Raptor survey as a work, what kind of bins? (1 Viewer)

[Royfinn]

What kind of bins would be good for staring the sky for 8 hours straight trying to find and identify (few) raptors, find their fly altitude and direction etc. with the help of finnstick? Lots of staring of empty sky and only few birds, because survey is propably not made in "good" birding places.

• 8x or 10x or maybe 12x
• I guess ease of view would be important.
• Weigh (Nikon M7 8x30 feels too light at 450g, my 800g Vikings are not too heavy with finnstick).
• 32, 42 or 50mm
• Not very flimsy

I can not afford NL pure. Conquest 8x32 and 10x42 came first to mind, MHG 8x42 or 10x42 might be good size and weight.

 

[dwatsonbirder]

If you are talking about conducting standard VP surveys, then a binocular with a wide field of view to enable accurate recording in height bands is best, my Zeiss 7x42 are perfect for this, though admittedly there are a limited suite of species on most sites I work on - a telescope can always be used to confirm ID if needed.

 

[Royfinn]

If you are talking about conducting standard VP surveys, then a binocular with a wide field of view to enable accurate recording in height bands is best, my Zeiss 7x42 are perfect for this, though admittedly there are a limited suite of species on most sites I work on - a telescope can always be used to confirm ID if needed.

I am not sure if I am hired or what kind surveys will be, but I guess that it's surveys in planned windmill areas "middle of nowhere".

 

[Binocollector]

I'd pick one depending on the average distance. 500 m or more -- a 7x will not be that great. More like 10x or even 12x. If 7x is sufficient -- something with a wide FoV. An old EWA 7x35 porro (10° or 11°) or a Kowa BDII 6.5x32 maybe?

 

[William Lewis]

Kite 16x42 APC. High mag image stabilised for distant targets, waterproof, ball park the same price as the conquests.

 

[Maljunulo]

Viewing backlit objects is a challenge, both for optics and for the human eye.

Choose carefully, and not by price alone. Watch out for things the spec sheets don’t talk about.

Aberration control is very important for your application.

This is my opinion, and it’s worth exactly how much you are paying for it.

 

[Binocollector]

Aberration control is very important for your application.

Very good point! CA can be annoying to no end when watching raptors against the sky.
The Meopta Meopro HD 8x32 is pretty good at supressing CA and has a nice and wide field with 8.3°. Also a super fast and smooth focuser.

 

[james holdsworth]

I am not sure if I am hired or what kind surveys will be, but I guess that it's surveys in planned windmill areas "middle of nowhere".

I did those exact surveys for years and found a typical 8x42 was fine, with scope set up for problematic birds. We needed to record heights..below blade, in blade, above blade, so decent field of view helps.

 

[[email protected]]

I would use a Canon 12x36 IS III. What I have found when looking for raptors with a 12x stabilized view, I can see raptors from distances that are not even visible with a regular 7x or 8x binocular. Plus, when I do spot them, they are way easier to ID with the higher magnification and steady view. Often times when I scan the sky with my Canon 12x36 IS III, I will pick up eagles that were not even barely visible with an 8x and I can even tell if they are a Bald Eagle or Golden Eagle with the much greater detail I get with the stabilized view. IS binoculars are excellent for plane spotting for the same reason. A lot of times I can make out the numbering on a plane, whereas, with a traditional 7x or 8x, I can barely see the plane.

 

[jafritten]

I'd look for a pair with low CA and comfortable eyecups. On a finnstick, I'd try a 10x first, possibly x42 or even x50 which would give you a comfortable 5mm exit pupil.

A Swarovski SLC 10x42 (now Kahles) perhaps?

What's wrong with your Vikings?

 

[Royfinn]

I did those exact surveys for years and found a typical 8x42 was fine, with scope set up for problematic birds. We needed to record heights..below blade, in blade, above blade, so decent field of view helps.

Thats useful information, thanks!

 

[Royfinn]

I would use a Canon 12x36 IS III. What I have found when looking for raptors with a 12x stabilized view, I can see raptors from distances that are not even visible with a regular 7x or 8x binocular. Plus, when I do spot them, they are way easier to ID with the higher magnification and steady view. Often times when I scan the sky with my Canon 12x36 IS III, I will pick up eagles that were not even visible with an 8x and I can even tell if they are a Bald Eagle or Golden Eagle with the much greater detail I get with the stabilized view. IS binoculars are excellent for plane spotting for the same reason. A lot of times I can make out the numbering on a plane, whereas, with a traditional 7x or 8x, I can barely see the plane.

Interesting suggestion. My friend has those bins.

 

[PYRTLE]

I'm with James, an 8 x 42 is a great all-rounder though I've noticed many individuals involved with raptor surveying ( sky watching ) tended to use a x 10.

 

[Royfinn]

I'd look for a pair with low CA and comfortable eyecups. On a finnstick, I'd try a 10x first, possibly x42 or even x50 which would give you a comfortable 5mm exit pupil.

A Swarovski SLC 10x42 (now Kahles) perhaps?

What's wrong with your Vikings?

I am giving thought to 50mm bins. My Viking pro 10x42 bins has diopter malfunction (posted in another thread).

 

[Prestdj]

meopta meostar 8 x 42 built like a tank so heavy but stunning optics for the price

 

[Hotspur]

As someone who runs lots of these surveys, I'd agree with the comments above but one thing that hasnt been touched on is low light performance. There is a requirement to do surveys at dusk and dawn and these are key activity periods so you want something with good light gathering. My default choice would be Zeiss Conquest 8x42.

 

[Binocollector]

Often times when I scan the sky with my Canon 12x36 IS III, I will pick up eagles that were not even visible with an 8x and I can even tell if they are a Bald Eagle or Golden Eagle with the much greater detail I get with the stabilized view.

I have my doubts about that statement. If you couldn't even spot them with an 8x you almost certainly can't ID them with 12x, IS or no IS. The difference between 8x and 12x is not big enough. Unless you ID them just by flight pattern. But even with IS you will not see much details when they are really that far away that you cannot see them AT ALL in an 8x bino.
Just testing this as there are a lot of birds in the sky currently here and the ones that are that far away that I can barely see them with an 8x are not really much bigger with a 12x. That wouldn't change with IS. Maybe if I get out my 18x50IS the difference in magnification would be big enough.
I like IS as much as the next guy but it really isn't the "silver bullet" that some people think it is.

 

[Royfinn]

I have my doubts about that statement. If you couldn't even spot them with an 8x you almost certainly can't ID them with 12x, IS or no IS. The difference between 8x and 12x is not big enough. Unless you ID them just by flight pattern. But even with IS you will not see much details when they are really that far away that you cannot see them AT ALL in an 8x bino.
Just testing this as there are a lot of birds in the sky currently here and the ones that are that far away that I can barely see them with an 8x are not really much bigger with a 12x. That wouldn't change with IS. Maybe if I get out my 18x50IS the difference in magnification would be big enough.
I like IS as much as the next guy but it really isn't the "silver bullet" that some people think it is.

I haven't seen anyone here using IS bins in raptor watch - main reason for that might be that here are not that many raptors and when we see some, they are typically several kilometers away, so scope is usually needed and even that is often not enough. So, watching sky 8 hours with IS bins waiting for some raptors is too much fuss and you still need the scope. (Some of the best raptor identifiers here use 12x bins, mostly to find birds far away.) But maybe 12x IS bins might work, if one is ready to put in the effort needed, but if I would do raptor watch as work, I would propably need as easy equipment as possible.

 

[Binocollector]

Another point to consider -- the batteries will probably not last 8 hrs (but then again, you don't need to activate the IS for scanning the sky -- only for ID).
Unless you spend 6 grand on a Zeiss 20x60S. Or a lot less on a Zomz 16x50 or 20x50 mechanically stabilized bino. But these things are heavy. The finnstick would still be needed for using them for longer periods of time, I guess.

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[OspreyZB]

The Meopta Meostar 12x50 HD would be a great choice for that type of work. Excellent center sharpness, superb CA control, plenty of power for spotting very distant raptors, rock solid build, fairly priced (especially on the used market). I think they would check all the boxes.