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New Zeiss Victory SF !!!!!! (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Chosun Juan
- Start date
jan van daalen
Well-known member
Join the not-native Club, and get used to it
!!Brock adds to may words in a sentence and Lee likes them short:eat:
Jan
Hi K
Λυπούμαστε!
CJ = Chosun Juan, a delightful lady from Australia who posts here
RB = Rolling Ball, a kind of distortion some people see when they pan certain models of binoculars
SLC = A line of binoculars made by Swaroviski, it is not clear what the initials stand for
EL SV = A line of binoculars made by Swaroviski. The meaning of EL is not clear but SV stands for Swarovision, an optical concept that Swaroviski employs in its EL models.
Kατανοήσουν?
Lee
jan van daalen
Well-known member
K.....
CJ: who's name is not to be mentioned.
RB: Real Bullocks; only one man in this universum has not seen it by himself but is writing about it like everybody sees it.
SLC: Stossfast, Leicht und Compact. Follow up of the SL, a Porro design.
EL: Extra luxuary.
LEE: brother of CJ and ET.
ET: Alien.
Jan: unknown
brocknroller
porromaniac
Quote: Brock .......
For the love of God Brock ! :storm: why the heck did ya hafta go an spoil it all?! :h?:
I just gave you a good rap before for a halfway logical post, and then you go and ruin it with a post that makes about as much sense as a duck with antlers !! |:S|
Your insights on front wheel drive cars are astounding - I've only just picked myself up off the floor! |^| |
We can all just thank the heavens above that you're not an Automotive Engineer ! :king: :t:
I think that most of those who have never heard of someone leaving the front door before should be okay .... natural curiosity and the need to survive and thrive may overcome any reluctance in all but the most agoraphobic ! ...... *shakes head in mock despondence smilie*
Jabali raises a good point about the Swaro 15x 56 SLC. It seems that the usually wider apparent fields of the higher mags allow them to get away with less pincushion distortion for a given 'RB' affect on an individual. It is important to try a bin in person though, since as valuable as Holger's distortion work is - the 'k' / 'l' values are only part of the story as I said in my earlier post. Perhaps Lee will chime in with his recollections of the 15x comparo that he did .....
"Naturally" I think Swaro paid not one jot of attention to your copious posts (or else they would have redesigned the dodgy focusers too - they probably did something crazy - like oh, I dunno, go off customer and dealer feedback to decide if it was an issue or not
Zeiss however seems to have gone to school for nix on Holger's work and our contributions to give birth to the "Golden Child" SF. For that, we should all be handsomely rewarded - I'd suggest a 67% discount for all regular BF bino forum members ..... it's the least they could do !
Chosun :gh:
You had so many smilies in your post that the BF server wouldn't let me post my reply since I had one smilie in mine and that put me over the limit! I'll delete one of yours.
So you didn't understand what I wrote above, but did understand what Bruce was implying with his OP even though others didn't understand him? I guess we must be tuned to different frequencies or it's that reverse Coriolis Effect in the Southern Hemisphere.
Other than me responding to two points in Jerry's post by using an auto industry analogy to suggest why companies address issues that affect only a minority of customers and showing how many professionals routinely use data provided by others to make their analyses, I don't see any radical departure from my previous post, so I'm not sure where the "duck with antlers" came in, but I do thank you for praising my "reform" from a crusader to persuader.
I've already explained why I felt a need for a crusade, so I won't repeat that, but evidence for RB and what causes it is so overwhelming at this point, both anecdotally and scientifically, that when someone denies it exists or calls a "non-issue," there's no longer any credibility to his/her statement, so I usually don't bother to respond anymore. In case a newbie asks about it, I've bookmarked my post above about Holger's reports and his k-value self-test, and will simply post a link to that, and let him educate himself and draw his own conclusions.
As to the relationship btwn AFOV and RB, according to Henry, the smaller the AFOV, the less likely you will experience RB and the larger, the more likely. He said this in relation to the Doctor 8x56, which has very little pincushion, according to Arek's measurements, but ii would not likely produce RB because of its narrowish AFOV (50.4*). I'm not sure how magnification factors in that equation, but the Swaro 15x56 SLC has an EWA of 67.5* AFOV so that combined with its high k-value, you would expect it to show RB to those who are susceptible.
It's a working weekend for me, so I will let you carry on with the discussion in words and smilies. I hope you get to try an SF in the Land Down Under.
Btw, if you want to learn more about automobiles, there's a "Top Gear" Australia series on Aussie TV. In one episode, the three members of "Top Gear" UK invited the three-member Australian team to the UK to challenge them in various driving events, which left the Aussies with their kickers down, but the UK team cheated.
"Top Gear" UK vs. Australia
Brock
Last edited:
mooreorless
Well-known member
brocknroller
porromaniac
JAN: Jet Aircraft Noise
RB: Real Bullocks; only one man in this universum has not seen it by himself but is writing about it like everybody sees it. :h?:
If you're going try to "rag" on someone, at least use the correct English grammar so it makes sense.
Engles leren?
Brock
RB: Real Bullocks; only one man in this universum has not seen it by himself but is writing about it like everybody sees it. :h?:
If you're going try to "rag" on someone, at least use the correct English grammar so it makes sense.
Engles leren?
Brock
Last edited:
jan van daalen
Well-known member
LOL:t:
David Swain
Well-known member
I interrupt this important exchange to give a brief, non-technical report on some pre-production 8x42 SFs I was able to try out briefly at an optics fair today in the Boston area. The rep claimed they were one of only three pair in the country.
In short, these are spectacular, with a massive, clean (slightly blue), very bright view. The field correction appeared "flat" very much like my SEs, with very slight curvature and an almost imperceptible falloff in the outer 10%. The AFOV felt, no surprise, as expansive as my EIIs. Focuser was very smooth, no notching or grinding, but I did not fiddle around to figure out how "smart" the focus was. It was pretty fast, but not as fast as the Conquest HD (I liked the 8x32 very much). These are indeed long binoculars with substantial acreage for the biggest hands or fat gloves. Balance is indeed rearward, and focus wheel position allowed me to place my hands fairly forward. I don't use roofs, though, so I don't have much to compare the ergonomics with (they were, size-wise, as long as the SV 12x56, although nowhere near that bulky). Despite their apparent size, they felt light and managed very well. I liked the gray/black color scheme, too; very Teutonic!
When I was using them my EIIs felt, temporarily, foreign and archaic. Perhaps I was still smarting from the Nikon rep telling me that I had been "very patient" to stick with my EIIs, but the SFs shook my loyalty. These will always be out of my reach, but for many with the means they will certainly offer an alternative to the SV hegemony. About time.
Don't ask me to split technical hairs--I don't have experience with roofs.
Carry on.
David
In short, these are spectacular, with a massive, clean (slightly blue), very bright view. The field correction appeared "flat" very much like my SEs, with very slight curvature and an almost imperceptible falloff in the outer 10%. The AFOV felt, no surprise, as expansive as my EIIs. Focuser was very smooth, no notching or grinding, but I did not fiddle around to figure out how "smart" the focus was. It was pretty fast, but not as fast as the Conquest HD (I liked the 8x32 very much). These are indeed long binoculars with substantial acreage for the biggest hands or fat gloves. Balance is indeed rearward, and focus wheel position allowed me to place my hands fairly forward. I don't use roofs, though, so I don't have much to compare the ergonomics with (they were, size-wise, as long as the SV 12x56, although nowhere near that bulky). Despite their apparent size, they felt light and managed very well. I liked the gray/black color scheme, too; very Teutonic!
When I was using them my EIIs felt, temporarily, foreign and archaic. Perhaps I was still smarting from the Nikon rep telling me that I had been "very patient" to stick with my EIIs, but the SFs shook my loyalty. These will always be out of my reach, but for many with the means they will certainly offer an alternative to the SV hegemony. About time.
Don't ask me to split technical hairs--I don't have experience with roofs.
Carry on.
David
Last edited:
brocknroller
porromaniac
Only THREE SFs in the entire US of A and you got your hands on one? Consider yourself a Lucky Man.
"slightly blue" sounds familiar, I'd like to see the light transmission graph, but your comment gives a clue that like the FL, the SF might fall off sharply in the red. Did you notice this difference in comparing the SF to the EII, which peaks on the red side of the spectrum? The FL peaks in the green-yellow, but there's a spike in the blue, which is why some people describe the view as having a "slightly blue" tint.
Having seen the photo of the SF and SV EL side by side and the hand positions of the users, Zeiss seems to have finally made a roof for the Big Handed! Unfortunately, it's a bin for the Deep Pocketed Big Hander.
Did you pan with the SFs? If so, how did the smoothness of the panning compare to the EII? Did you notice any "roll" to the image as you panned?
I see "rolling BOWL" with the 8x30 EII (i.e., the image appears to roll over a negatively curved surface like a bowl) but not the 10x35 model. It's not too bad particularly while birding in close. I mostly notice it when panning along a distant tree line. I would imagine the 8x EII falls within the strong distortion band on Holger's chart, but not near the top where the ZR 7x36 ED2 would probably be.
I too am glad that the SF will provide competition for Swarovski. Maybe it will finally force the company to redesign their focusers. After all, if you're not a fanboy, why would you chose a bin with a "gritty" - "coarse" - "harder to turn in one direction" focuser if you can buy essentially the same bin with a wider FOV and very smooth focuser? For that last 10% sharpness where the image compresses at the edges? Given the wider FOV, you wouldn't even have that last 10% on the SV EL.
Too bad you didn't win a Prime ED, that would have been an interesting comparison. I'll let you know after the next winner is announced.
Thanks for posting your impressions. Going to buy TEN lottery tickets tomorrow.....
Btw, you could have easily found out how "smart" the focuser was by asking it to recite π to the 10th decimal place.
Brock
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Chosun Juan
Given to Fly
David,
Thanks for the hands-on feedback! One of only 3 in the country? and no production units yet?? I think we can take it that the original deadlines have been well and truly missed! I hope nothing is "Crook in Musswellbrook" !
It is interesting that you report a "slightly blue" colour cast to the SF, none of our other roving reporters saw that, which just goes to show again, the variance in our eyes and environmental conditions. Less surprising that Brock has asserted that the FL has a "spike in the blue" - say whaa Bro?! 'whatchu talkin' 'bout Willisss ....' :hippy: The transmission charts for the FL, and HT too for that matter, show a gentle hilltop-type curve, peaking in the green yellow --- or smack bang in the middle of the 'daylight' value of 555nm. There is no "spike" in the blue whatsoever! For a real "spike" in the blue check out the Allbino's tr% curve for the Swarovski 10x42 SV - now that is a real "spike" on the blue end of the typical Swaro tabletop-type curve ...... and no-one ever complains of a 'blue cast' to that - just balanced "life-like" colours as Tim for one has reported earlier. :smoke:
I think it is well and truly time for Zeiss to unleash the light transmission curve for the SF ...... :cat:
Chosun :gh:
David Swain
Well-known member
:gh:,
"Blue" in this case is relative to the very warm red bias of my Nikons. I think most observers would call the SF color pretty neutral.
I would hesitate to build narratives or extrapolate from a single observer's views (not that this will stop anyone). The "one of three in the country" line could be nonsense--calculated to create exclusivity--but even if true is poor evidence for production delays or other scenarios. The fact is, they had a lone 8x42 SF next to a stack of fat, lavish (and uninformative) SF catalogs. I will add nothing more beyond that in my brief experience it is a very compelling binocular, although I wish we'd had more than a garden to look at!
David
"Blue" in this case is relative to the very warm red bias of my Nikons. I think most observers would call the SF color pretty neutral.
I would hesitate to build narratives or extrapolate from a single observer's views (not that this will stop anyone). The "one of three in the country" line could be nonsense--calculated to create exclusivity--but even if true is poor evidence for production delays or other scenarios. The fact is, they had a lone 8x42 SF next to a stack of fat, lavish (and uninformative) SF catalogs. I will add nothing more beyond that in my brief experience it is a very compelling binocular, although I wish we'd had more than a garden to look at!
David
NDhunter
Experienced observer
Join the not-native Club, and get used to it
Brock adds to may words in a sentence and Lee likes them short:eat:
Jan
Jan:
I will go to you for an opinion as a seller, as Brock only adds his
opinion as someone without any experience, just a journalist with
a negative quest about Swarovski. An interesting search would be
his number of posts, in this direction. Swarovision, rolling ball,
and focuser. I am thinking it would be in the hundreds, in the past
4 years.
And I am not sure of his motive.
This is off topic, as it is a Zeiss thread.
Out of your customers of the Swarovision, how many have had issues
with the optics or the focuser ?
Jerry
opticoholic
Well-known member
Hello gentlemen (most of you really are gentlemen, both gender-wise and politeness-wise),
I attended the Wine Country Optics Fair today in Sonoma, CA, not far from where I live. I especially wanted to see the new Victory SF, but it's also just a fun event with most of the major optics brands represented. I'm mostly a long-time "lurker" on this forum, and I haven't read all of this enormous thread, but I'm certainly an optics/binocular "enthusiast" so I thought I'd add 1 more personal experience from someone who has actually held the SF. This will be entirely subjective. I'll just share what stands out most after I briefly tried out the SF. I'm rather long-winded so this will be a long post, and I'm going to freely ramble on a bit at the end about unrelated stuff at the event (stuff that should go under other sub-forums, oh well).
I'm a 7 or 8X guy, so I was pleased that they had the SF in 8X; it was the only one out on display and I didn't even ask about the 10X. The event was outside and the weather was clear and sunny--harsh, bright overhead at high noon when I arrived. Under these conditions with your pupils constricted down to a tiny dot, just about any binocular seems great. Oh well. I brought my main birding binocular for comparison, the Nikon EDG II 7X42. I need to post my experience with the EDG; I've had them well over a year but I've been lazy about posting a report. For now I'll just say that I like the EDG a LOT, but it still isn't my "last binocular" or total nirvana.
The first thing that stood out when I picked up the SF was the coatings on both ocular and objective: bright pinkish/orange, more so than any of the other binoculars on the Zeiss table, including the HT. Also more colorful than any of the many binoculars I own. Stephen Ingraham was there and he told me the color of the coatings means nothing, but I think it's pretty cool nonetheless.
Secondly, and I want to downplay this because they told me this was a pre-production model, one of only 2 or 3 in the country: There were 3 things that were a little "loose" or had some play: The twisting eyecup adjustment, the pull-out diopter adjustment, and the focus wheel all could have been a little tighter and more precise with less play. The eyecups had many intermediate "stopping points" which I appreciate (my EDG needs an extra 1 or 2, which is one thing I'll tell you if I ever review that bin). Anyway I reiterate, they assured me that they were planning to tighten up all 3 of these things on the final production model, so I probably should have omitted this paragraph. As for the "smart focus" wheel, apart from the fact that it had a slight bit of looseness before kicking in, it worked equally fine in both directions and it didn't seem too fast or too slow.
The view. When I looked through the binocular I was immediately impressed by how wide the field of view seemed, noticeably wider than my EDG (which is a 7X but has a slightly smaller field of view). It was very sharp and pleasing at normal birding distances. There was nothing at a great distance/infinity on which I could focus in the close confines of the event. Although I like the idea of having sharp edges out to the very edge of the field, I am less and less concerned with this specific trait, and more attentive to the total "gestalt" of how a bin feels and functions. The view seemed pretty uniform to me out to about the last 10 or 15% of the circle (area-wise). At the very edge of the circle the view suffered a tiny bit for me. It was not as sharp, but at least part of this was due to a slight distortion. I would not call this full-on "rolling ball." I tried panning back and forth and I did not notice any strong "rolling" behavior. The distortion was hard for me to detect it and did not bother me, but I was definitely able to see it. The eye-relief seemed perfect for me with my glasses and the eye cups all the way down. Easy to see the full circle and no black outs.
I basically love Swarovski binoculars. The way they feel so incredibly solid and precise in every way. I own the old SLC "neu" 7X42 and I use the ATS 80 HD scope (circa 2010). I tried the 8.5X Swarovision years ago when it first came out and I was *SO* close to keeping it but I ended up returning it. It was partly because I wish Swarovski would put out a full size 8X or 7X Swarovision in 42 or 50mm. But I also was able to detect a slightly soft spot part-way out toward the edge of the circle on my particular SV 8.5X sample (see this old long post). Anyway, I ended up returning my 8.5X within the 30 day return period and my primary birding binocular today is the EDG II 7X42.
Comparing the SF to my EDG 7X and to the 8.5X Swarovision (which I was easily able to walk over and try at the event). The SF field of view was noticably wider than the EDG or SV, but to my eyes, my EDG seemed a tad sharper in the center field, and so did the Swarovision. All 3 binoculars were excellent and I want to emphasize, I'm not sure my 50 year-old eyes can tell the difference (I wear glasses too). I'm just telling it like I saw it. The loss in sharpness at the edge of the field was approximately equal in all 3 binoculars, but I would say the loss in sharpness on the SF was most noticeably due to distortion, whereas in the SV the loss in sharpness was only very slightly due to distortion and on my EDG II there is almost no distortion that I can detect, maybe a touch of field curvature.
Summary and initial judgement. I wanted the SF to be clearly superior to my EDG or the Swarovision, but for me, my initial judgement is that I can't see a huge difference in the holistic overall impression. I will try them again and maybe after the final production model comes out I will change my mind. They're very nice, but I'd need to sell at least 2 bins if I were to get them and for now I don't feel tempted to do that. I'll probably keep waiting for something new like a new 7X35 Swarovision--how cool would that be... Or even better, a super premium modern porro prism! ...when hell freezes over. In the meantime, unfortunately, I will still be tempted by myriad other optics, cameras and lenses... oh me...
OFF topic, other stuff at the event:
For any birder living within an easy drive of this event, I can recommend it wholeheartedly. Besides the major sports optics companies, Lots of local birding and conservation organizations participate. My local Audubon chapter had a booth this year for the first time. The primary sponsoring organization, sonomabirding.com, has many other great presentations and events on their calendar.
Had a nice chat with Swaro Rep. Clay Taylor at the event. The coolest thing I will take away from that is when he showed me the high speed slow-motion video of birds taken with an *iPhone.* Holy crap! I've mostly been working with my DSLR lately, but I gotta get back into my digiscoping and start using my iPhone with my Swaro scope when I'm birding, just for fun if nothing else. I'll try to find an example/link of one of these phone-scoped slo-mo videos on-line, or follow up on the digiscoping forum with what I'm able to do myself... I'm due for an iphone upgrade/contract renewal.
I asked Clay how likely is it that Swarovski will release an 8X50 or 8X56 Swarovision or a 42mm Swarovision with less than 8.5X magnification. He said very low. He said 7X bins just don't sell anymore. I also asked him how likely it would be that Swarovski would release a new more modern porro prism binocular. Again he said not very likely at all, although he told me he would love to see it.
I recall the day when the 7X35 porro was one of the most common bins around, and I think it's sad how few 7X or high quality porro prism binoculars are being sold these days. Almost none at all were to be seen at the event. I had a word with Mike Freiberg from Nikon and he confirmed that the SE is truly dead. Buy them up now you guys... I wouldn't be surprised if you can resell them for a quick $200 profit in a year. I looked through a $99 Kowa YF porro and I have to say, the center-field sharpness probably equaled or surpassed most of the oodles of Chinese roofs on the tables costing 3-4 times more. Same thing I thought last year when I tried the Opticron porros.
One last cool thing, especially for any of you with kids: Check out the Pentax "Papilio" reverse porro prism binoculars for about $100. The objective lenses actually get closer together as you approach the close focus limit of ~2 feet. As I tried these out looking at honey bees on nearby flowers, they reminded me of expensive binocular microscopes I used in college biology labs. Way cool!
Dave
I attended the Wine Country Optics Fair today in Sonoma, CA, not far from where I live. I especially wanted to see the new Victory SF, but it's also just a fun event with most of the major optics brands represented. I'm mostly a long-time "lurker" on this forum, and I haven't read all of this enormous thread, but I'm certainly an optics/binocular "enthusiast" so I thought I'd add 1 more personal experience from someone who has actually held the SF. This will be entirely subjective. I'll just share what stands out most after I briefly tried out the SF. I'm rather long-winded so this will be a long post, and I'm going to freely ramble on a bit at the end about unrelated stuff at the event (stuff that should go under other sub-forums, oh well).
I'm a 7 or 8X guy, so I was pleased that they had the SF in 8X; it was the only one out on display and I didn't even ask about the 10X. The event was outside and the weather was clear and sunny--harsh, bright overhead at high noon when I arrived. Under these conditions with your pupils constricted down to a tiny dot, just about any binocular seems great. Oh well. I brought my main birding binocular for comparison, the Nikon EDG II 7X42. I need to post my experience with the EDG; I've had them well over a year but I've been lazy about posting a report. For now I'll just say that I like the EDG a LOT, but it still isn't my "last binocular" or total nirvana.
The first thing that stood out when I picked up the SF was the coatings on both ocular and objective: bright pinkish/orange, more so than any of the other binoculars on the Zeiss table, including the HT. Also more colorful than any of the many binoculars I own. Stephen Ingraham was there and he told me the color of the coatings means nothing, but I think it's pretty cool nonetheless.
Secondly, and I want to downplay this because they told me this was a pre-production model, one of only 2 or 3 in the country: There were 3 things that were a little "loose" or had some play: The twisting eyecup adjustment, the pull-out diopter adjustment, and the focus wheel all could have been a little tighter and more precise with less play. The eyecups had many intermediate "stopping points" which I appreciate (my EDG needs an extra 1 or 2, which is one thing I'll tell you if I ever review that bin). Anyway I reiterate, they assured me that they were planning to tighten up all 3 of these things on the final production model, so I probably should have omitted this paragraph. As for the "smart focus" wheel, apart from the fact that it had a slight bit of looseness before kicking in, it worked equally fine in both directions and it didn't seem too fast or too slow.
The view. When I looked through the binocular I was immediately impressed by how wide the field of view seemed, noticeably wider than my EDG (which is a 7X but has a slightly smaller field of view). It was very sharp and pleasing at normal birding distances. There was nothing at a great distance/infinity on which I could focus in the close confines of the event. Although I like the idea of having sharp edges out to the very edge of the field, I am less and less concerned with this specific trait, and more attentive to the total "gestalt" of how a bin feels and functions. The view seemed pretty uniform to me out to about the last 10 or 15% of the circle (area-wise). At the very edge of the circle the view suffered a tiny bit for me. It was not as sharp, but at least part of this was due to a slight distortion. I would not call this full-on "rolling ball." I tried panning back and forth and I did not notice any strong "rolling" behavior. The distortion was hard for me to detect it and did not bother me, but I was definitely able to see it. The eye-relief seemed perfect for me with my glasses and the eye cups all the way down. Easy to see the full circle and no black outs.
I basically love Swarovski binoculars. The way they feel so incredibly solid and precise in every way. I own the old SLC "neu" 7X42 and I use the ATS 80 HD scope (circa 2010). I tried the 8.5X Swarovision years ago when it first came out and I was *SO* close to keeping it but I ended up returning it. It was partly because I wish Swarovski would put out a full size 8X or 7X Swarovision in 42 or 50mm. But I also was able to detect a slightly soft spot part-way out toward the edge of the circle on my particular SV 8.5X sample (see this old long post). Anyway, I ended up returning my 8.5X within the 30 day return period and my primary birding binocular today is the EDG II 7X42.
Comparing the SF to my EDG 7X and to the 8.5X Swarovision (which I was easily able to walk over and try at the event). The SF field of view was noticably wider than the EDG or SV, but to my eyes, my EDG seemed a tad sharper in the center field, and so did the Swarovision. All 3 binoculars were excellent and I want to emphasize, I'm not sure my 50 year-old eyes can tell the difference (I wear glasses too). I'm just telling it like I saw it. The loss in sharpness at the edge of the field was approximately equal in all 3 binoculars, but I would say the loss in sharpness on the SF was most noticeably due to distortion, whereas in the SV the loss in sharpness was only very slightly due to distortion and on my EDG II there is almost no distortion that I can detect, maybe a touch of field curvature.
Summary and initial judgement. I wanted the SF to be clearly superior to my EDG or the Swarovision, but for me, my initial judgement is that I can't see a huge difference in the holistic overall impression. I will try them again and maybe after the final production model comes out I will change my mind. They're very nice, but I'd need to sell at least 2 bins if I were to get them and for now I don't feel tempted to do that. I'll probably keep waiting for something new like a new 7X35 Swarovision--how cool would that be... Or even better, a super premium modern porro prism! ...when hell freezes over. In the meantime, unfortunately, I will still be tempted by myriad other optics, cameras and lenses... oh me...
OFF topic, other stuff at the event:
For any birder living within an easy drive of this event, I can recommend it wholeheartedly. Besides the major sports optics companies, Lots of local birding and conservation organizations participate. My local Audubon chapter had a booth this year for the first time. The primary sponsoring organization, sonomabirding.com, has many other great presentations and events on their calendar.
Had a nice chat with Swaro Rep. Clay Taylor at the event. The coolest thing I will take away from that is when he showed me the high speed slow-motion video of birds taken with an *iPhone.* Holy crap! I've mostly been working with my DSLR lately, but I gotta get back into my digiscoping and start using my iPhone with my Swaro scope when I'm birding, just for fun if nothing else. I'll try to find an example/link of one of these phone-scoped slo-mo videos on-line, or follow up on the digiscoping forum with what I'm able to do myself... I'm due for an iphone upgrade/contract renewal.
I asked Clay how likely is it that Swarovski will release an 8X50 or 8X56 Swarovision or a 42mm Swarovision with less than 8.5X magnification. He said very low. He said 7X bins just don't sell anymore. I also asked him how likely it would be that Swarovski would release a new more modern porro prism binocular. Again he said not very likely at all, although he told me he would love to see it.
I recall the day when the 7X35 porro was one of the most common bins around, and I think it's sad how few 7X or high quality porro prism binoculars are being sold these days. Almost none at all were to be seen at the event. I had a word with Mike Freiberg from Nikon and he confirmed that the SE is truly dead. Buy them up now you guys... I wouldn't be surprised if you can resell them for a quick $200 profit in a year. I looked through a $99 Kowa YF porro and I have to say, the center-field sharpness probably equaled or surpassed most of the oodles of Chinese roofs on the tables costing 3-4 times more. Same thing I thought last year when I tried the Opticron porros.
One last cool thing, especially for any of you with kids: Check out the Pentax "Papilio" reverse porro prism binoculars for about $100. The objective lenses actually get closer together as you approach the close focus limit of ~2 feet. As I tried these out looking at honey bees on nearby flowers, they reminded me of expensive binocular microscopes I used in college biology labs. Way cool!
Dave
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Dave,
Nice report!
Chosun, I've mentioned more than once that I find the Swaro EVSV and SLCs generally just on the blue side of neutral making pale tan, straw or buff coloured plumage whiter than it is. Occasionally I've seen the blue content totally over-cooked, and the whole view looked washed out, but I'd be inclined to put that down to a bad batch rather than standard issue.
I realise this was addressed to Jan, but at BirdFair last year I tried probably a dozen ELSVs and SLCs and I can't remember the exact number now but over half had a gritty focus. Some I could live with others were seriously annoying. The worst I've found was on a SLC neu on demo elsewhere, where the scraping was audible.
The RB on the ELSV 8.5x42 to my eyes doesn't seem to be as bad to me now as it did three years ago so maybe something has changed as others have suggested. Perhaps the flip side of that is the last few I've checked were definitely not as sharp as the SLCs I compared them too. In spite of these comments I still rather like the ELSV 8x32.
I didn't spend a lot of time with the new SF at BirdFair, and I wouldn't care to comment how it compares to the Swaros or others. I found the view sharp, I saw no moustache distortion and I could find no RB at the time, I thought the colour appeared neutral, the focus was smooth, and I found the balance with the more forward hand positioning rather nice. I don't think the balance point was actually further back as is claimed and couldn't work out what was 'smart' about the focus. All in all a very nice binocular. A side by side would be interesting, but can't envisage an opportunity soon.
David
Nice report!
Chosun, I've mentioned more than once that I find the Swaro EVSV and SLCs generally just on the blue side of neutral making pale tan, straw or buff coloured plumage whiter than it is. Occasionally I've seen the blue content totally over-cooked, and the whole view looked washed out, but I'd be inclined to put that down to a bad batch rather than standard issue.
I realise this was addressed to Jan, but at BirdFair last year I tried probably a dozen ELSVs and SLCs and I can't remember the exact number now but over half had a gritty focus. Some I could live with others were seriously annoying. The worst I've found was on a SLC neu on demo elsewhere, where the scraping was audible.
The RB on the ELSV 8.5x42 to my eyes doesn't seem to be as bad to me now as it did three years ago so maybe something has changed as others have suggested. Perhaps the flip side of that is the last few I've checked were definitely not as sharp as the SLCs I compared them too. In spite of these comments I still rather like the ELSV 8x32.
I didn't spend a lot of time with the new SF at BirdFair, and I wouldn't care to comment how it compares to the Swaros or others. I found the view sharp, I saw no moustache distortion and I could find no RB at the time, I thought the colour appeared neutral, the focus was smooth, and I found the balance with the more forward hand positioning rather nice. I don't think the balance point was actually further back as is claimed and couldn't work out what was 'smart' about the focus. All in all a very nice binocular. A side by side would be interesting, but can't envisage an opportunity soon.
David
Victory SF Thanks
Good morning David, thanks for stopping by our booth at the Mass Audubon event. We had a great time. (I was there also.) Thanks for taking the time to work with them. No nonsense, we only have 3 in the US right now to work with. Sorry if you did not find the brochure informative but hopefuly the hands on of one of the pre-production models was worth your while. Hope to be up again soon. All the Best, Rich Moncrief
Good morning David, thanks for stopping by our booth at the Mass Audubon event. We had a great time. (I was there also.) Thanks for taking the time to work with them. No nonsense, we only have 3 in the US right now to work with. Sorry if you did not find the brochure informative but hopefuly the hands on of one of the pre-production models was worth your while. Hope to be up again soon. All the Best, Rich Moncrief
David Swain
Well-known member
Hi Rich,
I did not realize that was you! 3 it is (and corroborated by the other Dave). I was very surprised to see the SFs there, frankly, and I wish I had spent more time with them (I was rushing off to a hawk watch). The brochure is indeed lovely; the kind of information some of us want (glass types, cut-away diagrams, lab specs) just don't ever make their way into marketing materials. It is hard to know, for example, what 92% light transmission really means without a plotted curve. They were certainly bright!
Ultimately, the SF wasn't what I was really looking at--you might recall I spent nearly all my time looking through the 8x32HDs. I think they may replace my fussy Nikon SEs. Thanks for the extended look through your personal pair!
When might production arrive to fulfill SF pre-orders?
thanks for coming to our little optics fair,
David
