binocular in every way. I am one that has no desire to change
as I have not seen any reason to do so.

Jerry

 

[Chosun Juan]

Not exactly on topic but maybe relevant to the discussion...........

I spent the day birding with a friend and swapped back and forth between the HT and his 8.5 SV.

The HT appeared sharper, more contrasty with a more lively / dynamic [transparent] centre-field view, whiter whites and less CA. The SV had sharper edges.

I suspect the SF will be hard-pressed to better the HT in the centre-field. No doubt the field is wider and the edges will be sharper but will the quality of view actually improve?

I call BS on this statement.

Though I don't have much time behind the 8.5 sv i do with the 8x32 and 10x50 sv along with direct comparison to 4 ht's.

This doesn't jive and one of the ht's is owned by my neighbor, he would agree this is bs.

Bryce...

Without refuting what anybody sees with their own eyes, I'm gonna lob somewhere in the middle on this one ...... :cat:

I think the SV has a wonderful, colourful view, and the 10x50SV gets close to the HT, but I think the HT has it for "clarity" / "transparency". It has that je ne sais quoi .... so I can see where James gets the 'lively' comment from. For colour rendition, resolution, sharpness, contrast, etc -- I think it's pretty much a wash .....

Like Jerry, I think the SF will have a hard time significantly improving on the SV, and I doubt there would be too many rushing out to swap --- save for the pixel peeper types. Most likely, customers will come from those new to the Alpha ranks + Bruce !

Also. It is interesting to look at the photos Jan posted a while ago of the Alphas all sitting on a shelf ..... if you line the eyepiece ends up, then the position of the SF focus wheel is near as dammit to the HT's (about a 1/4 of the length of the wheel in it), whereas the SV is fully an entire focus wheel length back toward the eyepiece. It's gonna have to be some fancy weight distribution on the SF to compensate for that shoulder overloading hands forward focus position on the HT. I won't call BS, but I'm calling 80% smoke and mirrors on the SF ergonomics hub-bub ........ :smoke:

The SF may get a slight re-grade when I funally get my hands on one ........


Chosun :gh:

 

[bh46118]

From what I'm hearing, it's probably gona be - Bruce ! That, and I've got my eyeballs focused on a $2300 tube amp at the present time. :eek!::-O

+ Bruce !
Chosun :gh:

 

[Tyrolean]

New binoculars seem to raise a lot of interest! I enjoy reading all the comments and comparisons here, but for me it is out of the question to pay 2500 €uro since I already paid some 2000 for my SV 8,5. In my comparisons I always found that the 0,5 times more magnification made more difference to what I saw than you would expect. And otherwise there is not really anything to complain about the SV so that a new one would not be a remarkable improvement. But for those considering their first top of the notch glass there is certainly more choice now ...

 

[Troubador]

What do you mean, I said detailed. :king:

No you didn't you sly varmint. What you originally posted was cunningly captured in the quote appended to my post :smoke:

Get out of that :king:

Lee

 

[Troubador]

Will it be an impartial review.:-O

I hope so bh. See my review of Conquest 15x56 and SLC 15x56 where I hope I did justice to both models.

Lee

 

[dalat]

I won't call BS, but I'm calling 80% smoke and mirrors on the SF ergonomics hub-bub ........

Though from all those reports from people who have had the SF in hands, the one issue where they all agree is in praising the ergonomics....

 

[Troubador]

James:

Your comparison today may be important to you, as the Zeiss SF is a clone of the Swarovision, with similar optics and a view without distortion close to the edge.

I suspect that all of the optics mentioned are very good, and so then it
is left up to the user to choose which they prefer.

I have been using my 8.5x42 Swarovision for well over 3 years, and I
like the binocular in every way. I am one that has no desire to change
as I have not seen any reason to do so.

Jerry

Well said Jerry, apart from that bit about the SF optics being similar to the SVs. They aren't, but in the end its the view that matters not how the view is obtained.

Lee

 

[Troubador]

Though from all those reports from people who have had the SF in hands, the one issue where they all agree is in parising the ergonomics....

Dalat, Chosen and others

A few days before the British Bird Fair, I met up with Gerold Dobler (leader of the SF design team) at a nature reserve near Doncaster, UK.

We spent some time at the reception desk organising a meeting room for later in the day and while doing this, the young man on reception who was responsible for buying the binoculars the reserve has on sale, asked to try out the SFs we were carrying. He hadn't heard of the new SFs before but was drawn to notice them because of their striking appearance.

Of course we handed over our SFs, one 8x and one 10x.

Without any prompting from us his reaction on lifting them up was for an expression of surprise and delight to spread across his face as he declared how light they are.

Many weeks later, at the Federsee in South Germany, some bird photographers also asked to try out the SFs, again their noticing them was down to the grey colour. They hadn't heard of the SFs before but again when they tried them out their very first reaction was to smile and comment on how light they felt.

Now the SFs are a bit lighter than SVs but the cunning bit is in the weight distribution which really does make them feel lighter than they actually are.

Anyone who thinks that the stuff about shifting the weight around is just marketing BS should just pick up a pair and try them out.

Lee

 

[Gijs van Ginkel]

Lee, post 1715,
You are very right, the actual weight difference beteen the SF and the SV is not a lot, but because of the balance and weight distribution of the SF it "feels"lighter and that is immediately obvious when you take an SF in your hands.
This said, I wish all readers and contributors to Birdforum a Merry Christmas and Happy Ne Year.
Gijs

 

[Troubador]

Merry Christmas Gijs :king:

Lee

 

[Chosun Juan]

...... Anyone who thinks that the stuff about shifting the weight around is just marketing BS should just pick up a pair and try them out.

Lee

Splendid idea Lee !

Could you kindly arrange one of those all expenses paid 5 day 5 star junkets, taking in the sights of Bavaria and the Alps, a cruise down the Rhine, and a stroll along the Champs Elysees etc !! I'd like to see Goldens hunting Roe deer, and White tailed Eagles, Northern Goshawks, Pallid Harriers, and of course Eagle Owls. Better chuck in Rainbow BeeEaters so that I can check colour rendition, and Wolverine and Lynx :cat: just so that I don't get bored ....... 3

Given that the SF focus wheel position is near as dammit in the same spot as the HT, and is only an ounce or so lighter, I don't have great expectations that there will be enough magic to reverse my dislike of the HT hands forward position (actually I don't mind it, it's just my shoulders that doth protest too much ! ...... However with sufficient pampering they may be persuaded to temporarily forget so I can give a glowing report ! B

As an experiment I moved my hands an inch and a half forward on my Zen ED3's and the weight shifted back so dramatically that they nearly fell out of my hands backwards and on to my toes ! :eek!: ..... of course the excessive load on my shoulders felt just like the HT's --- only 1&3/4 ounces lighter ...................... :smoke:



Chosun :gh:

 

[Troubador]

Splendid idea Lee !

Could you kindly arrange one of those all expenses paid 5 day 5 star junkets, taking in the sights of Bavaria and the Alps, a cruise down the Rhine, and a stroll along the Champs Elysees etc !!

As an experiment I moved my hands an inch and a half forward on my Zen ED3's and the weight shifted back so dramatically that they nearly fell out of my hands backwards and on to my toes ! :eek!: ..... of course the excessive load on my shoulders felt just like the HT's --- only 1&3/4 ounces lighter ...................... :smoke:

Chosun :gh:

Splendid to hear from you Chosun and a warm Merry Christmas from these northern climes.

Your round Europe tour sounds great although I wouldn't bother with Paris. They haven't finished the Eiffel Tower yet, it's still only scaffolding after all this time :-O (just kidding, all you Parisennes).

I'm worried about your shoulders though. Are they in the right place?

I have tried to provoke the shoulder complaints that you describe with my own bins and can get discomfort in my forearms and wrists if I try hard enough but not shoulders. Sounds like some of your shoulder and arm muscles aren't activated so I recommend appropriate physiotherapy and some pilates.

Meanwhile SFs are arriving all over the place now, albeit in modest numbers, so lets hope they arrive at a billabong near you sometime in the new year so you can do some weight training with them. :smoke:

In the meantime : :eat: B and be :-O

:kiss:

Lee

 

[HighNorth]

There is a danger getting an SF... :smoke:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iz-8CSa9xj8&list=RDIz-8CSa9xj8&index=1

He looks more like a typical swaro-owner to me! :-O